2012 Conventions; Tampa & Charlotte

[deep]

Atlas Shrugged - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

[INDY500]

‘God,’ ‘Jerusalem,’ and the DNC - Dennis Prager - National Review Online

The most important event at either national convention was the “vote” taken by the Democratic delegates on a last-minute resolution to reinsert the words “God” and “Jerusalem” into the Democratic-party platform.

Regarding God: Since Karl Marx, the aim of the Left, everywhere on earth, has been a godless society. And the Democratic party has evolved over the last half century from a liberal party into a leftist one. So much so that it is now indistinguishable from any of the leftist parties in Western Europe.

Yes, Franklin D. Roosevelt was a left-wing president — as concerned the size of the state and its role in the economy. That is of great importance, of course. But an ever-expanding state is only half of the Left’s agenda. A thoroughly secular society is the other half. And in that regard, Franklin Roosevelt was no man of the Left. He regularly spoke of the need to defend and preserve “Christian civilization” and of the centrality of the Bible and religion to American life.

Here are three representative statements by FDR:

We guard against the forces of anti-Christian aggression. (Madison Square Garden, October 28, 1940)

On this day — this American holiday — we are celebrating the rights of free laboring men and women. The preservation of these rights is vitally important now, not only to us who enjoy them — but to the whole future of Christian civilization. (Labor Day, September 1, 1941)

The world is too small to provide adequate “living room” for both Hitler and God. In proof of that, the Nazis have now announced their plan for enforcing their new German, pagan religion all over the world — a plan by which the Holy Bible and the Cross of Mercy would be displaced by Mein Kampf and the swastika and the naked sword. (State of the Union Address, January 6, 1942)

However, by the mid-1960s, to speak of militantly atheistic Communism’s threat to Judeo-Christian civilization the way Roosevelt spoke of the Nazi threat to it was to invite left-wing mockery. “Godless Communism” was dismissed as laughable.

So it is not surprising that whereas previous Democratic-party platforms all contained references to God, the 2012 party-platform committee voted to remove any such reference.

The 2008 Democratic-party platforms had included this sentence:

We need a government that stands up for the hopes, values, and interests of working people and gives everyone willing to work hard the chance to make the most of their God-given potential.

Obviously, the removal from this sentence of only the word “God-given” was deliberate. The question is, Why was it excised?

The answer is simple: America’s Left wants a godless society here in the United States, just as Europe’s Left has created such a society there — and the Democratic party is run by the Left. To anyone who watched or simply heard the “vote” among those on the floor of the convention, it was as clear as day that at least half the Democratic delegates wanted the word “God-given” and the reference to Jerusalem as Israel’s capital to stay out of the party platform.

Democrats and liberals respond that the charge that the Left aims to establish a godless America is a calumny because millions of Democrats believe in God. Indeed, the delegate who introduced the resolution to restore the excised words, former Ohio governor Ted Strickland, introduced himself as an ordained minister of the United Methodist Church.

But this response is a non sequitur. The fact that tens of millions of Democrats and liberals (though relatively few leftists) believe in God is unrelated to the fact — I repeat, fact — that the Left wants a godless society.

Why, then, do many God-fearing Americans support a party and movement dedicated to removing God from as much of American life as possible? Because they are naïve about the Left.

The removal of the reference to Jerusalem as Israel’s capital was equally revealing and significant. The Left thinks that Israel is just as responsible for the Middle East conflict as the Palestinians and other Arabs and Muslims are. Indeed, the Left often sees Israel as more responsible for this conflict. In their view, it follows that the United States must therefore be scrupulously neutral between Israel and its enemies — as if there is a moral symmetry between them.

And finally, the convention vote itself was revealing. The blatant lie — enacted in front of a national audience, no less — that two- thirds of the delegates voted aye for the resolution was a classic example of how the Left behaves when in power.

In his address to the Democratic convention, former president Bill Clinton noted that even a broken clock is right twice a day.

What is true for a broken clock, however, is not true for a broken moral compass.

I'm telling you, this "they denied God three times" meme is quietly spoke about in fly-over country and will be on voters minds in Nov. It already has cost Obama any chance at North Carolina.

[deep]

queers cost Obama N C

[Moonlit_Angel]

Right, 'cause not wanting to make a big production out of mentioning God every five minutes clearly means that they want everyone to become atheists and reject anything spiritual . And as for those on the left who DO have some level of religion, some of whom are-gasp-CHRISTIAN, even, how do you explain them?

Come on already, aren't we done with the whole, "If you're not religious this is a bad thing" attitude? I noted a few pages back the way they handled that was dumb, but rest assured very few people, if any, on the left want a "godless society". All we suggest is that nobody try and force their religion on other people and that people shouldn't rely solely on religion for lawmaking purposes, no matter which religion it is (I guarantee you many of the very same people who think Christianity should be the basis for our laws would be, and are, freaking out at the idea of a Muslim using their religion to make laws. Isn't that one of the big worries the religious right have about Obama, after all, that he's a secret Muslim trying to impose his religion on everyone? Isn't that why some states have made rulings regarding sharia law?).

You can be as religious as you please and live your life by whatever faith you so choose. It matters none to me, and it doesn't matter to most others, either. Just don't push it on other people. This is really, truly not that difficult a concept to understand.

And this is coming from someone who lives in "flyover country", too, thank you.

[PhilsFan]

Originally Posted by INDY500

‘God,’ ‘Jerusalem,’ and the DNC - Dennis Prager - National Review Online


I'm telling you, this "they denied God three times" meme is quietly spoke about in fly-over country and will be on voters minds in Nov. It already has cost Obama any chance at North Carolina.

This is patently absurd. The goal is not a Godless society. The goal is a government that doesn't sponsor religion. You know the difference, but you don't agree that it exists because you are trying to accuse the left of the dog whistles, without a hint of irony.

[trojanchick99]

As a truly godless heathen from New Sodom AKA Los Angeles, I was happy they initially took the word God out of the platform. I dream of the day the US is a secularly governed country where people's religious beliefs aren't foisted upon me.

[Irvine511]

Originally Posted by INDY500

I'm telling you, this "they denied God three times" meme is quietly spoke about in fly-over country and will be on voters minds in Nov. It already has cost Obama any chance at North Carolina.

the superstitious folk in flyover country do realize Hussein Obama told the party to put those things back in, right?

[BonosSaint]

Originally Posted by INDY500

‘God,’ ‘Jerusalem,’ and the DNC - Dennis Prager - National Review Online


I'm telling you, this "they denied God three times" meme is quietly spoke about in fly-over country and will be on voters minds in Nov. It already has cost Obama any chance at North Carolina.

Ah, but he who denied him thrice became his rock.

[MrsSpringsteen]

I've never heard of "flyover country" What the heck does that mean?

We have flyovers here too, we just do it on giant broomsticks.

Apparently some in the GOP are panicking that Obama got a 6 point jump in some polls after the convention. Donald Trump said that the GOP convention wasn't good and that they better get to work. And he is the authority.

[INDY500]

Originally Posted by BonosSaint

Ah, but he who denied him thrice became his rock.

That's where the analogy falls apart. Good point nevertheless.

[INDY500]

Originally Posted by PhilsFan

This is patently absurd. The goal is not a Godless society. The goal is a government that doesn't sponsor religion. You know the difference, but you don't agree that it exists because you are trying to accuse the left of the dog whistles, without a hint of irony.

See the post after yours. I respect Trojanchick for at least being honest.

[INDY500]

Originally Posted by Irvine511

the superstitious folk in flyover country do realize Hussein Obama told the party to put those things back in, right?

He approved it's removal and then scurried to repair the damage. If he wins he'll have "more flexibility" after the election to thumb his nose at God-fearing and pro-Israel Democrats.

[U2DMfan]

Flyover country - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Originally Posted by Moonlit_Angel

And this is coming from someone who lives in "flyover country", too, thank you.

Me three...I think most people that care about such things were never going to vote for Obama anyway.

[Diemen]

Originally Posted by INDY500

See the post after yours. I respect Trojanchick for at least being honest.

And somehow Trojanchick is more representative of democrats because... ?

[Moonlit_Angel]

I really wish people would stop getting so obsessed over how much God is mentioned in politics. You can talk about him all you want and invoke his name as often as you please, doesn't automatically prove you're more religious than someone else or that you're more equipped to run things or whatever.

Besides that, didn't Jesus have some thoughts on not being showy with one's faith?

[trojanchick99]

Yeah, one registered Democrat does not a party make. I recognize that I am in the minority in this country. I stand by my belief that religion should be kept out of government, but I have no issue with people practicing whatever religion they believe. Hell, I don't care if there's a Christmas/Holiday tree in the White House as that particular holiday has become very secular.

I also think the people who booed the inclusion of God and Jerusalem into the platform were disrespectful.

The Democratic party is extremely diverse. There are Christians, Muslims, Hindus, Jews, Buddhists, Atheists, Pagans, and well probably many other religions as well. I embrace that diversity. I just don't want the religious beliefs of one group to infringe on my rights. How upset would you be if a Hindu decided to ban beef? Or a Jew banned pork for everyone? This is how I feel when the religious right try to legislate my uterus and forbid people I love from marrying the people they love.

[Irvine511]

Originally Posted by INDY500

He approved it's removal and then scurried to repair the damage. If he wins he'll have "more flexibility" after the election to thumb his nose at God-fearing and pro-Israel Democrats.

[iron yuppie]

Originally Posted by trojanchick99

Yeah, one registered Democrat does not a party make. I recognize that I am in the minority in this country. I stand by my belief that religion should be kept out of government, but I have no issue with people practicing whatever religion they believe.

I think that this is the perspective of most on the left, or at least those on the left with whom I regularly speak. I do not know a single person who identifies as liberal who also has said that he or she wants religion abolished or removed from American culture life. Yet somehow there are circles in the right who for whatever reason see the left like this:

Obama: 'Help Us Destroy Jesus And Start A New Age Of Liberal Darkness' | The Onion - America's Finest News Source

The problem to me is when "freedom of religion" becomes equated with everyone needing to celebrate that religion or acquiesce to its moral precepts.

[indra]

Originally Posted by INDY500

See the post after yours. I respect Trojanchick for at least being honest.

Originally Posted by trojanchick99

As a truly godless heathen from New Sodom AKA Los Angeles, I was happy they initially took the word God out of the platform. I dream of the day the US is a secularly governed country where people's religious beliefs aren't foisted upon me.

A "secularly governed country where people's religious beliefs aren't foisted upon me" is not a "godless society" it is merely a secularly governed country. Nothing in that says no one can believe in god...just that the nation is governed in a secular as opposed to a religious manner. That isn't really that hard to comprehend, is it?

[cobl04]

Originally Posted by indra

A "secularly governed country where people's religious beliefs aren't foisted upon me" is not a "godless society" it is merely a secularly governed country. Nothing in that says no one can believe in god...just that the nation is governed in a secular as opposed to a religious manner. That isn't really that hard to comprehend, is it?

and nothing is going to isolate atheist voters quicker than bible bashing. Thank goodness I live in a secular country. Now if only we could get rid of our pesky British overlords, I'd be happy.