2 British soldiers, police officer shot dead in Northern Ireland

[financeguy]

Two soldiers shot dead in Ulster attack - Times Online

 

[LittleBono]

Fuckin hell, dont tell me all that crap is starting up again

 

[financeguy]

I would be suspicious about this event. Obviously, if it indeed dissident republicans, I condemn it.

 

[Down Under]

This is not good...........

 

[MissVelvetDress_75]

 

[LJT]

I would be suspicious about this event. Obviously, if it indeed dissident republicans, I condemn it.

Who else is it really going to be? As much as I would like to think it was loyalists of any sort as a republican framing of sorts (for that matter I just wish it hadn't happened), it's just not something they would really do.

 

[financeguy]

Who else is it really going to be? As much as I would like to think it was loyalists of any sort as a republican framing of sorts (for that matter I just wish it hadn't happened), it's just not something they would really do.

That's not what I'm hinting at. As always, it is important to examine who might benefit.



http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...s-Whitehall-death-soldiers-quits-disgust.html

http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/orde-in-special-forces-storm-14217087.html

 

[HyperU2]

Don't count out the Islamists.

 

[LJT]

That's not what I'm hinting at. As always, it is important to examine who might benefit.

I'm not entirely sure what your getting at, if not republicans, loyalists....?

Who benefits other than giving the DUP more bargaining power on the policing board? After Marty McGuinness' stupid comments the other day on the SRR. Gives the British government reason to maintain bases there...but you wouldn't be suggesting they did something this daft?

Islamic wise not there sort of attack, they like people to know more than anyone else it's them.

 

[LittleBono]

Who else is it really going to be? As much as I would like to think it was loyalists of any sort as a republican framing of sorts (for that matter I just wish it hadn't happened), it's just not something they would really do.

I dont think that is the case. It would be pretty sad (on the loyalists part) if it was. I think its just dissident republicans fucking up any sense of normality in n.ireland. I just hope this isnt the start of an outbreak of this kind of thing .. thats the last thing n.ireland needs

 

[HyperU2]

They've done some drive by shootings in Iraq but I doubt they'd tread on Ireland. Brits were stepping up their activity it seems.

 

[LJT]

I dont think that is the case. It would be pretty sad (on the loyalists part) if it was. I think its just dissident republicans fucking up any sense of normality in n.ireland. I just hope this isnt the start of an outbreak of this kind of thing .. thats the last thing n.ireland needs

The other night in West Belfast in the street next to where I live when at home, a guy was shot...not sure why at this stage, haven't actually heard much more about it.

 

[financeguy]

Gives the British government reason to maintain bases there...but you wouldn't be suggesting they did something this daft?

The British government is not necessarily a single entity. There are various government entities, some competing with each other. What may seem daft to the general public may precisely serve the hidden agenda, if there is one.

 

[financeguy]

Also, most dissident republicans' activities have been inept. That they suddenly pull off this Tet offensive style coup is...rather odd.


Create the problem, then offer the solution to deal with the problem - the modus operandi of intelligence services.

 

[LJT]

So you're suggesting it's a staged thing? Man I know there are dodgy parts to the army and what not, but it's a really long shot your going with. It has Republican written all over it, Occams Razor. If any faction in the government, army,wanted to stir the pot they would have done a good while ago, since things have in general been going fine for a bit now.

They try all the time, they are bound to pull something off inevitably, they evolve like any bacteria. I could drive up to that base and carry out this sort of attack...take a bit of detour back to my granny's after it as well.

 

[LJT]

I don't get how this helps the intelligence services in that they weren't able to stop it happening...it makes them look inept.

No Sinn Fein comment yet...Big Gerry must still be in bed.

 

[financeguy]

I don't get how this helps the intelligence services in that they weren't able to stop it happening...it makes them look inept.

Four British soldiers went to a van to collect some pizza. Just like that. That's too inept to believe.

 

[LJT]

I find it inept enough to believe.

 

[LittleBono]

The other night in West Belfast in the street next to where I live when at home, a guy was shot...not sure why at this stage, haven't actually heard much more about it.

That sucks. Belshaft seems to be getting worse with that kind of thing, just glad i dont live there . I would hate for n.ireland to go back to the way it was years ago, things are somewhat better now. Well they were until this happened.

 

[pgv]

This story seems like quite a bolt from the blue, if it is IRA related. Perhaps I was wrong to think it but I thought episodes like this belonged very much to the 90's. I didn't know the IRA were still militantly active?

 

[Vincent Vega]

Now the Real IRA has admitted to being behind it.

The Provisional IRA has stopped fighting. The Continuity IRA has never officially agreed to the peace agreement and the cease fire, the Real IRA initially announced they would not continue the fight after Omagh, but apparently didn't care for that for too long, and the Official IRA has not been militantly active in decades.

 

[pgv]

Now the Real IRA has admitted to being behind it.

The Provisional IRA has stopped fighting. The Continuity IRA has never officially agreed to the peace agreement and the cease fire, the Real IRA initially announced they would not continue the fight after Omagh, but apparently didn't care for that for too long, and the Official IRA has not been militantly active in decades.

... So why on earth do this now? Unless it was the provisional IRA, and just them, in which case why would the real IRA admit to it rather than distance themselves?

 

[yolland]

.

No grief, no anger as 14 hours after attack Sinn Féin has its say

David Sharrock
Times (UK), Mar. 9


It took Gerry Adams and Sinn Féin 14 hours to respond to the murders of the two young British soldiers, long after the rest of Northern Ireland's political parties and the British and Irish governments had condemned the terrorists' bloody attack. When it finally arrived, the statement looked like an almost clinical string of sentences over which a committee had agonised. The lack of a sense of grief or anger is striking—chilling, perhaps, to the majority of people in Ireland and Britain—and entirely consistent with the mindset of the movement's leadership.

In the not-so-distant past Sinn Féin approvingly published details of the latest attacks by the IRA on “Crown Forces” in the “War News” section of its newspaper, An Phoblacht/Republican News. So, while the police described the attack as “an attempt at mass murder”, Sinn Féin called it an “attack on the peace process”. The “peace process” has been an elastic concept over which Sinn Féin has fought to maintain copyright. When talking to its supporters, it primarily refers to the means with which to remove the British from Ireland. Like any good advertising agency, the party has worked hard to fuse its “peace process” brand with the idea of British withdrawal. The brand looked past its sell-by date as Sinn Féin signed up to the consent principle for Irish unity, took ministerial posts in Stormont and gave support to British law enforcement agencies, including the construction of MI5's largest headquarters outside London in the Province.

The attack was “wrong and counter-productive”, Sinn Féin said—a phrase that errs on the side of caution in regard to its more traditionally minded supporters but one that will also be enough, just, to give cover and comfort to Sinn Féin's partner in government, the Democratic Unionist Party. The DUP will be able to argue that Sinn Féin has crossed the Rubicon by condemning an attack on British soldiers. Five years ago it would have been unthinkable.

Once that condemnation is succinctly made, Mr Adams returns to the theme closest to the hearts and minds of his republican constituency. “Those responsible have no support, no strategy to achieve a united Ireland.” “Unlike us,” the party is saying. “Do not be seduced into thinking that these people, who now practise what the Provisional IRA once practised, will lead you to a united Ireland. We alone have the support and strategy.” The duty, therefore, to “defend the peace process” involves defending British soldiers from attack by dissident republicans who disagree with Sinn Féin over the path to a united Ireland.

The most indigestible phrase is: “Sinn Féin has a responsibility to be consistent. The logic of this is that we support the police in the apprehension of those involved in last night's attack.” While this means the party wants the police to bring the killers to justice, the tortuous construction suggests it is having difficulty saying so. And then Sinn Féin reminds the police and British Government of their responsibilities. This is, if not transparently so, a reference to the row 36 hours earlier over the Chief Constable's decision to call in special forces soldiers to counter the activities of republican dissidents.

The final four paragraphs have nothing to do with the deaths and injuries caused by the attack, but are another appeal to republicans to continue to believe in the Sinn Féin strategy. Such appeals are invariably accompanied by a reminder that some “Brits” (Unionists are not British but misguided Irish people, in Sinn Féin's view) are working to undermine the peace process, which is all about reuniting Ireland.

It is a while since Mr Adams gave such a fine example of “Sinn Féin-speak”, recalling the days when every press statement had to be parsed for its true meaning.

 

[Vincent Vega]

Because that is exactly why terrorists commit such an attack. I don't think it was the Provos, and the Real IRA is known for its unconditional fundamentalism.

From a terrorist's point of view it would be pretty pointless to commit an attack and then deny the responsibility for that. Their aim is just the opposite.
The Omagh bombing, for example, was a recruiting effort for them. Only the utter stupidity of the two terrorists who parked the car made this attempt a total and devastating failure.

 

[HyperU2]

This won't look like much of a success, killing two soldiers who were about to leave Ireland for Afghanistan.

 

[A stor]

This is sad news. State side, we thought there was finally some sort of peace in Northern Ireland. At least, I hoped for the people's sake, this was true.

A few years ago, at an Irish festival, here in Baltimore, Maryland. We had some Sinn Fein/IRA folks from Northern Ireland, Belfast, show up, selling their T shirts and raffle tickets. Trying to drum up money, anyway they could. From what I saw, no one bought their merchandise or gave them money. They haven't been back since then, thank goodness. I guess, they got the message. The Irish in Maryland, do not support they bloody cause. For most of us, our families came from Ireland, during the hunger years.

 

[A stor]

I went on to the BBC website and they showed pictures of the soldiers. They were just boys. It makes absolutely no sense, to have killed them.

 

[mad1]

disgusting to have heard.

 

[annj]

even sadder the ones that did this think they are some sort of heroes for some righteous cause that only exists in their heads and refuse to accept the people of Ireland have moved on from the dark ages

Thinking they were brave and victorious shooting a couple of unarmed soldiers and civilians on a pizza delivery.. wow there is one to tell their future grandchildren to make them proud of them

 

[LJT]

... So why on earth do this now? Unless it was the provisional IRA, and just them, in which case why would the real IRA admit to it rather than distance themselves?

The Real IRA is not the 'real' IRA...the big one was the Provisional IRA (the guys from the 60s through to now who decomissioned). The Real IRA were the breakaway group, like the continuity IRA. The Real IRA are hardcore and were the ones that did the Omagh bombing. The Real IRA admit it because that's what they want. (btw sorry if you already understood all that, just from your comment it seemed you had your IRA's mixed up, tis easy to do, they seem to replicate quite often, but if not forgive me!)