SOI - I finally figured out what's wrong with it

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Yeah, and I'd say there's still some new/fresh ground for him. The guitar during the chorus of Volcano and Raped By Wolves. But overall I still agree with the OP. Nothing that would define the Edge's career but very strong throughout the album.

:sexywink:

I noticed.
 
I read in some of the recent interviews that the bass riff on Volcano was actually of Edge's creation, can't look up the link for reference right now.
 
I've had SOI on high repeat ever since it's release. I think it's their strongest album since... 2000 at least.

That being said, something has always bothered me about, but I couldn't put my finger on it.

Finally, it hit me!

There are no iconic Edge hooks.

Think about it-- all the greatest U2 songs not only have strong melodies (of which SOI is refreshingly good!), but also a clutch of musical hooks that draw you in.

Just think about Achtung Baby:
Zoo Station, EBTTRT, One, UTEOFW, The Fly, MW, UV... all of them have some front and center guitar line that is quite catchy.

Now quick, name one from SOI!

The musical hook king of SOI, by far, is Adam. All the riffs--namely, Volcano and TIWYCRMN.

Nothing from the Edge sticks out (a couple of solos aside).

Your thoughts?

I enjoy the opening crunch of Miracle's riff. Also rifforama on Cedarwood road and providing the intensity on Raised by wolves.

His best this time, and in a long while ? The synth-ish riff on Invisible.
 
Neither does Zooropa, really, and it's still a great album.

I think his guitar work on Reach Me is incredible by the way, even if it isn't 'iconic'

?

I think the guitar tone in Reach Around is unique in their catalogue. Probably assists that I think it's moving up the ranks to be the best song on the album.

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the dirty guitar on Sleep like a baby and Cedarwood Road is massive

there's loads of really nice guitar work going on in the whole album, some a little bit more in your face, but a lot nice and subtle behind the scenes, keeping everything afloat...
 
I think it comes to the producer because when the edge works with steve lilywhite (boy, October, war, how to dismantle an atomic bomb) edge is more prominent while he works with Daniel lanios (the unforgettable fire, the Joshua tree, achtung baby, all that you can't leave behind, no line on the horizon) edge and Adam is basically equal. And now working with danger mouse (he mostly work with the rhythm section) Larry is getting more in the mix and Adam has more freedom to do more with, this is where you can reach me now, iris, etc. But I do think the album took longer to make because edge couldn't find a place on the album so they brought in flood to help them out to come up with something but there is still great work on this album.
 
I think it comes to the producer because when the edge works with steve lilywhite (boy, October, war, how to dismantle an atomic bomb) edge is more prominent while he works with Daniel lanios (the unforgettable fire, the Joshua tree, achtung baby, all that you can't leave behind, no line on the horizon) edge and Adam is basically equal. And now working with danger mouse (he mostly work with the rhythm section) Larry is getting more in the mix and Adam has more freedom to do more with, this is where you can reach me now, iris, etc. But I do think the album took longer to make because edge couldn't find a place on the album so they brought in flood to help them out to come up with something but there is still great work on this album.

You think Flood was the reason? Didn't he only touch one or two songs on this album?
 
I think it comes to the producer because when the edge works with steve lilywhite (boy, October, war, how to dismantle an atomic bomb) edge is more prominent while he works with Daniel lanios (the unforgettable fire, the Joshua tree, achtung baby, all that you can't leave behind, no line on the horizon) edge and Adam is basically equal. And now working with danger mouse (he mostly work with the rhythm section) Larry is getting more in the mix and Adam has more freedom to do more with, this is where you can reach me now, iris, etc.

It all depends on who is doing the mixing.

It wouldn't shock me if Edge had (primarily) mixed all of the last 4 albums. It's not the so-called 'art' it used to be with the software they are using. Any monkey can set levels and find a sound they like, it's more of a question of the U2 democracy signing off on it. More likely, it is mixed as a collaborative effort, as I don't think they even credit a mixer (do they?)

Also, don't conflate writing and production too much. You say "Adam has more freedom to do more"...Adam has the freedom to do whatever he wants whenever he wants, it's only a question of if he can get the Haircuts and Milquetoast Jr. to agree with what's he doing. Also, there is no evidence he's doing more or less anywhere. He's playing a bass line regardless. I mean, I don't really get what you mean. He's going to play his chosen part regardless of who the producer is, period. U2 are writing these songs.

I think some of you guys think the producer does a hell of a lot more than he does. This is not Britney Spears, the vast majority of all music ideas and music itself is coming from U2. Danger Mouse has no writing credits on SOI. Lillywhite has never had any instrumental credits. They do different things, mostly, they serve as an impartial ear (at least theoretically). They have a special relationship with Eno and Lanois and nobody else.
 
Danger Mouse has no writing credits on SOI.

This is true, but he's all over the place on Sleep Like a Baby Tonight. I think that one deserved a credit. The Troubles is another one that could have been a candidate, although I cannot vouch for that (coincidentally two best songs on the album for me).

Besides, as Eno has already stated, they have been conservative with assigning credits to producers in the past. Once they did that on Horizon, the silly drummer found the easiest possible excuse in blaming that factor as to why the album wasn't successful. So much for the special relationship with Eno and Lanois.
 
Besides, as Eno has already stated, they have been conservative with assigning credits to producers in the past. Once they did that on Horizon, the silly drummer found the easiest possible excuse in blaming that factor as to why the album wasn't successful. So much for the special relationship with Eno and Lanois.

Well, to consider all the facts, since Zooropa their collaboration with Eno/Lanois was more or less terrible with exception of NLOTH Morocco sessions. They did wonderful material together between 1984-1995, but it is normal their collaboration got exhausted after all those years. I´m happy they used other producents on the latest record and I hope they won´t come back to Eno/Lanois.
 
Besides, as Eno has already stated, they have been conservative with assigning credits to producers in the past. Once they did that on Horizon, the silly drummer found the easiest possible excuse in blaming that factor as to why the album wasn't successful. So much for the special relationship with Eno and Lanois.

Larry had an opinion on something, just like all of us do. He happened to actually be in the room, as well. It's fine.



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You're missing the point, as well. It's fine.

I get your point just fine. I was just wondering if Larry would have been called 'silly' anyway if he had spoken highly of NLOTH and/or its recording process. That's all I was pointing out.
 
I think Edge finally nailed the "rock" riff he's been trying to make on the last few albums, I also think there's a lot subtle touches throughout the album that are magic.

Absolutely. If you pay attention to this record, there are many great (subtle) Edge moments there.
 
Overall great convo.
I thought of another way to ask the question:

What SOI songs do you put on, primarily to hear a particular guitar part?
Mine would be Miracle and Cedarwood.

I think most other U2 albums have more songs that have guitar parts that I directly aim for when pushing play.

Sleep Like a Baby and Volcano have some unique/nice sounds within it, but I don't hit play on those songs just so I can hear the guitar line.
 
Overall great convo.
I thought of another way to ask the question:

What SOI songs do you put on, primarily to hear a particular guitar part?
Mine would be Miracle and Cedarwood.

I think most other U2 albums have more songs that have guitar parts that I directly aim for when pushing play.

Sleep Like a Baby and Volcano have some unique/nice sounds within it, but I don't hit play on those songs just so I can hear the guitar line.

Definitely Cedarwood Road and Reach Around. I was quick to learn those guitar parts.

In actually playing Reach Around (giggidy), I realized that this is one of the better guitar songs of The Edge's career. It's a blast to play.
 
Overall great convo.
I thought of another way to ask the question:

What SOI songs do you put on, primarily to hear a particular guitar part?
Mine would be Miracle and Cedarwood.

Funny, these two songs I try to forget about guitar parts, because it is the most generic, cliche guitar old school sound/riffs U2 has ever come up with in his career.

Mine choices would be Soldier, Waves chorus, Volcano, Iris
 
I get your point just fine. I was just wondering if Larry would have been called 'silly' anyway if he had spoken highly of NLOTH and/or its recording process. That's all I was pointing out.

But "Larry stoopid" party line just sounds so much better.
 
What SOI songs do you put on, primarily to hear a particular guitar part?

Raised By Wolves is the one that sticks out for me in a positive way. I like the guitar tones on The Miracle and Cedarwood, but the playing is rudimentary. Is that new for Edge? No. But he usually does a better job of hiding it. That Cedarwood riff is really derivative and beginners level, like it was the first thing he came up with for that particular key and stuck with it.

The worst part of the album for Edge is the soloing early on in the album. California and SFS both have solos that sound like they were copy/pasted from an earlier U2 song. Edge has ripped himself off before (how many times has he used that Walk On riff now?) but I don't even see the point of soloing there at all. At least Bono isn't yelling over him.
 
Raised By Wolves is the one that sticks out for me in a positive way. I like the guitar tones on The Miracle and Cedarwood, but the playing is rudimentary. Is that new for Edge? No. But he usually does a better job of hiding it. That Cedarwood riff is really derivative and beginners level, like it was the first thing he came up with for that particular key and stuck with it.

The worst part of the album for Edge is the soloing early on in the album. California and SFS both have solos that sound like they were copy/pasted from an earlier U2 song. Edge has ripped himself off before (how many times has he used that Walk On riff now?) but I don't even see the point of soloing there at all. At least Bono isn't yelling over him.

:up:
 
I've had SOI on high repeat ever since it's release. I think it's their strongest album since... 2000 at least.

That being said, something has always bothered me about, but I couldn't put my finger on it.

Finally, it hit me!

There are no iconic Edge hooks.

Think about it-- all the greatest U2 songs not only have strong melodies (of which SOI is refreshingly good!), but also a clutch of musical hooks that draw you in.

Just think about Achtung Baby:
Zoo Station, EBTTRT, One, UTEOFW, The Fly, MW, UV... all of them have some front and center guitar line that is quite catchy.

Now quick, name one from SOI!

The musical hook king of SOI, by far, is Adam. All the riffs--namely, Volcano and TIWYCRMN.

Nothing from the Edge sticks out (a couple of solos aside).

Your thoughts?
I think the lack of "hooks" by The Edge are what makes it a better album, considering he hasn't written great guitar bits since the '90s and, more often than not, drags the band back to repeating itself. For example, "Unknown Caller" reused that guitar riff from "Walk On" and "Crumbs From Your Table" and it was never a good hook to begin with. He's been U2's most conservative member.

FINALLY, on this album he's gone back to experimenting and that's what makes his work great on "Sleep Like a Baby Tonight" and a few other songs. The Edge hasn't been able to write great guitar solos in a very long time, so I'll settle for more subdued guitar work.
 
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