Next Album Rumours Thread III - The Gospel of Adam

[JamietheEdgefan]

I can't say I understand why they keep pushing further and further into this hard rock sound if they're so set on getting a big commercial hit. They just seem contradictory to me (No way Vertigo would do as well in 2021 as in 2004; of course rock still exists, but it's not topping the charts like in the 2000's and before).

I've got nothing against a more heavy rock direction (I really liked Blackout, although the chorus was underwhelming), but I can't see it yielding the hits they want.

I'm not convinced anything they put out at this point would be a hit, but I would have thought they would lean in another direction for commerical success. Something with more of an electronic and dance blend of which they're more than capable, and which might actually fit in a little with where things are at in the modern pop scene (e.g. elements of mysterious ways and the Real Thing/Real thing 360 remix).

And if they do want an uncompromising rock sound regardless of commercial success, I don't know why they'd still be working with Ryan Tedder...

 

[JamietheEdgefan]

There are plenty of examples of acts who lost their way returning to form late in their career.

U2 certainly don't fit that bill with their history of trying to force themselves into a fourth "moment" - and if you're one of the "everything after Pop sucks" crowd then you're probably right that they'll never put out anything that's great to YOU again - but I do still hold out hope that they'll see the light before they're done, and there's been enough moments of greatness sprinkled in over the past decade that lets me believe that with the right direction it can be done.

I'm curious, what do you reckon the right direction would be, in terms of sound/producer?

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

I'm curious, what do you reckon the right direction would be, in terms of sound/producer?

Gosh - non-pandering?

Little Things had the "U2 magic." I'd argue more of the later part of the record did, while the first part - specifically Best Thing, Get Out and American Soul - were more on the "this is what we think the Kidz want to hear on the radioz" pandering horseshit.

What I want, what is most important to me is that I have a guarantee - no more pandering to radio, put out something mature, act your god damn age.

I'd be quite happy with that.

If that's Eno and Lanois again? Great. Someone else? Ok. But even with Brian and Danny they couldn't help but put some pandering horse shit into the middle. Stop with that.

 

[ascender_RS]

I'd still like to see what Rick Rubin could do for/with them but I guess that ship has sailed.

Like a few of you have said, I don't know if the problem is the producer(s) or the band themselves now. I'm not wanting/expecting another Pop, but I do think they need to do something different. And like @Headache says, maybe just acting their age will open up new sounds, ideas and approaches to their music?

SOA clearly isn't going to be a "thing", so why not just release it when there's no expectations or pressure at the moment. Even charge $10 or something for a digital download only release with all money going to those people in the music & touring industry, live venues etc.

 

[JamietheEdgefan]

Gosh - non-pandering?

Little Things had the "U2 magic." I'd argue more of the later part of the record did, while the first part - specifically Best Thing, Get Out and American Soul - were more on the "this is what we think the Kidz want to hear on the radioz" pandering horseshit.

What I want, what is most important to me is that I have a guarantee - no more pandering to radio, put out something mature, act your god damn age.

I'd be quite happy with that.

If that's Eno and Lanois again? Great. Someone else? Ok. But even with Brian and Danny they couldn't help but put some pandering horse shit into the middle. Stop with that.

Yeah, I completely agree. There's quite a clear divide in their material between the more bold, honest, mature stuff and the transparent attempts at hits. It clearly comes down to producers too - Tedder doing the more commercial stuff, and Andy Barlow covering 'Little things' and 'love is all we have left' etc.

I'd love to see them back with Eno and Lanois more than anyone, to help them bring out the soundscapes, atmosphere, iconic minimalist riffs etc. It's sad how that relationship seemed to end so abruptly - after helping to craft most of their biggest songs, and their two 'reboots', suddenly with NLOTH they just couldn't make it work anymore? Perhaps the band became ruthless when they raised E&L couldn't help them make a youthful, commercial hit anymore.

I wouldn't mind an album that's stadium friendly, catchy, dancey etc, but done in a way that's more authentic and less cynical/calculated than what we've heard recently.

Whether it's a rock album, a pop album or anything else, it would be great if they just committed to a sound and really went all in, uncompromised.

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

I actually don't think it's producers. I think it's the band.

Why? Who picks the producers? Exactly.

They picked Tedder because that's what they want. But as with many things late stage U2, they're conflicted so they bring in a Barlow or someone of that ilk to help out.

It's the equivalent of a mid life crisis. They're not comfortable with being old and mainstream irrelevant, so for the past two albums they've tried to force the issue instead of just accepting who they now are.

I'd have rather they bought a Corvette.

 

[BEAL]

No to Rick Rubin. He basically took what was uniquely U2 and tossed it out the window.

The band didn’t have to follow but part of the new poppier U2 formula is directly related to him. And Spider-Man

U2 has always been about the melody coming from their maddening recording sessions that drives everyone insane.

Now it’s Bono and Edge taking a melody and seeing how it fits on acoustic and clock in under 3 mins

 

[the tourist]

Give the Dessner brothers a crack at it.

 

[JamietheEdgefan]

I actually don't think it's producers. I think it's the band.

Why? Who picks the producers? Exactly.

They picked Tedder because that's what they want. But as with many things late stage U2, they're conflicted so they bring in a Barlow or someone of that ilk to help out.

It's the equivalent of a mid life crisis. They're not comfortable with being old and mainstream irrelevant, so for the past two albums they've tried to force the issue instead of just accepting who they now are.

I'd have rather they bought a Corvette.

Fair. It's the bands decision at the end of the day!

There's a chance that at some point they see it's not working - they've done two albums with Ryan Tedder, and just didn't get the big single they were clearly after from working with him.

After NLOTH, it made sense to treat it as a one off failure and try another comeback, going all in with a pop producer. But after two albums, and 16 years since their last big single? Maybe it'll become clear that they need to at least try something new.

After Rattle and Hum, they went to Achtung Baby. After Pop, they went to ATYCLB. I really hope they don't stay with Ryan Tedder after the last two albums.

 

[pacemaker]

I'm going to sound like a broken record, but I'd like to see Flood involved in an entire record again. Barlow/Flood would probably be a very cool production team. Eno/Edge/Flood again would be dreamy. Perhaps the pool of people actually willing to work with U2 isn't as big as it once was.

I don't really have issues with Bono and Edge trying to be the Beatles - it's been fascinating watching them grow and evolve as songwriters over the years. They just usually whiff on the execution and arrangement when trying to turn them into Big Pawp Rawk tunes. They've always had the best luck with producers that can take the other genres and tropes and help mold them into a U2 song, instead of vice versa. Epworth, Tedder, and latter-day Lillywhite are the vice versa. Jackknife Lee is hit-or-miss.

 

[lazarus]

Give the Dessner brothers a crack at it.

I’m not a National fan but Aaron’s work on the Taylor Swift albums was fantastic.

As it’s already been said, the problem is the band, not the producers. They did some great stuff with Danger Mouse but didn’t have the courage to let him handle the whole album.

And a big fucking HELL NO on Rick Rubin.

 

[LuckyNumber7]

I actually don't think it's producers. I think it's the band.

Why? Who picks the producers? Exactly.

They picked Tedder because that's what they want. But as with many things late stage U2, they're conflicted so they bring in a Barlow or someone of that ilk to help out.

It's the equivalent of a mid life crisis. They're not comfortable with being old and mainstream irrelevant, so for the past two albums they've tried to force the issue instead of just accepting who they now are.

I'd have rather they bought a Corvette.

I’ve been saying this for years about the producers. Tedder didn’t do a bad job, he did a Tedder job. But I also don’t think Tedder stops U2 from making good music. U2 does.

 

[SecretFly]

I’ve been saying this for years about the producers. Tedder didn’t do a bad job, he did a Tedder job. But I also don’t think Tedder stops U2 from making good music. U2 does.

Tedder is a better song writer than a producer. That's why most of the successful songs written by him are produced by other producers and sung by other artists. Halo and Apologise are perfect examples.

 

[Hollow Island]

I am curious to hear what a U2 album written with no intent to tour would sound like.

I’d imagine it would be very dark.

https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/51e2XD7qFIL._AC_UL600_SR600,600_.jpg

 

[Hollow Island]

There are plenty of examples of acts who lost their way returning to form late in their career.

U2 certainly don't fit that bill with their history of trying to force themselves into a fourth "moment" - and if you're one of the "everything after Pop sucks" crowd then you're probably right that they'll never put out anything that's great to YOU again - but I do still hold out hope that they'll see the light before they're done, and there's been enough moments of greatness sprinkled in over the past decade that lets me believe that with the right direction it can be done.

the most frustrating thing about the last decade is how close they were to making excellent albums. the talent is there, the material is there, but their judgement seems to get tired and bails out of the sessions before the album is finished.

 

[Hewson]

https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/51e2XD7qFIL._AC_UL600_SR600,600_.jpg

Could maybe include Zooropa as well.

 

[Hollow Island]

Zooropa was made with the intent to tour though - it was made on tour, they played most of it live, and the songs played major roles in the show.

 

[wolbersu2]

Zooropa was made with the intent to tour though - it was made on tour, they played most of it live, and the songs played major roles in the show.

I am glad they did no live version of 'Babyface'

 

[The_acrobat]

I am glad they did no live version of 'Babyface'

They played it 5 times in the summer of 93. I can see why it didn't stick around.

 

[AndrewCowley]

Zooropa was made with the intent to tour though - it was made on tour, they played most of it live, and the songs played major roles in the show.

Whilst it was made on tour, its likely the album they gave least thought to regarding eventually having to play it live. I’d bet if you tallied up the total number of times Zooropa songs have been played live and compared it to all other albums, it’d come in at the bottom by miles.

The Babyface clip above says it all really.

That said, it did have its moments. Lemon kicked arse live.

 

[wolbersu2]

They played it 5 times in the summer of 93. I can see why it didn't stick around.

Wow, I didn't know they played it! Absolutely right decision to drop it from the setlist. For me personally their all-time worst song on one of their best albums...

 

[mikal]

It's too bad that HMTMKMKM wasn't finished at the release of Zooropa, because that would have been a killer replacement in the #2 spot on that album.

 

[Hollow Island]

Whilst it was made on tour, its likely the album they gave least thought to regarding eventually having to play it live. I’d bet if you tallied up the total number of times Zooropa songs have been played live and compared it to all other albums, it’d come in at the bottom by miles.

The Babyface clip above says it all really.

That said, it did have its moments. Lemon kicked arse live.

There's no real way to judge how much thought they gave to playing it live since we're not in their heads. They played seven of the 10 songs live though. The low play counts of Dirty Day, Lemon and Crashed Car probably have more to do with those songs not being singles, the band having to learn them, and having to rejig the setlist and visuals to fit them than it does their quality as live songs because they were all great. Babyface and Zooropa, not so much. Pop sounds like they gave minimal thought to playing that live given how it was recorded and the amount of layers it has (and how different so many of the sons were when they were played).

If Lemon, Numb, and Stay had been hits the size of Mysterious Ways you can bet your hands that they'd still be playing those songs. Alas, it had no real hits and was released as a tour was winding down.

 

[Hollow Island]

i don't think Hold Me Thrill Me would have fit at all on Zooropa, but the version they were working on then was probably quite different from what was released, since the credits for the released version suggest it's a total remake.

 

[pacemaker]

It's too bad that HMTMKMKM wasn't finished at the release of Zooropa, because that would have been a killer replacement in the #2 spot on that album.

Fuck yea, this would have ruled. I wonder how different the pre-Batman HMTMKMKM is.

I like Babyface a lot more than most seem to, but I do "brace" myself after Zooropa ends because it doesn't belong. It maybe could have worked between Some Days... and The First Time, but it's an outlier anywhere. As a rarely or never performed B-Side? I bet it would be well loved.

 

[DaveC]

i like babyface, for what it is. sure it's nothing special and it kinda plods on a bit too long, but it's not one of those actively objectionable, run-to-hit-the-skip-button clunkers that U2 has plenty of.

it is definitely one of their worst live songs (which thankfully the band recognized quickly), but the album version is easily better than, say, the middle trio of NLOTH, or the singles from SOE.

 

[the tourist]

See and here I’d have preferred they didn’t give away Hold Me Thrill Me Kiss Me Kill Me to a Batman soundtrack and save it for Pop.

 

[lazarus]

Hold Me does not fit sonically or lyrically on Zooropa, at all.

Makes much more sense on Pop.

 

[super fly guy]

Hold Me does not fit sonically or lyrically on Zooropa, at all.

Makes much more sense on Pop.

Exactly,even for POP it's a stretch. Has sort of Achtung Baby style vocal effects,works fine as a stand alone track.

 

[lazarus]

Yeah, the glam vibe and the crunchy guitar doesn't fit that well on Pop either but that album is more schizophrenic and Miami is a bit of an outlier as well. Though that at least is rhythm based like most of the album.

I guess if you put it between Staring at the Sun and Last Night on Earth it might not stand out as much.