New Album Discussion 1 - Songs of..... - Unreasonable guitar album

[super fly guy]

Originally Posted by MattD

It's still a generic 'rawk' song unfortunately. While it doesn't fall to depths of depravity like The Miracle or American Soul, to call this 'unreasonable, f*** off' rock is typical U2isms of the recent era.



It's bland. Rock music should be a dirtier, grimier with an undercurrent of menace. Instead its Bono shouting to the top of his lungs again with a fistful of platitudes and a cut and paste chorus. Sonically it should be discordant, this is far too clean. No I'm not expecting sheets of guitar distortion ala My Bloody Valentine but something with raw, primal energy would help.



In the recent interviews, Bono stresses that U2 is a 'rock and roll band'. I don't think he'd have pigeon holed the band like that years ago, embracing the musical diversity and stylistic shifts in their music more readily. The U2 of yesteryear that embraced various styles was more rock and roll than the one of today. The music was edgier (no pun intended). Nowadays, they're content on resorting to the rock n roll handbook with cliches upon cliches in musical form. It all seems like a parody of rock music.



I've been listening to a lot of Creation Record acts like Ride, Jesus & Mary Chain and My Bloody Valentine, and if they want to make rock music that stands out from the crowd, they really need to take it to extremes like these bands that is a counter opposite of the slick produced automated chart music of today. These bands mentioned annihilated the senses with their sonic blizzards and it certainly grabbed the attention, with a frenetic energy that hasn't been heard since.



That's your template. Simply plugging in a guitar and playing generic 'rawk' music isn't going to cause any waves, let alone ripples. If U2 were serious about getting back to being a guitar band, they'd want to be at the forefront of something that grabs the listeners attention whether they like it or not.



But U2 are neither interested in music as an artform now.

Quite the take,it's a fun upbeat rock song. Can't have streets every time.

[DeVaul]

Originally Posted by MattD

It's still a generic 'rawk' song unfortunately. While it doesn't fall to depths of depravity like The Miracle or American Soul, to call this 'unreasonable, f*** off' rock is typical U2isms of the recent era.



It's bland. Rock music should be a dirtier, grimier with an undercurrent of menace. Instead its Bono shouting to the top of his lungs again with a fistful of platitudes and a cut and paste chorus. Sonically it should be discordant, this is far too clean. No I'm not expecting sheets of guitar distortion ala My Bloody Valentine but something with raw, primal energy would help.



In the recent interviews, Bono stresses that U2 is a 'rock and roll band'. I don't think he'd have pigeon holed the band like that years ago, embracing the musical diversity and stylistic shifts in their music more readily. The U2 of yesteryear that embraced various styles was more rock and roll than the one of today. The music was edgier (no pun intended). Nowadays, they're content on resorting to the rock n roll handbook with cliches upon cliches in musical form. It all seems like a parody of rock music.



I've been listening to a lot of Creation Record acts like Ride, Jesus & Mary Chain and My Bloody Valentine, and if they want to make rock music that stands out from the crowd, they really need to take it to extremes like these bands that is a counter opposite of the slick produced automated chart music of today. These bands mentioned annihilated the senses with their sonic blizzards and it certainly grabbed the attention, with a frenetic energy that hasn't been heard since.



That's your template. Simply plugging in a guitar and playing generic 'rawk' music isn't going to cause any waves, let alone ripples. If U2 were serious about getting back to being a guitar band, they'd want to be at the forefront of something that grabs the listeners attention whether they like it or not.



But U2 are neither interested in music as an artform now.

Tough but fair.

[ndmaxfield]

I’m loving everything about the song and video, except for Bono emulating Abraham Lincoln in Disney’s Hall of Presidents.

[dan_smee]

I whole-heartedly disagree that rock needs to tick all those boxes. You are suggesting rock needs to fit into a small archetype that includes particular structures and sounds. I mean that is so anti-rock it’s not funny.

It started from the false premise that u2 called this an “unreasonable fuck off rock” song. Bono said 6 months ago that he wanted to hear unreasonable guitars on their next album.

If you going expecting this to anything other than the context dictated by- a quickly put together fun, bombastic pop song that mirrors the ridiculousness of the city it is named after then that’s on you.

It’s not their best effort, but it’s hardly meant to be.

[super fly guy]

Originally Posted by DeVaul

Tough but fair.

A band 47 years into their career will rarely make menacing music,it's a young man's game.

[super fly guy]

Originally Posted by dan_smee

I whole-heartedly disagree that rock needs to tick all those boxes. You are suggesting rock needs to fit into a small archetype that includes particular structures and sounds. I mean that is so anti-rock it’s not funny.

It started from the false premise that u2 called this an “unreasonable fuck off rock” song. Bono said 6 months ago that he wanted to hear unreasonable guitars on their next album.

If you going expecting this to anything other than the context dictated by- a quickly put together fun, bombastic pop song that mirrors the ridiculousness of the city it is named after then that’s on you.

It’s not their best effort, but it’s hardly meant to be.

Spot on,must be boring listening to dark serious music all the time.

Depressing actually,this is a catchy straight forward rock song. Nothing more nothing less,enjoy it for what it is and we shall see what the next album brings.

[DeVaul]

Originally Posted by super fly guy

A band 47 years into their career will rarely make menacing music,it's a young man's game.

It’s a promo single for a series of concerts. I’m not expecting Exit. But they’ve definitely watered down the heart of darkness that was the most effective part of their moody rock. Would welcome a return or it.

[dan_smee]

Originally Posted by DeVaul

It’s a promo single for a series of concerts. I’m not expecting Exit. But they’ve definitely watered down the heart of darkness that was the most effective part of their moody rock. Would welcome a return or it.

Undeniably so. This was never the forum for it, but maybe Achtung Baby’s focus will help Bono rediscover the “drop of acid”.

[DomCobb]

Originally Posted by MattD

I've been listening to a lot of Creation Record acts like Ride, Jesus & Mary Chain and My Bloody Valentine, and if they want to make rock music that stands out from the crowd, they really need to take it to extremes like these bands that is a counter opposite of the slick produced automated chart music of today. These bands mentioned annihilated the senses with their sonic blizzards and it certainly grabbed the attention, with a frenetic energy that hasn't been heard since.

That'd be a very quick way to lose me, and probably a lot of other fans. Personally, the fact that the song is not "fuck off guitar rock" music is a good thing. Regardless of my feelings on that kind of music, I don't think it's something the band does well. The crunchier the guitars have gotten on recent records, the worse a song is.

The success of U2 to me is always the economy of music, creating sweeping "cinematic" soundscapes not just through what's being played but what's not being played. The sense of space, spaciousness. To me, Atomic City is a move in the right direction, because it is a straightforward rock song, without many additional instrumentals or effects, but it still feels big in a way that is U2.

[cseggleton]

Originally Posted by DomCobb

That'd be a very quick way to lose me, and probably a lot of other fans. Personally, the fact that the song is not "fuck off guitar rock" music is a good thing. Regardless of my feelings on that kind of music, I don't think it's something the band does well. The crunchier the guitars have gotten on recent records, the worse a song is.

The success of U2 to me is always the economy of music, creating sweeping "cinematic" soundscapes not just through what's being played but what's not being played. The sense of space, spaciousness. To me, Atomic City is a move in the right direction, because it is a straightforward rock song, without many additional instrumentals or effects, but it still feels big in a way that is U2.

Best part of being a U2 fan is if they lose you on one thing then one sure has a lot of listening pleasure in their back catalog. For me personally they have not put an album out since POP that I just put on repeat and listen the whole way through. Some good nuggets since but nothing they've done has "lost" me.

[lazarus]

Originally Posted by DomCobb

The more I listen, it really is a catchy song, I enjoy it a lot. The bouncy vibe keeps it from being too "rawk," but I think they easily could have ruined this if it was produced wrong, or with the wrong guitar/drum sound, so it's good to see that things are going in the right direction. The vocal effects on Bono are a bit on the cringe side but otherwise the *sound* is excellent. I think as a song something like The Miracle is probably better, but the *sound* is all wrong, so I'd take this over it. I'd also take this over Best Thing, American Soul, Boots, Stand Up Comedy in terms of recent "rawkers," but below The Blackout and Volcano, on par with Lucifer's Hands and Cedarwood Road.

Mostly agreed here, and the production does kind of save it. The one exception I’d make to that list of recent rock tracks that are worse is Boots, and that’s because it has a more coherent theme lyrically (pro-women activism), and it’s more sonically inventive—the psychedelia, the “Middle Eastern” pre-chorus vocal, etc.

[DomCobb]

Originally Posted by dan_smee

After sitting with this over 24 hours I agree it is much better than YTBTAM and The Miracle. Kicks shit out of Boots.

After a while of trying to work out which songs from the last three albums it was better than, I realised it would be faster to list the ones it wasn’t. I felt that was a good sign.

So I reckon the only songs from NLOtH onwards that are better are MOS, EBW, Little Things. There are some I can’t place yet around it like LIAWHL, LOH, Blackout, LIBTAIIW, RFD, RBW, The Troubles, Magnificent, Fez-BB. I am sure it’s on a best of U2’a last 15 years.

For me

NLOTH - Better than at least 6/11 songs
SOI - Better than 4/11 songs
SOE - Better than 6/13

So it's a bit middle of the road for me, but middle of the road for the last two albums means good for me (and for NLOTH, there's a steep drop between the top and the bottom).

For a one off single, pretty good! If we consider every one off single (be it from a movie or something else), I'd say it's near the top of the pack, not Invisible level better certainly one of their best one offs ever.

[lazarus]

Originally Posted by dan_smee

After sitting with this over 24 hours I agree it is much better than YTBTAM and The Miracle. Kicks shit out of Boots.

After a while of trying to work out which songs from the last three albums it was better than, I realised it would be faster to list the ones it wasn’t. I felt that was a good sign.

So I reckon the only songs from NLOtH onwards that are better are MOS, EBW, Little Things. There are some I can’t place yet around it like LIAWHL, LOH, Blackout, LIBTAIIW, RFD, RBW, The Troubles, Magnificent, Fez-BB. I am sure it’s on a best of U2’a last 15 years.

Sure glad you gave this a 24 hour probation period before declaring this their 4th best song of the last 15 years.

[Headache in a Suitcase]

Originally Posted by lazarus

Mostly agreed here, and the production does kind of save it. The one exception I’d make to that list of recent rock tracks that are worse is Boots, and that’s because it has a more coherent theme lyrically (pro-women activism), and it’s more sonically inventive—the psychedelia, the “Middle Eastern” pre-chorus vocal, etc.

Wanna fight?

[dan_smee]

Originally Posted by lazarus

Sure glad you gave this a 24 hour probation period before declaring this their 4th best song of the last 15 years.

Umm… I didn’t? I listed 12 songs that could be better than it that I need time to sit with.

Where does the hostility come from? Do you want to talk about it?

[JamietheEdgefan]

After having a day to listen through it, I'm generally quite a fan of this song.

It's got an attitude and an intentional messiness going on that I've not heard from them in a while. There's so much drive, particularly with the drums, and so many elements to the song (bass solo with psychedelic vocals section is my favourite) that it really feels like it's in your face. There's just a lot of energy and fight to this track, which is great.

Unfortunately, I think the chorus yet again just isn't up to scratch. I actually don't mind at all that it's reminiscent of Blondie (especially given they were credited), but it's just not a particularly strong hook in my opinion, and I'm finding I'm listening 'around' the chorus, i.e. enjoying the verses, the bass/vocals part, the guitar solo, but finding myself meandering through the chorus itself. I'm enjoying the song, but suspect the lack of a chorus I like will mean I eventually stop listening to this once the novelty of a new U2 song wears off.

But even having said that, I still feel positive. This track was made to promote the Sphere shows, and by the sounds of it was put together pretty quickly. By which I mean, I don't think this was ever meant to be their 'A game', which would be reserved for album material, and lead singles in particular. So for them to make a by-design throwaway song, and have it be this good? That's a great sign.

If they can commit to this production style of rough, raw sounds, bass and drums right up front, and keep bringing the attitude, energy, and inventive arrangements, but write stronger hooks/choruses, then the next album could be really fun. I feel pretty optimistic right now.

[Airseven]

Don’t care for the new track at all. The post-punk (or whatever) style does nothing for me… Edge’s backing a-ha’s in the pre-chorus are so vapid and I’m checked out by the time Bono gets to his freedom fluff. They need to drill down on that solo/bridge portion. Spark of life there.

[JWR1992]

I think the song is pretty enjoyable. The production is very loose and lively. Something that previous records lack. Worst thing about it is the lyrics. Just more of the modern day Bono cheese that we are so used to. It’s really the type of Bono lyric you would expect out of an A.I. I’m not going to let it bother me too much tho because this is literally a throw away song written about Vegas.

[womanfish]

Originally Posted by dan_smee

After sitting with this over 24 hours I agree it is much better than YTBTAM and The Miracle. Kicks shit out of Boots.

After a while of trying to work out which songs from the last three albums it was better than, I realised it would be faster to list the ones it wasn’t. I felt that was a good sign.

So I reckon the only songs from NLOtH onwards that are better are MOS, EBW, Little Things. There are some I can’t place yet around it like LIAWHL, LOH, Blackout, LIBTAIIW, RFD, RBW, The Troubles, Magnificent, Fez-BB. I am sure it’s on a best of U2’a last 15 years.

I love ya Dan, but this could be a hot take that you look back at in a year or two and sorta wonder what you were thinking.

I know everyone has their opinion and unique style or time period of the band that they hold above others. But I'm trying to strip this down to the quality of the "song" Not if I just liked the way it was mixed better. But the lyrics, lyrical delivery, melody, chorus, feeling etc...

I like the song. It's a good song. But it isn't a really good or great song. So my take on this comes from just my own opinion and experience with the bands music for the last 37 years or so.

I've always stated on this board that the band is a journey and hardcore fans like us roll with the changes and ups and downs that come, because there is something great in even the albums that we don't like as much overall. It goes for this song. There are some great things about this song. But overall for me, it's just a good song.

I'll attempt to do the same analysis of the songs from the last three records in comparison of what I think of the song at this point.

No Line -
This song is better than - Unknown Caller, Crazy, Stand Up, Breathe, and I'm on the fence with Boots.

SOI -
This song is better than - California, SFS, Cedarwood, Reach, and I suppose Miracle, but it's close

SOE - Get Out, American Soul, The Showman, and I'd say it's about even with, but may edge out Best thing by a hair.

So for me it's lands around 22nd or so out of the 35 songs from the previous 3 albums. Which is actually pretty strong.

Again, this is my opinion of course. That is largely shaped because I fell in love and stayed in love with this band, not for fun, strummy bops, but passionate, moving, often dark, or at least conflicted songs that showed both hope and inspiration, but also doubt and pain.

And I don't think many can argue this. Even the casual U2 fan/listener's favorite songs are

SBS, Streets, WOWY, Still Haven't Found, One, Vertigo, Pride, NYD, Beautiful Day, etc... Only BD really is a straight on Feel good song. Vertigo a great rocker.

When it comes to mega fans like ourselves. I would say that Achtung Baby, Joshua Tree, War, UF and then a bit of Zooropa, Pop and All That are our biggest faves. Most of which hold some of their more serious, emotional and/or darker material.

I don't mind going on the ride, if the next album is a more light-hearted straight rock record. I'll be there. But it isn't my preference, even if this is a solidly good catchy song.

EDIT - It may also win over Blackout... ugh I'm not sure. I really like it, but I find it so hard to get over the Ned/Fred thing. really hard.

[mikal]

Originally Posted by womanfish

I love ya Dan, but this could be a hot take that you look back at in a year or two and sorta wonder what you were thinking.

I know everyone has their opinion and unique style or time period of the band that they hold above others. But I'm trying to strip this down to the quality of the "song" Not if I just liked the way it was mixed better. But the lyrics, lyrical delivery, melody, chorus, feeling etc...

I like the song. It's a good song. But it isn't a really good or great song. So my take on this comes from just my own opinion and experience with the bands music for the last 37 years or so.

I've always stated on this board that the band is a journey and hardcore fans like us roll with the changes and ups and downs that come, because there is something great in even the albums that we don't like as much overall. It goes for this song. There are some great things about this song. But overall for me, it's just a good song.

I'll attempt to do the same analysis of the songs from the last three records in comparison of what I think of the song at this point.

No Line -
This song is better than - Unknown Caller, Stand Up, Breathe, and I'm on the fence with Boots.

SOI -
This song is better than - California, SFS, Cedarwood, Reach, and I suppose Miracle, but it's close

SOE - Get Out, American Soul, The Showman, and I'd say it's about even with, but may edge out Best thing by a hair.

So for me it's lands around 23rd or so out of the 35 songs from the previous 3 albums.

Again, this is my opinion of course. That is largely shaped because I fell in love and stayed in love with this band, not for fun, strummy bops, but passionate, moving, often dark, or at least conflicted songs that showed both hope and inspiration, but also doubt and pain.

And I don't think many can argue this. Even the casual U2 fan/listener's favorite songs are

SBS, Streets, WOWY, Still Haven't Found, One, Vertigo, Pride, NYD, Beautiful Day, etc... Only BD really is a straight on Feel good song. Vertigo a great rocker.

When it comes to mega fans like ourselves. I would say that Achtung Baby, Joshua Tree, War, UF and then a bit of Zooropa, Pop and All That are our biggest faves. All of which hold some of their more serious and dark material.

I don't mind going on the ride, if the next album is a more light-hearted straight rock record. I'll be there. But it isn't my preference, even if this is a solidly good catchy song.

EDIT - It may also win over Blackout... ugh I'm not sure. I really like it, but I find it so hard to get over the Ned/Fred thing. really hard.

I agree with you with the exception of Reach Around, which is one of the best songs on SOI.