U2 by U2: another mistake of the 2000's?

[ImOuttaControl]

I agree, and that's kind of what I meant by humility, they knew it could have been much more but they just couldn't(like you said) get it to sound like what's in their heads. I think this is probably the majority of artist's thinking...

I write/record my own music, and I usually nitpick at the end result---so I see your point.

However, how much acclaim does a band need before they get over what looks like a self esteem issue? How many awards, sold out stadiums, classic albums, hit songs and fans does a band need before they finally say...."You know...even though we think this song isn't the song we heard in our heads, our fans love it...so it's great." I'm a high school teacher and what this reminds me of is the kid who has it all, who is extrememly gifted and has the world going for them, yet this kid cannot accept a compliment and constantly gloomy about things they've done that aren't "perfect."

What one person views is humility another person can view as self-loathing.

 

[God Part II]

What one person views is humility another person can view as self-loathing.

Exactly! Humility, self-loathing...call it what you will but, either way, it gets damn tiring...

 

[BVS]

The book itself is pretty good, IMO.

But like Aardvark said the massive price that was charged to the fans that bought the book immediately on release leaves a very, very sour taste in the mouth

Well being a finance person, you should know that book prices are driven by market and not the "writers"...

 

[BVS]

I write/record my own music, and I usually nitpick at the end result---so I see your point.

However, how much acclaim does a band need before they get over what looks like a self esteem issue? How many awards, sold out stadiums, classic albums, hit songs and fans does a band need before they finally say...."You know...even though we think this song isn't the song we heard in our heads, our fans love it...so it's great." I'm a high school teacher and what this reminds me of is the kid who has it all, who is extrememly gifted and has the world going for them, yet this kid cannot accept a compliment and constantly gloomy about things they've done that aren't "perfect."

What one person views is humility another person can view as self-loathing.

Well this will be a question that humanity asks until the end of time... Artist from the beginning of time have never been completely satisfied with their own works... To greet it with disdain or anger seems very odd.

 

[No spoken words]

Exactly! Humility, self-loathing...call it what you will but, either way, it gets damn tiring...

You know, the thing is, nobody puts a gun to your head and makes you read this stuff.

If someone told me, I don't know, that Mick Jagger is very self-effacing and his humility can be perceived as self-loathing, well, that would be news to me...it could not get tiring for me, cos I'm not at all exposed to it. I listen to Exile on Main Street and enjoy it and that's about it......

If you're tired of U2's humility, self-loathing, self-deprecation, whatever you want to term it, then why don't you simply avoid having access to such information?

 

[last unicorn]

What one person views is humility another person can view as self-loathing.

Be careful with psychological terms like this. Being critical of one's own work is a very natural, healthy and important thing for any artist. Self-loathing, as you call it, is a psychological PROBLEM. It makes me angry if people carelessly throw around terms like these. U2 being critical of their work has nothing to do with "self loathing". I would be more worried if they found everything they've ever done perfect.

 

[blueeyedgirl]

That bit is hardly news. It was mentioned in the Eamon Dunphy book (one of the few facts he got right).

Ah the Eamon Dunphy book, what a great bit of fiction.

I tend to agree with the view of the U2 by U2 being a great work of revisionism. I suppose it would be difficult for the members of U2 not to review their history with a great dollop of revisionism, but it does get a tad tiring. For my money, the best U2 books are the Hot Press compilations, and the Bill Graham book (who should have written their bio, not effin Dunphy).

 

[God Part II]

If you're tired of U2's humility, self-loathing, self-deprecation, whatever you want to term it, then why don't you simply avoid having access to such information?

Ah, great advice. If I don't like the truth of something, avoid it and create my own fiction to feel better about things. Religious man, are ya?

 

[God Part II]

Be careful with psychological terms like this. Being critical of one's own work is a very natural, healthy and important thing for any artist. Self-loathing, as you call it, is a psychological PROBLEM. It makes me angry if people carelessly throw around terms like these. U2 being critical of their work has nothing to do with "self loathing". I would be more worried if they found everything they've ever done perfect.

Suppose rather than "carelessly throwing around terms", some of us are legitimately of the opinion that U2 (rather irritatingly) straddles a real line between legitimate self-criticism and unwarranted self-loathing? What, just because it's U2, they can't have actual psychological problems? Hell, Bono has said many times that he needs a crowd of thousands cheering him nightly to feel normal; I'd say it's a given that they (that just about any public artist) have some level of psychological problems.

 

[last unicorn]

Yes, like any other human being.

Still I don't think "self-loathing" is part of that, it's a very strong term.

I am an artist myself and very critical of my work, I think that's a healthy and important attitude and has nothing to do with hating who you are. Of couse, sometimes it can be this way, but I don't see this with ANY member of U2.

And Bono is often being cheeky with comments.

 

[No spoken words]

Ah, great advice. If I don't like the truth of something, avoid it and create my own fiction to feel better about things. Religious man, are ya?

Oh! My apologies!!! I did not realize that you could synthesize the words of others into factual interpretations of their intent. My apologies, by all means, continue to read Bono's quotes then complain.....

On a serious note, how you could have read what I said then came up with this reply boggles the mind....but, then again, this area of the site is not exactly teeming with brain surgeons, now is it?

Carry on, kids.

 

[God Part II]

Oh! My apologies!!! I did not realize that you could synthesize the words of others into factual interpretations of their intent. My apologies, by all means, continue to read Bono's quotes then complain.....

On a serious note, how you could have read what I said then came up with this reply boggles the mind....but, then again, this area of the site is not exactly teeming with brain surgeons, now is it?

Carry on, kids.

You, in effect, said if I'm irritated by the truth of something, I should avoid it. Tell me how that interpretation is wrong, and while you're at it, tell me how that could be healthy.

 

[No spoken words]

You, in effect, said if I'm irritated by the truth of something, I should avoid it. Tell me how that interpretation is wrong, and while you're at it, tell me how that could be healthy.

You're missing the point. There's no "truth" here. Your interpretation of someone's words is not a fact, sorry. Also, we're not talking about some grand idea that you would be turning a blind eye/deaf ear to. You stated that listening to Bono/the band speak in less than glowing terms about their music was getting annoying. Are the words of the band that important to you that you must listen to every word, even if they serve to annoy you? Howard Stern annoys me, so, guess what? I don't listen to his show. Does that mean that I won't listen to John McCain during a debate, even though he and I have different political belief systems? No, it's important to me that I listen to him, it's not that important to listen to Bono babble.

Let's not take a micro view of an issue and blow it up and pretend that I'm espousing such a course of action for all things.....there are shades of grey in life.

 

[Bonochick]

Seems like the original poster took an awful lot of time to read the whole book if he bought it the moment it came out.

I bought mine not long after it had been out and still haven't finished it.

On a serious note, how you could have read what I said then came up with this reply boggles the mind....but, then again, this area of the site is not exactly teeming with brain surgeons, now is it?

You're posting here too, you know.

If you guys want to debate things and have different opinions, fine, but there is no need to start resulting to insulting words.

 

[No spoken words]

You're posting here too, you know.

Yes, yes I am. Nice place to visit, wouldn't want to live here.

Also, it's ok to not be a brain surgeon.....some people merely practice internal medicine, etc.

 

[God Part II]

No spoken words, I feel stupider for having participated in this conversation, but I'm compelled to make one final clarification: I said "If I have any one complaint (because, otherwise, I love it) it's that (along with the liner notes for the new remastered CD releases) U2 really seems to despise most of their catalog". See how that works? Drop the whole enjoyable and insightful book because of one irritating through-line? I don't think so. Chill...

 

[The Sad Punk]

Anyway, I think Adam should write a book.

 

[No spoken words]

No spoken words, I feel stupider for having participated in this conversation, but I'm compelled to make one final clarification: I said "If I have any one complaint (because, otherwise, I love it) it's that (along with the liner notes for the new remastered CD releases) U2 really seems to despise most of their catalog". See how that works? Drop the whole enjoyable and insightful book because of one irritating through-line? I don't think so. Chill...

Thank you for reminding me why I rarely, if ever, visit this neck of the woods.

 

[coolian2]

He's taken his angry pills.

 

[Edge_Orchestra]

I've come to the conclusion that I respectfully disagree with "ImOuttaControl"s view on "U2 By U2".

Best U2 books? There are three that are fantastic.

1. At The End Of The World by Bill Flanagan. (Great snapshot of the AB sessions through to the end of the Zoo tours)
2. U2 & i - by Anton Corbijn. (Thier the best photos by thier best photographer)
3. U2 by U2: Great insight and stories by the band, management and friends close to the band, regardless of "ImOuttaControl"s view.

 

[BGD75]

Everyone has their own opinions and expectations. It's impossible for every fan to LOVE every song, every video or for that matter, every book. I personally, loved it - I finished reading it in few days - couldn't put it down - I found it very interesting, especially the childhood years. There were times I laughed out loud because the way they talked about certain things was quite funny. "Is Dick in the band?"

 

[Edge_Orchestra]

Everyone has their own opinions and expectations. It's impossible for every fan to LOVE every song, every video or for that matter, every book. I personally, loved it - I finished reading it in few days - couldn't put it down - I found it very interesting, especially the childhood years. There were times I laughed out loud because the way they talked about certain things was quite funny. "Is Dick in the band?"

I laughed at a number of things... the "Is Dick In The Band" line was one that made me laugh out loud too. Didn't he punch one of them when they let him go?

I think the book is great - not perfect but - pretty great. It is good to hear them tell things from thier own experiences or memories of said experiences!

...plus the pics of Edge with 'baby' Sian and Morliegh with 'baby' Sian, are cute and heartwarming. To us, they are a favorite band and entertainers and people we look up to, in some cases. But it was heartwarming to see that very normal 'family' moment.

 

[Loar]

Got it for $15 at a used bookstore.

It's a coffee table book, and when I'm bored and have nothing better to do, sometimes I read bits and pieces out of it.

If you want a good, solid book about U2 (at least, up through Zooropa), read Flanagan's book. This one is bubble gum, and I knew most of the stuff in it anyway, but it's still fun to read.

 

[u2search]

I've read it twice and I love it. You just need to take it as it is. For other people's insights, there are other books (like U2 Show as mentioned earlier). Hopefully, one day, we'll see a thoroughly researched independent book based on both band members' and other peoples views but that might take a while. I'd love to hear the take of the ones that worked with them end didn't like them or their music or their methods, just to have a more complete picture. But this book is - by design - the book that tells the story the way they want the world to see it. I think it's partly written to encourage young bands and artists to continue and try: If we could do it, so can you. Although I found it very discouraging, all the trouble you apparently have to go through, but then I'm no artist

On another note, for Dutch fans: if you buy No Line on the Horizon at the Free Record Shop you get a free copy of U2 by U2 with the album. Pocket edition in English with a few photographs. If you pre order you get the book instantly, it's already in the shops.

 

[lauramullen]

I read it once. I have 2 copies, but am going to read it again. Most of it I read in the line at the signing. This will always be my top U2 book for obvious reasons.

 

[KJ Collins]

I'm in the middle of reading it. Well, I'm not reading it in any particular order. The one thing that bothers me is how the band looks at the whole Pop/Popmart era as one big negative. I know there were rough times, but when you have live songs as good as Discotheque, Please and HMTM... you really should play them live.

I saw the first show of the Elevation Tour in Florida and before Discotheque, Bono more or less apologized for that entire period. No need for apologies, B-Man, your fans loved that period too. Please, please, pleeeeeeease, play more songs from it.

 

[cdirani]

I got the pocket book version of U2 By U2 today at my local bookstore. It's the UK version. I simply loved they released it that format because my hardback regular cover proved to be impossble to be read...in the bathroom Now seriously, as much as I tried I couldn't read the original version back-to-back and now I'm simply eating the pages! It's a fantastic book and I think it was cool to release it to celebrate the 30 years of the band.

 

[bonocomet]

I got the pocket book version of U2 By U2 today at my local bookstore. It's the UK version. I simply loved they released it that format because my hardback regular cover proved to be impossble to be read...in the bathroom Now seriously, as much as I tried I couldn't read the original version back-to-back and now I'm simply eating the pages! It's a fantastic book and I think it was cool to release it to celebrate the 30 years of the band.

So is that version all the same text as the original release except without all of the photos on all the pages? Because if so... I think I would read it much easier too. I haven't been able to read the first one yet, pictures have been too distracting!

 

[Edge_Orchestra]

Anyway, I think Adam should write a book.

That'd be great idea. And he could call it: "Tea Time with Adam Clayton".

 

[EdgeIsTooSexy]

It was pretty good, but its not one of my favorites.