Bono In Conversation

[blueeyedgirl]

And the reason U2 have lasted so long is that there are people like Larry, who couldn't give a fuck, to balance it out!

 

[biff]

Firstly, I'll go beat up Financeguy. I know which thread he lives in.

The actual breakup of a marriage isn't art, no. I just find it odd that the only album that features profound lyrics, to me, is the one recorded when The Edge was experiencing heavy personal issues. Why is this? Did The Edge write some of the lyrics? Does Bono only experience pain through very close friends (as well as himself)? To me a poet is a person who has empathy and feels many situations.

As for personal pain of Bonos, Sometimes You Can't Make It On Your Own is full of cliches. Nothing profoud here.



Stuck in a Moment is a deeper but its completely missing on understanding of the situation. I know we disagree on this and thats fine. I feel if you say "pull yourself together" to a suicidal person they are likely to pull a punch or jump off the edge.

Slide Away is another one thats not empathetic



We could pick through the lyrics on the latest album. Again, nothing profound there.

Or another album. I'm curious as to which songs you find intriguing.

PS What do you teach? This is where you come out and say you teach literature isn't it.

Just a quick answer here. I don't agree that Achtung is the only album with "profound" lyrics, but as to why they are perhaps the most wrenching lyrics? I don't think that's too hard to understand. Two of the lyricist's closest friends were going through bitter, messy divorces. And let's not forget that the band as well, for a time, seemed to be on the brink of a "divorce".

As to the rest, there are many songs from many albums, including a lot off Zooropa and Pop, as well as Joshua Tree. Off the latest album, I am intrigued and/or moved by Crumbs, One Step Closer, Original, Fast Cars (as well as the unreleased Smile and Mercy).
Remember (I know I'm stating the obvious) that lyrics are not poetry; they are meant to be sung, and in Bono's case are usually created after the music. He adds the melodies and the words to complete the music. In Bono's case, through the creative process, the words and the melodies are so entwined that it's hard to view one or other in isolation. They form a creative and often very beautiful whole, and that is what creates the emotional impact.

(And yes, I for many years taught literature at University and college. But in recent years I have veered off in a somewhat different direction, and coordinate and occasionally teach in a department that delivers ESL, EAP and ESP. I specialize now in the area of language assessment.)

 

[beli]

Remember (I know I'm stating the obvious) that lyrics are not poetry; they are meant to be sung, and in Bono's case are usually created after the music. He adds the melodies and the words to complete the music. In Bono's case, through the creative process, the words and the melodies are so entwined that it's hard to view one or other in isolation. They form a creative and often very beautiful whole, and that is what creates the emotional impact.

I agree with you. And thats an excellent description.

Financeguy says:

Hmmm. I may have mis-spoken in saying it was an exact "lifting".

Per the John Waters book "Race of Angels - Ireland and the Genesis of U2", page 137:-

" 'The wind will crack in wintertime/This bomb-blast/No spoken words....just a scream/Tonight we build a bridge across the sea and land........'. This, as he [refering to Bono] says, is not American folk or blues. 'The words are much more influenced by poets like Heaney or Kavanagh than, say, Woddy Guthrie' "

You are correct on calling that one.

Ill look up the lyrics to the songs you mentioned in the morning. Dunno about you but Im enjoying this discussion.

 

[biff]

Me too. But what the heck are you doing up in the middle of the night? Get to sleep, woman!

 

[biff]

Hi again Beli! I was having some further thoughts whilst preparing dinner (veal parmegianno ).

Re: your comments on Sometimes. I believe that in writing, the type of language selected must be true to and support the theme or subject. Writing doesn't need to be all tortured metaphors to be effective and moving. In this case, the plain, simple language is well-chosen and reflects its subject. Bob Hewson was a blunt and direct man by all accounts, and flowery language of any kind would ring false. The plain, everyday language is, to me, all the more painful, because it reflects the real hurt felt by the unloved son. The line "I know that we don't talk/Can you hear me when I sing/You're the reason I sing" sounds very real to me, like something actually said, and it's all the more moving for this reason. Those lines, combined with the soaring operatic note, are a great creative moment, in my opinion, and very rich in feeling.

 

[beli]

Lots of random thoughts at the end of a very long day.

Beautiful, simple songs.

1) I agree that songs don't have to be poetry, or tortured. Sometimes You Can't Make It On Your Own reminds me of Neil Diamond's song Morningside.

Morningside
The old man died
And no one cried
They simply turned away
And when he died
He left a table made of nails and pride
And with his hands he carved these words inside
For my children

Morning light
Morning bright
I spent the night
With dreams that make you weep
Morning time
Wash away the sadness from these eyes of mine
For I recall the words the old man signed
For my children

And the legs were shaped with his hands
And the top made of oaken wood
And the children sat around this table
Touched with their laughter
Ah, and that was good

Morningside
An old man died
And no one cried
He surely died alone
And truth is sad
For not a child would claim the gift he had
The words he carved became his epitath
For my children

Beautiful. Simple. From a different perspective to Sometimes but it touches me deeply. I often weep to this song. Sometimes doesn't cause me to weep, cry, anything.

2) George Michael (humour me, please) "You Have Been Loved"

She takes the back road and the lane
past the school that has not changed
in all this time
she thinks of when the boy was young
all the battles she had won
just to give him life

that man
she loved that man
for all his life
but now we meet to take him flowers
and only god knows why

for what's the use in pressing palms
when children fade in mother's arms
it's a cruel world
we've so much to lose
and what we have to learn, we rarely choose

so if it's god who took her son
he cannot be the one living in her mind

take care my love, she said
don't think that god is dead
take care my love, she said

you have been loved

if I was weak, forgive me
but I was terrified
you brushed my eyes with angels wings, full of love
the kind that makes devils cry

so these days
my life has changed
and I'll be fine
but she just sits and counts the hours
searching for her crime

for what's the use in pressing palms
if you won't keep such love from harm
it's a cruel world
you've so much to prove

and heaven help the ones who wait for you

well I've no daughters, I've no sons
guess I'm the only one
living in my life

take care my love, he said
don't think that God is dead
take care my love, he said

you have been loved

Beautiful. Simple. Causes me to weep.

 

[beli]

Cliches, Stereotypes, Old Wives Tales

3) Sissor Sisters "Mary" contains cliches but they hit the right spot with me.

I love the tone that's in your laugh
Gasping for an extra breath
Waiting for the time to pass
I believe in days ahead
Don't spend another night alone
Cross and wishing you were dead.

Mary, you shouldn't let 'em make you mad
You hold the best you can
And Mary, after all the pain is gone
I'm always gonna live to be your man.

I've had it easy now you see
When I'm down you're always there
Standing by to comfort me
Someday we'll go round the world
I'll make the journey so sublime
I know you're not a travelin' girl.

Mary, you shouldn't let 'em make you mad
You hold the best you can
And Mary, after all the pain is gone
I'm always gonna live to be your man.

Cause I'd give everything I have
Forget all the things that bring me joy
If you could have one day
Pure and simple happiness
Until that moment comes
I'll be here where I've always been
I'm gonna be your friend
Until the day I die.

Mary, you shouldn't let 'em make you mad
You hold the best you can
And Mary, after all the pain is gone
I'm always gonna live to be your man.

(hold on....)

Bono uses (brilliant English, I'm tired ) many expressions, and cliches in his songs. And it irritates the crap out of me. I'm not sure why I can listen to other singers sing cliches and it not bother me but when Bono does it rubs me up the wrong way. I'm thinking I feel ( ) that Bono sings like hes the first person to ever utter the words or the concept and, well hes not. Yep, I think thats what bothers me.

I still havent reread the lyrics of the songs you listed. My apologies. I will try again tomorrow, family permitting.

"I don't want to be so deep that people have to drown to relate to me." -Bono

"I run away from writing words...words are scary." -Bono


Not that means Bono isn't deep......

Rambling, and the pork is burning. Back tomorrow

 

[Aardvark747]

I treated myself to this, whilst I was buying my old man a father's day gift. 2 hardbacks for £25.00....

Anyway, it's a great read so far. Bono mentions Monty Python!!

Cant wait to read the rest now!

 

[MacPhistoPT]

I'm on page 90 and so far so good I also bought U2 Show and I'm looking for The Story behind every song

 

[beli]

Belfast Newsletter: Bono was 'inches' from bomb death

BONO'S biographer has branded him a "magician and cold calculator" who is able to "watch himself doing a trick in a very cold way".

French journalist Michka Assayas, who has known U2 since he first arrived to interview the then small-time Irish band in London in 1980, was in Dublin last night for the first of the band's three homecoming concerts.

He also told me that the band's front-man survives the pressures of international celebrity, precisely because of his ability to detach himself from his rock persona.

He said: "I wouldn't say he has no emotions. He is extremely cold, in a way. He is very objective. He is really aware of who 'Bono' is. He sees himself in the third person."

Having hung out with the band, inner
circle and entourage for two and a half decades, the writer who was paid a £150,000 advance for the book says that when he gets to speak to Bono, he is still "extremely warm, extremely simple. It feels like 25 years ago."

This is the similar to what I was refering to in my tactician comments. Its interesting to now hear Michkas opinion of Bono.

Anyway, I really should be reading those lyrics......

 

[blueeyedgirl]

That's very interesting to read. I watched Denton's interview with Alice Cooper on Monday and Alice was very clear that there are very different people named Alice: There is the rock star "Alice" who is on stage, chopping his head off and spitting fake blood, there is "Alice" who does interviews etc, and there is "me" the guy at home who is a Republican, is pro-Iran war, and plays golf.

Bono has probably developed three separate entities as well. He's definitely not the "real Bono" when doing interviews anymore.

 

[the soul waits]

Now this is an intriguing comment by Mischka. I'm struck by the fact that he says that Bono can appear cold, yet is warm when he's interviewing him.

Also, I wonder if Edge, Adam and Larry get to see the other persona's as well and what they think to themselves when they see Bono acting in rockstar-mode.

 

[sallycinnamon78]

What you see is exactly what you get.

HORSESHIT.

Ive nearly finished the book. I believe Bono has no clue about depression. Perhaps hes one of these 'keep all the plates spinning so I dont have to deal with it' types. Either way he is insensitive to this issue.

You know something? This reminds me of a comment Noel Gallagher once made. He was talking about 'Don't Look Back In Anger'.

Noel being Noel, he went off on a huge rant. Banging on about how much he detested people who permanently hark back to the past, it's gone, etc; he also had a few choice words to say about depression. He did have a point, although his manner was somewhat unrealistic and insensitive. His view seems similar to B's in its extremity.

As I listened to the interview, it became blatantly obvious why these traits irked Noel so much. He hates the part of himself that can't let go of the past. It is a characteristic he possesses in abundance, and it gets to him. So he blocks it out by having no patience with it whatsoever.

That sounds like amateur psychology on my part, and I freely admit that it is. Regardless, if you look at Noel's lyrics and read/listen to other interviews he's done, it's easy to see what his problem is. Himself.
Literally a case of all that you can't leave behind.

So my question is, does the same apply to B?

 

[sallycinnamon78]

LOL, no fear of that. They're all to busy in PLEBA talking about his butt! (Meow.)

Oh no they aren't *pantomime style*.

It is possible to admire Bono - including his butt, - and find the man attractive, without being a complete wet dishrag and blindly buying into every damn thing the man says.

Thanks, Beli.
It's quite funny how carefull you are with your wording. It shouldn't be such a big deal to comment on Bono in a less than admiring way-after all, he's human.
Noone will deny that he's a clever businessman.

Very true, on both counts, IMO.

 

[verte76]

Oh no they aren't *pantomime style*.

It is possible to admire Bono - including his butt, - and find the man attractive, without being a complete wet dishrag and blindly buying into every damn thing the man says.

Absolutely. I have many Bono pix in a Snapfish account and don't blindly buy into everything the guy says. I don't think he wants that in the first place.

 

[blueeyedgirl]

Also, I wonder if Edge, Adam and Larry get to see the other persona's as well and what they think to themselves when they see Bono acting in rockstar-mode.

I was rereading some clippings from the 80s a while ago and Edge said something along the lines that Bono would relate a story about an event happening to himself/the band/etc and after a while he would realise that Bono wasn't telling the story as it happened. Edge said he was at first alarmed but then realised the facts may not have been as it happened but as long as the basic "story" was there, it didn't matter. And often it sounded better, funnier etc.

I also remember stories about Bob Hewson being pissed off cos Bono would say that he came from the dark streets of Ballymun, a "real rough part of town", kinda he was a total bum, when he had a very middle class upbringing. (Why say you're middle class when working class has more street cred? )

 

[the soul waits]

I was rereading some clippings from the 80s a while ago and Edge said something along the lines that Bono would relate a story about an event happening to himself/the band/etc and after a while he would realise that Bono wasn't telling the story as it happened. Edge said he was at first alarmed but then realised the facts may not have been as it happened but as long as the basic "story" was there, it didn't matter. And often it sounded better, funnier etc.

I also remember stories about Bob Hewson being pissed off cos Bono would say that he came from the dark streets of Ballymun, a "real rough part of town", kinda he was a total bum, when he had a very middle class upbringing. (Why say you're middle class when working class has more street cred? )

LOL, Bono must be "dreaming out loud" sometimes then.
I see what you mean, I can totally see him getting carried away like that.

 

[sallycinnamon78]

Yeah. Agreed.

 

[imogen]

Never let the truth get in the way of a good story! lol

Someone a couple of pages back asked what more people wanted him to reveal..... Well, I can obviously only speak for myself....

I would liked to have heard more about the band, his family life, where he sees his future direction, what his dreams are now....

I know it is not his right to impart information about others, and I think this is where he often stopped short. When Ali said about his birthday, the one in the swimming pool..... it did seem that she was protesting him telling the story, so he let her tell it the way she wanted it.

I just thought that the book should have been more about Bono, the man, not Bono, the performer. Does that make sense?

I think that if you are interested enough to buy the book, you probably already knew most of the stuff that was in it.

I personally found Killing Bono a more interesting book about Bono in many ways.

 

[aislinn]

I got this book for my birthday and really enjoyed reading it.

That being said, I came away with the feeling that a lot of what Bono says is crap. And also that most of it is part of a very carefully crafted image. Now, I'm not some naive little girl that fell off the turnip truck yesterday...but I do like to give people the benefit of the doubt. After reading this book, I found myself feeling conflicted because while I felt he'd said a lot, it still was like he hadn't revealed anything. He's so good at talking in circles; he can talk forever and not say a word, if that makes any sense. So to me, a lot of this book was rehashed material and Bono's own personal Spin Zone book.

Of course, I tried to read between the lines because

a) I'm nosy like that
b) I look at almost everything as needing to be figured out and analyzed--this can be quite annoying sometimes, especially to other people
c) I believe there is much more going on with Bono than what he's chosen to reveal in this book. At least, I really, really hope so.

 

[MissMoo]

I think whatever "spin" is going on is due to Bono needing to have a life that is not shared with the world. No matter what people think about his lack of empathy for depression, I have met the man several times and I can tell you that he may be private about his private life, but he is the most compassionate and considerate person I have ever met, unless you cross the line and push and push him (I've seen people do it too). In that case he may lose his temper, but if it happens he feels really bad about it, if it were me I would think the person had crossed the line and deserved it. So, perhaps that is the thing about Bono he exists in two realms, dreamer and businessman, calculated performer and openhearted idealist. Having had him trust me when we met I do think he is a sincere and honest individual. If he hides it's to protect himself from being hurt by those who are dishonest. In other words I think he doesn't entirely trust himself not to be taken in by people who are dishonest or to react negatively when he shouldn't. And I do think part of his view on depression has to do with going through the experience himself and that what worked for him was to stop all the navel gazing and look to help others IMO.

 

[MissMoo]

The other thing is that he will laugh when you point out his weaknesses. That is a wonderful trait in a human being.

 

[Max_theHitman]

I bought this book a few weeks ago, and I just finished reading it last week.
It is HIGHLY recommended for anyone with interest into the private life and thoughts of U2 and specially the man doing ALL the talking in the book...Mr.Bono.
Very easy reading and very interesting.

BUY IT...it´s a cheap paperback book

 

[The Disciple]

Bought it last week, gave up on trying 2 read it in bits @ stops in the bookstore... like it. Until The End of The World is better...

 

[Total U2 Nut]

What's it called, I just bought Bono on Bono off www.play.com - hopefully it should come tomorrow/day after, I can't wait

 

[financeguy]

Also, I Googled the Heaney reference, and the only actual match was the quote from Financeguy. If Bono used an exact quote from Heaney, the Nobel prize winner, it wouldn't have been stealing and hoping no one would notice. It would have been an homage, as it was with Bukowski and Schwartz. (But I can find no Heaney poem with those lines.)

Anyway, anon!

Shit I really hate it when the Internet catches me out on my bullshit statements, maybe Bono will sue me now (just kidding)

But yeah, as Beli pointed out I mis-spoke a little, and subsequently realised my mistake, in claiming that Bono 'lifted' a line from Heaney, in fact he was merely INFLUENCED by certain poets like Heaney and WB Yeats in his lyric writings on occasions -in that vein, Bonosgirl84 just recently pointed out an interesting connection between a poem by Yeats and the lyrics to 'Promenade'. I think the Yeats influence was particularly evident during the Unforgettable Fire period.

I often think that many of the great poets of yesteryear - perhaps if they were alive today, they would be in rock bands, and most of them would probably be struggling to get a record contract.

Anyway, as regards the book itself, I think it lives up to its billing - 'Conversations with Bono' - that's what it claims to be, and that's what it is. Personally I would liked to have heard a little bit more on the lyric writing process, Bono's influences - that kind of stuff - although to be fair that ground was covered fairly extensively in the John Waters' book on U2.

 

[financeguy]

One other thing, and it's probably the only thing in that book that blew my mind, the stuff about Bono becoming friends with that elderly Italian painter. That stuff was incredibly interesting, and unexpected.

 

[Total U2 Nut]

The books okay, but Bono really waffles on alot.....

 

[biff]

One other thing, and it's probably the only thing in that book that blew my mind, the stuff about Bono becoming friends with that elderly Italian painter. That stuff was incredibly interesting, and unexpected.

Yes, I found that fascinating as well. When Balthus (who was French, sorry) died, I was astonished to learn that Bono had sung at his funeral. He (Balthus) had a very mixed reputation. Was he the world's greatest living painter? And/ Or was he the world's most controversial painter? He was as famous as he was infamous. His many pictures of pubescent girls (which Bono mentions in that book) were the subject of much controversy, and were notorious for their perceived creepiness. Many of his paintings were seen as sinister, and one in particular, The Guitar Lesson, was so disturbing it hasn't been displayed in decades. I would love to know more about the connection between those two men. How did they meet, and what did they really have in common? Once again, this book is merely tantalizing, and Bono leaves us guessing. What a frustrating book!

 

[11o´clock]

Perhaps he means that he sees life as very precious. And the fact that he's personally seen so many just fighting to live... it makes it difficult for him to understand why someone would want to throw it away.


I don't think he has a lack of empathy for depressed people...but that's just how I interpret it.

That´s what I´ve understood too.
There are many people who´s struggle for live, have very little food, etc., and the ones who have all these opportunities think of taking their own lives ....