why dont you like Rattle and Hum?

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silverfish

The Fly
Joined
Jan 19, 2009
Messages
65
Ok - this is baffling. On the album ranking thread so many people gave Rattle and Hum quite a low rank. I just want to know what are the reasons? To me this is a masterpiece album - one that gave us Angel of Harlem, God Pt 2 and All I want is you. :up:

So please I really want to understand the reasons why it received such a low rank by some people.
 
#1 It DIDN'T give us Bullet. That was on Joshua Tree first.

But I think it's a great album! Under-rated on these boards. And Lovetown was an amazing tour!

yeah I edited out Bullet - I wrote to soon (I was thinking God pt 2 actually)
 
Wrong sub-forum...

I like R&H, but I think it gets downplayed due to the odd mix-match of live and studio songs... It just doesn't really work as an album.
 
Easily my least favourite.

* The mix between live and studio tracks didn't come off too well.
* Took their obession with America a little too far. Seems kind of self-indulgent with the whole Dylan, Billie and BB King thing happening.
* Two of the few U2 songs I don't like at all: God Part II and Love Rescue Me
* Hawkmoon 269 aint all that great for me and is a little too long.
* Just doesn't click with me much :|
* All I Want Is You has always struck me as over rated

I still enjoy the album, but I just find it awkward and avoidable when I look at my U2 shelf to select an album. Heartland is it's saving grace.
 
I agree with SilverFish -- I love R&H and I voted in into my top five. Most of the live cuts (except 'Helter Skelter') are more-or-less forgettable, in my opinion, but I love messy, sprawling records. In fact, I think R&H hangs together conceptually rather better than several U2 albums.

The studio cuts on R&H are amazing and easily could have been compiled into U2's third or fourth greatest album (I mean now, not then). But there are several factors working against it on a forum such as this:
-- people here seem to like linear, tight albums
-- it's overshadowed by The Joshua Tree
-- some people still remember the backlash against it and can't listen to it on purely musical terms; likewise, some people see it as a movie soundtrack more than an LP
-- the live cuts don't mix in well

For me, I would say the first four cuts on R&H are easily the most exciting such in U2's history.
 
"Bad" wasn't on there.:angry: That IMO is the best version of Bad ever. I don't hate R&H but it does seem a bit strange going from live tracks to studio tracks. I do love When Love Comes To Town. Good song and fun to sing along to even if you're like me and stink at singing!:lol:
 
Expanding on why I don't like R&H, in my opinion (this will be controversial), they were humoring types of music that they had kind of ignored for most of their life, putting on a show of false modesty towards music that they knew they could be better than (and had, and did, and still do).
 
I love RAH's studio material for the most part. Heartland is one of my three favourite U2 songs. If it were an exclusively studio album, including other tracks from the era like Wild Irish Rose and She's A Mystery To Me, it'd be in my top five, easily.

But what the band released is an incohesive mess rejoicing in the undeserved title of "album". I cannot fathom why they thought it was a good idea tossing live material in amongst studio tracks, especially not the live material they chose.
 
I love RAH's studio material for the most part. Heartland is one of my three favourite U2 songs. If it were an exclusively studio album, including other tracks from the era like Wild Irish Rose and She's A Mystery To Me, it'd be in my top five, easily.

But what the band released is an incohesive mess rejoicing in the undeserved title of "album". I cannot fathom why they thought it was a good idea tossing live material in amongst studio tracks, especially not the live material they chose.


I agree. Although I do have to give props to R&H for it was this album that introduced me to U2.

If the album was; the studio songs, plus the b-sides, and the two you mention it may actually be their best album...


Dream line up:

Hawkmoon 269
She's a Mystery to Me
Van Diemen's Land
Desire
Halleliuah Here She Comes
Angel of Harlem
Love Rescue Me
When Love Comes to Town
Heartland
God Part II
A Room at the Heartbreak Hotel
All I Want is You
 
Honestly though.... I listened to the album AS IS over and over again back in the day....on cassette walkman, without skipping tracks..... however it may feel in 2009.....I can't imagine changing a thing! (Except taking out the horns from Angel of Harlem. Hated that song until I heard it live.)
 
How is playing tribute being "self indulgent"?

From a lot of the interviews I've read from the era, particularly from Bono, it seems he was getting a little bit obsessed with how big they were and how they were commanding all this attention from these big names in music. A lot of name-dropping. Seemed as if he wanted at one stage to turn the album into an album featuring all these big names, like Dylan and Orbison etc.

I would have found it frustrating at the time personally. I would've been like, just make music, who cares about these other people. You're the kings of the world at the moment. Something all very try-hard about the whole era from my perspective. God Part 2 especially, this attitude in the lyrics that just comes across as false in my opinion. They've done the whole "love will overcome" thing much better. Doubt Lennon would've liked it

Angel Of Harlem was properly a tribute of course and was done well.

I dunno, it seemed very orientated towards a particular American audience. One that I am not really in touch with, so I was never gonna like it as much. I much prefer the "outsider looking in" kind of thing like a Heartland or a Bullet The Blue Sky.
 
The live tracks, pure and simply are the reason, they're very foegettable. The studio tracks other than possibly love rescue me, are brilliant, should have been a great album. I remember being a very disappointed 14 year old when this came out, but bit by bit it grew on me.
 
Hmm

I cannot fathom why they thought it was a good idea tossing live material in amongst studio tracks, especially not the live material they chose.

Agree with your points, and I think I have an answer to this question: Adam (I think) states in U2 By U2 that it was originally going to be a live album (which would have been the more logical first step) as a soundtrack with the film, and they were going to throw in a few studio tracks. But either after the Dublin sessions or after they got to L.A., they had such a glut of good new material that they ended up wanting to use it and compiling a double set. Adam says with some surprise in the book something about the 9 new songs pretty much adding up to a whole new studio album.

However, this still begs the question of why they didn't just release two separate LPs (one live, one studio). And I think I know the answer. The band as a whole -- or perhaps just Bono, who was the driving force behind the Americana/pseudo-blues thing -- wanted to lighten the burden of the "follow-up to The Joshua Tree" thing by releasing a bootleg-like album that would be all over the place in its diversity and thus hard to pin down. (This is somewhat akin to what Bob Dylan did with Self Portrait in 1970, except U2's release is actually good music.) I really think they intentionally wanted to put out as "slapdash" (in appearance) an album as they could in order to ward off expectations and serious critical analysis. (Of course, being U2, they couldn't really pull that off by including speeches about Apartheid and guest appearances by the rock hall of fame.)


From a lot of the interviews I've read from the era, particularly from Bono, it seems he was getting a little bit obsessed with how big they were and how they were commanding all this attention from these big names in music. A lot of name-dropping. Seemed as if he wanted at one stage to turn the album into an album featuring all these big names, like Dylan and Orbison etc.

Yeah, that's what I meant by the contradiction described above. For example, although I am a huge fan of "Love Rescue Me" (it's one of my favorites on this record -- can't fathom why y'all hate it), I do believe that they could have recorded a much better version -- and probably wanted to -- but because of the surprise, off-the-cuff appearance of Dylan in the studio to supply the odd lyric, some keyboards, and some (very rough) backing vocals, I'm sure they felt duty-bound to include that version of the track. I mean, they couldn't not have a guest-appearance on their album... but at the same time, they were trying to present the package like it was all for a bit of fun. The message was confusing.

God Part 2 especially, this attitude in the lyrics that just comes across as false in my opinion. They've done the whole "love will overcome" thing much better. Doubt Lennon would've liked it.

I love 'God Part II' and I do think Lennon would have been tickled (being Lennon, though, he would have loved U2 one day and hated them the next). However, it was quite incredibly pretentious -- no matter their intention to appear as 'fans' -- to write a clearly-intended sequel to Plastic One Band's epic "God", and then not expect to be roasted over the coals for it.


I dunno, it seemed very orientated towards a particular American audience. One that I am not really in touch with, so I was never gonna like it as much.

Fair enough. I love Americana/blues-derived stuff, and I think U2 pulled it off incredibly well musically -- mainly due to Bono's heroic vocals in this period -- but I can see how it would turn some people off. The irony of Rattle & Hum is that the it had its biggest success and its biggest failure in the USA. I think, today, it remains the single biggest inspiration of the U2-haters of the world.
 
To me, R&H isn't really an album. It's got good songs on it yes, but it's not an album. It's more a couple of live and studio tracks thrown together on a cd.
 
I'm fine with Rattle and Hum the way it is. If it had been praised by everyone, we may never have been graced with Achtung Baby.
 
it was the most pretentious point of time in the band's history (at that time) and it really turned me off. there was a change in Bono from the spring of 1987 to the fall and that turned me off as well. The video for Where The Streets Have No Name was a ripoff of the Beatles rooftop concert.

I never bought the album and never went to the movie. I own the CD and the DVD now for completist reasons but rarely listen or watch because I remember how turned off I was by the band at that point in time.

Looking back now, that band wasn't even close to as pretentious as that whole Pop thing so I have come to terms with Rattle and Hum, but I doubt I'll ever have the love for it like I do for the albums released before it and Achtung Baby.
 
I love 'God Part II' and I do think Lennon would have been tickled (being Lennon, though, he would have loved U2 one day and hated them the next). However, it was quite incredibly pretentious -- no matter their intention to appear as 'fans' -- to write a clearly-intended sequel to Plastic One Band's epic "God", and then not expect to be roasted over the coals for it.

forget about The Fly, forget about Discotheque, forget about Vertigo, THIS is THEE U2 guitar riff. you all just dont know it. :lol:

:rockon:
 
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