Too much claw, not enough body! - Complaints about the setlist

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I went to a Neil Young concert recently and I am a very casual Neil Young fan (own one album, and only familar with another 3 or 4 songs). As luck would have it, he was in crowd pleasing mood and played all the 'big' songs and nothing obscure.

However, I would have been mildly pissed off if he had decided to play just new stuff, or mainly obscure stuff, or an acoustic only acoustic set (as apparently he sometimes does). On the other hand, the diehard fan is probably delighted when he does this.

This is even more valid in respect of U2, as they play to bigger audiences, there are people at U2 gigs that have only one or two U2 albums, like me at Neil Young, there are probably people that own no U2 albums but still go to the occasional concert because they like the Beautiful Day single, or SBS, or because their friends are going, or because they want to abuse Bono.

This was borne out at Croker, the big anthemic songs got the best receptions, the likes of Ultra Violet and even MoS for that matter got more muted receptions. And UV isn't even all that obscure, it wasn't a single but it was on one of their top selling albums and was played live regularly in the early 1990s.

Until U2 decide to specifically play shows for a select audience, us hardcore fans will have to settle for 'crowd pleasing' shows with the occasional obscure song, like it or loathe it.

And if U2 did actually decide to play for select audiences, then how are they going to select them? The current hassles or arguments that sometimes occur in 'the Pit' over placings would seem a fond memory in comparison.
 
why doesn't U2, at this stage of their career, mix in several small club dates during a world tour in select cities? Tickets would be so hard to get it would ensure it would be only diehards.

(I'm not really here in this thread, for the record. I am a figment of your imagination.)

But to answer this, my guess is that they know there would be serious bloodshed spilled among fans in the fight for tickets to small club shows.
 
who cares though? Honestly, at the end of the day, if he wants to play something why can't he? He's just as much a prisoner now because that's what people expect, if he were to do a "greatest hits" tour with static setlists he would be crucified.

Well thats going on the assumption of course that everyone makes with U2, that they're just gritting their collective teeth when they play the hits. I don't buy it.

Personally, the only way I'm going to plunk down $ to see Springsteen is if he IS doing a greatest hits tour and tickets are $100 or less. The critics can crucify him all they want. I just want to relive ages, oh, 10 - 20 again. :sad:
 
They used to challenge the audience, and themselves...what happened?

I think that U2 have a skewed view of their fan base and think that the crowds are dominated by casual fans, ie those that have the 80-90 and listen to the radio. They don't realize that they are not the kind of band that people are casual about, and that if someone is paying $100 + for a ticket they are most likely pretty into the band and like (almost) all the albums and have deep knowledge of them. Every album has sold millions of copies. They've sold over 100 million albums, dammnit.

I don't care what songs they play - hell, they could play all of Bomb and Leave Behind and I wouldn't care because it would be a surprise. Their catalogue is so large, varied and successful (in terms of sales) that they could play anything and people would be happy.
 
Do you honestly think Bruce attracts as many casual fans as U2?

The sets weren't any more daring than what they are doing now.

Numb and Lemon were hits back then from their latest release :huh:

Well Bruce sells out similar stadia in Europe- Nou Camp, San Siro etc so I can only go on that. And I wouldn't agree with your comparison either- the Sydney setlist had 8 AB songs and 5 Zooropa songs- for the Australians 13 "new" songs (we can argue about the newness of AB at that point, I know)- no SHF, no SBS, no AIWIY, no Desire, no WLCTT and no 40, their one time closer.
 
Well yes, but they didn't play those songs regularly on the summer leg in '93, which suggested they didn't know how they would translate despite the fact the album was out. Their subsequent appearance was then, a little more daring than you might first think.

Well, the album wasn't out til July, and U2 were perhaps too busy at that point to rehearse them? I dunno, I've been re-reading U2 At the End of the World, things were crazy for them.

interesting stat from wiki:
"Of the 157 shows the band played during the Zoo TV Tour, approximately 30 of them were after the release of Zooropa."

it's a shame most of those Zooropa songs only got played for 30 or less shows then...
 
They used to challenge the audience, and themselves...what happened?

I think that U2 have a skewed view of their fan base and think that the crowds are dominated by casual fans, ie those that have the 80-90 and listen to the radio. They don't realize that they are not the kind of band that people are casual about, and that if someone is paying $100 + for a ticket they are most likely pretty into the band and like (almost) all the albums and have deep knowledge of them. Every album has sold millions of copies. They've sold over 100 million albums, dammnit.

I don't care what songs they play - hell, they could play all of Bomb and Leave Behind and I wouldn't care because it would be a surprise. Their catalogue is so large, varied and successful (in terms of sales) that they could play anything and people would be happy.

You'd think that between the 4 of them, surrounded by reasonably smart people, and being pretty smart guys themselves, that they'd have the same insight you have into their own crowds. If only you could explain to them the things they simply do not realize.
 
Well Bruce sells out similar stadia in Europe- Nou Camp, San Siro etc so I can only go on that. And I wouldn't agree with your comparison either- the Sydney setlist had 8 AB songs and 5 Zooropa songs- for the Australians 13 "new" songs (we can argue about the newness of AB at that point, I know)- no SHF, no SBS, no AIWIY, no Desire, no WLCTT and no 40, their one time closer.

But Bruce doesn't get a lot of his new stuff played on the radio here, so I'm guessing most of his audience are much more invested fans and know more of his catalog.

Yes and if SOA comes out during this tour the audience would probably get something similar, probably not a full 13 but I would guess a solid 10. The industry was different then, AB and Zooropa had videos playing ALL the time on MTV.
 
This is even more valid in respect of U2, as they play to bigger audiences, there are people at U2 gigs that have only one or two U2 albums, like me at Neil Young, there are probably people that own no U2 albums but still go to the occasional concert because they like the Beautiful Day single, or SBS, or because their friends are going, or because they want to abuse Bono.
.

:lol: very true. I'm bringing 3 friends. One is somewhat of a diehard - owns all the albums and did GA with me last tour, but isn't crazy obsessed like me, and isn't going to be upset if they don't play lesser-known songs. The other two are very casual fans who are very much looking forward to BD and Vertigo. I figure my group is probably a pretty good representation of the audience as a whole - 25% diehard, 25% own many of the albums but aren't obsessed, and 50% are casual, owning only a couple albums or just knowing the hits. of course i don't KNOW this for a fact; the only way to know this would be to take a poll of all concert-goers or something. but i'm willing to bet with as many albums as U2 has, the majority of the audience do NOT own EVERY album.
 
:lol: very true. I'm bringing 3 friends. One is somewhat of a diehard - owns all the albums and did GA with me last tour, but isn't crazy obsessed like me, and isn't going to be upset if they don't play lesser-known songs. The other two are very casual fans who are very much looking forward to BD and Vertigo. I figure my group is probably a pretty good representation of the audience as a whole - 25% diehard, 25% own many of the albums but aren't obsessed, and 50% are casual, owning only a couple albums or just knowing the hits. of course i don't KNOW this for a fact; the only way to know this would be to take a poll of all concert-goers or something. but i'm willing to bet with as many albums as U2 has, the majority of the audience do NOT own EVERY album.

JimyJazz knows.
 
all of this casual fan business is bullshit, there are no casual fans anymore, tickets are to expensive and too hard to get, the only people that could be considered casual fans are the people who are there either because they know somebody or it's the only show in town, so fuck those people. there is not group of kids walking by the ticket both randomly one day who say, "hey, let's go see who's playing...

the claw is u2 personified, rigid, and robotic

btw i love u2



que blind devotion...maybe the root of this problem......
 
all of this casual fan business is bullshit, there are no casual fans anymore, tickets are to expensive and too hard to get, the only people that could be considered casual fans are the people who are there either because they know somebody or it's the only show in town, so fuck those people. there is not group of kids walking by the ticket both randomly one day who say, "hey, let's go see who's playing...

the claw is u2 personified, rigid, and robotic

btw i love u2



que blind devotion...maybe the root of this problem......

how many U2 concerts have you been to?
 
They used to challenge the audience, and themselves...what happened?

I think that U2 have a skewed view of their fan base and think that the crowds are dominated by casual fans, ie those that have the 80-90 and listen to the radio. They don't realize that they are not the kind of band that people are casual about, and that if someone is paying $100 + for a ticket they are most likely pretty into the band and like (almost) all the albums and have deep knowledge of them. Every album has sold millions of copies. They've sold over 100 million albums, dammnit.

I don't care what songs they play - hell, they could play all of Bomb and Leave Behind and I wouldn't care because it would be a surprise. Their catalogue is so large, varied and successful (in terms of sales) that they could play anything and people would be happy.

What happened? I'll tell you what happened. They put on a condom in front of a banana stand and thought Vertigo was sex. Or something like that.
 
If I didn't hear (EDIT: MOST OF) the following Bruce songs after plopping down $200 to see him croak his way thru 3 hrs of music, I'd be pissed:

Glory Days
Born In the USA
I'm On Fire
Born To Run
Rosalita
Hungry Heart
The River
No Surrender
My Hometown
I'm Goin Down
Brilliant Disguise


shall I stop now? I'd be pissed, seriously..


If you went to multiple shows you would end up hearing all of these songs. I dont know where your getting the $200.00 Bruces most expensive ticket is $100.00. Check out the setlists on Backstreets and Bruce Springsteen.net and you will alot of variation on each and every concert. Plus he goes into the audience every night and takes requests for about 4 songs which is quite impressive.

Say what you want about the guy. Even if you dont like him the guy is 6o years old and plays for 3 hours every night with different set lists every night. I believe he has played a total of 198 different songs since the Magic Tour began as well. Like him or not the guy is awesome.
 
all of this casual fan business is bullshit, there are no casual fans anymore, tickets are to expensive and too hard to get, the only people that could be considered casual fans are the people who are there either because they know somebody or it's the only show in town, so fuck those people. there is not group of kids walking by the ticket both randomly one day who say, "hey, let's go see who's playing...

the claw is u2 personified, rigid, and robotic

btw i love u2



que blind devotion...maybe the root of this problem......

So, all the times I've gone with my casual fan friends, who can afford the tickets, what, that was bullshit???? Perhaps they love music, own JT and AB and finally wanted to experience a U2 show now that they are older and in a financial position to do so.

Posts/posters like this blow my mind.
 
all of this casual fan business is bullshit, there are no casual fans anymore, tickets are to expensive and too hard to get, the only people that could be considered casual fans are the people who are there either because they know somebody or it's the only show in town, so fuck those people. there is not group of kids walking by the ticket both randomly one day who say, "hey, let's go see who's playing...

well I'm bringing some casual fans...they do exist :wink:

I do wonder how on earth they get tickets though, if they're not going with a crazy obsessive fan like me. I guess it depends on what counts as casual. I listen to a lot of bands and keep track of their tours so I suppose it's not unrealistic for someone to only own a couple U2 albums but still wake up at 10am to get tickets as soon as they go on sale or whatever. and yea they are a bit pricey, which is another reason why I think most people only see one show per tour (or at least per leg).
 
The majority of people who will fork out $100 to see a band are NOT casual fans. Some are there because they get the tickets from work, or because they like them a bit, but not too many. Unless they are rich and want to be seen.
 
The majority of people who will fork out $100 to see a band are NOT casual fans. Some are there because they get the tickets from work, or because they like them a bit, but not too many. Unless they are rich and want to be seen.

eh, you'd think that, but with ticket + hotel + gas my friends (casual fans) are prolly paying over $200 to see U2, and they're poor college students like me. U2 have such a good reputation as an amazing live act, and their stage setup is so cool, that people are willing to pay.
 
You'd think that between the 4 of them, surrounded by reasonably smart people, and being pretty smart guys themselves, that they'd have the same insight you have into their own crowds. If only you could explain to them the things they simply do not realize.

Yeah, I probably could because I have EXPERIENCE THAT THEY DO NOT HAVE. That is, being a part of the crowd with no ties to the band at all, so there is no need to be a yes man.
 
all of this casual fan business is bullshit, there are no casual fans anymore, tickets are to expensive and too hard to get, the only people that could be considered casual fans are the people who are there either because they know somebody or it's the only show in town, so fuck those people. there is not group of kids walking by the ticket both randomly one day who say, "hey, let's go see who's playing...

I think this kind of thinking is very narrow...

There's a whole different world out there, not everyone are the rabid music fans we are. There's a whole group of people that go see concerts like I do a baseball game, not huge fan of baseball but it's fun to go watch live. Or like some go see the theater, they may not have season passes but they'll go see Phantom because it's Phantom.

When I was living in Chicago I was surrounded by the whole corporate America where concerts were great entertainment for clients, and bands like Rolling Stones, U2, Madonna, etc were perfect for these types of things because "honestly who doesn't like ______".

Plus you have the huge 80's fans that haven't bought anything since AB but still like to go see them live.

And you have newest fans that like the 2000 stuff but hasn't quite gotten into the earlier stuff.

College kids still have disposable "income" and there are plenty of 30 and 50 tickets... so believe me there are a whole shitload of casual fans at U2 concerts.
 
I went to a Neil Young concert recently and I am a very casual Neil Young fan (own one album, and only familar with another 3 or 4 songs). As luck would have it, he was in crowd pleasing mood and played all the 'big' songs and nothing obscure.

However, I would have been mildly pissed off if he had decided to play just new stuff, or mainly obscure stuff, or an acoustic only acoustic set (as apparently he sometimes does). On the other hand, the diehard fan is probably delighted when he does this.

This is even more valid in respect of U2, as they play to bigger audiences, there are people at U2 gigs that have only one or two U2 albums, like me at Neil Young, there are probably people that own no U2 albums but still go to the occasional concert because they like the Beautiful Day single, or SBS, or because their friends are going, or because they want to abuse Bono.

This was borne out at Croker, the big anthemic songs got the best receptions, the likes of Ultra Violet and even MoS for that matter got more muted receptions. And UV isn't even all that obscure, it wasn't a single but it was on one of their top selling albums and was played live regularly in the early 1990s.

Until U2 decide to specifically play shows for a select audience, us hardcore fans will have to settle for 'crowd pleasing' shows with the occasional obscure song, like it or loathe it.

And if U2 did actually decide to play for select audiences, then how are they going to select them? The current hassles or arguments that sometimes occur in 'the Pit' over placings would seem a fond memory in comparison.

THANK YOU. I've brought up this point in other bitching threads. U2 are the only band I'm extremely hardcore about. Then there are a couple of others I'm a fairly big fan of, but most fall into the moderate to casual range - I don't own their entire catalogues, maybe just a couple of albums and I know their hits from the radio or greatest hits packages. When I go to their shows, do I want to hear some rare number that's only been played twice 15 years ago in some dingy club, where a handful of the audience (their hardcores) are going to be practically foaming at the mouth from hearing this song? No, I want to hear their hits, and some better known album tracks. `With maturity comes being able to take the perspective of others, and I would imagine that the vast majority of people at U2 shows are in the same boat as I am with other bands. I understand this. They're not playing to me and the hundreds (not thousands) of other nuts who are travelling distances, camping out, obsessing about ticket sales weeks before they're announced, they're playing for normal people who make up the majority of the audience.

Meh. It's really not hard to understand, people. That's the way it is. If you really don't like it, don't go to as many shows, it's as simple as that. If you don't buy the tickets, someone else will. Then you can stay home and make up a play list of all the rarities you want.
 
Yeah, I probably could because I have EXPERIENCE THAT THEY DO NOT HAVE. That is, being a part of the crowd with no ties to the band at all, so there is no need to be a yes man.

And you're 100% sure that they are surrounded by yes man. You're a veritable fount of information, amazing.

Will you be my guru; I'm looking to erode my credibility and come off as a know it all without really basing anything on fact, just things as I see them through my own limited prism.
 
I went to a Neil Young concert recently and I am a very casual Neil Young fan (own one album, and only familar with another 3 or 4 songs). As luck would have it, he was in crowd pleasing mood and played all the 'big' songs and nothing obscure.

However, I would have been mildly pissed off if he had decided to play just new stuff, or mainly obscure stuff, or an acoustic only acoustic set (as apparently he sometimes does). On the other hand, the diehard fan is probably delighted when he does this.

This is even more valid in respect of U2, as they play to bigger audiences, there are people at U2 gigs that have only one or two U2 albums, like me at Neil Young, there are probably people that own no U2 albums but still go to the occasional concert because they like the Beautiful Day single, or SBS, or because their friends are going, or because they want to abuse Bono.

This was borne out at Croker, the big anthemic songs got the best receptions, the likes of Ultra Violet and even MoS for that matter got more muted receptions. And UV isn't even all that obscure, it wasn't a single but it was on one of their top selling albums and was played live regularly in the early 1990s.

Until U2 decide to specifically play shows for a select audience, us hardcore fans will have to settle for 'crowd pleasing' shows with the occasional obscure song, like it or loathe it.

And if U2 did actually decide to play for select audiences, then how are they going to select them? The current hassles or arguments that sometimes occur in 'the Pit' over placings would seem a fond memory in comparison.

I'm late to the quoting this post party, but, it reflects my sentiments about a great many bands (some of which I'll pay a decent amount of $$$ to see, gasp!) and it's my rare opportunity to out and out agree with Financeguy. :)
 
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