Star Wars: Episode VII: Revenge Of The Septuagenarian

[bono_man2002]

I know!

Spoiler

its very very new hopey. But it many ways gets most things right that the prequels got wrong.

 

[mobvok]

Just finished the three prequels as preparation. The Phantom Menace is so, so weak: it's like someone decided to film a bullet point plot summary instead of the actual script. That means everything lurches forward awkwardly with heavy exposition and faint character....all leading us nowhere. In context with AOTC and ROTS, which have legitimately interesting (if ill formed) questions about power, nothing of note happens in TPM.

Those later two movies are far more interesting. It's low hanging fruit to point out every element that Lucas didn't have the deft touch to pull off, but what those movies are generally gesturing at gives them more heft and kept my attention. For one, a bit unexpectedly, Anakin is consistent in rebutting Jedi criticism of Palpatine by referring to his democratic legitimacy. Which is actually a little fair! Clearly the poor dope is naive of the practical reality of how the Republic has been hollowed out by years of war, but the Jedis' reflexive dismissiveness of politics as unseemly and below them means Palpatine owns "the voice of the people" by default when he and Windu are arguing in front of Anakin. The OT didn't pick up much on the political aspect of the war, so I hope that's a thread they end up cultivating with Leia at some point in the new series of movies.

 

[lazarus]

"Give the people what they want" was the name of the game, apparently. A real shame, because the new characters are all great and deserved something better than going through the same situations as their forbearers.

The first half was great, but then the redundancies began to pile up, and nostalgia fatigue really set in.

The climax was about as opposite as thrilling as you can get, maybe because this is the THIRD Star Wars film with a

Spoiler

planet-destroying battle station that is attacked by the rebels.

Not really sure how

Spoiler

someone who never touched a lightsaber before is able to easily defeat someone with considerable dark side powers.

And the result is that it makes the main villain a lot less threatening.

This is as uneven as The Phantom Menace, but with better acting and a lot better jokes. But the pod race and the Maul/Qui-Gon/Obi-Wan fight are beyond anything this has to offer, and in general it's really lacking in imagination and a sense of wonder. No eye-popping alien worlds, just planets that seem oddly similar, as in pick one from each OT film and give it a new name.

It doesn't have anything as good as the Emperor scenes in Return of the Jedi, but it has less embarrassing stuff so I'd put it above.

My current ranking:

Empire
A New Hope = Sith
Clones
Awakens = Menace
Jedi

 

[LemonMelon]

I adored it. The plot felt like it was written in a boardroom and was full of lazy coincidences, but everything else brought it to life. The characters felt lived in and real, products of their universe but also very fresh personalities, especially the new Sith apprentice who was weak (kind of a given, being an apprentice and all) but very human.

The visuals, my fucking goodness. Incredible set work, top notch creatures, vivid color palette (the light saber battle in the snow!)...man, it was a feast for the eyes. After the prequels sullied the name of such an innovative series with awful CGI and bland scenery (not to mention godawful dialogue and acting, but that's another matter), The Force Awakens really puts the series back on top visually. That was worth the full cinematic experience.

If you're a fan of the series and didn't enjoy this, I don't know what to say. Hell, if you like action movies at all, you'll love this. Really got the blood pumping for me. It's easy to nitpick at the fan service and plotholes (which are present albeit relatively minor), but Star Wars is ultimately a fantasy series and it offered up its most consistently entertaining film since Jedi, maybe longer. Revenge of the Sith had breathtaking highs, but Force Awakens has those while lacking Hayden Christensen. The other two prequels are garbage, so they're not even in the conversation.

1. New Hope
2. Empire

3. Force Awakens
4. Jedi
5. Sith

6. Clones
7. Menace

If you're in this thread, go fucking see it. Or see it again.

 

[bono_212]

EDIT: MY SPOILER TAG ISN"T SHOWING UP ON THE MOBILE VERSION FOR ME, SO OH MY GOD PLEASE LOOK AWAY AND I'M SO SORRY IF I SPOILED THE MOVIE FOR ANYONE
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Spoiler

My basic thoughts: My heart wants to give this like a 9/10 because it was so much fun, but the script left a lot to be desired in the service of...fan service.

I wanted to be emotional about Han, but how could I be when it was so obvious he was Obi-Wan/Qui-Gon? The moment he left Leia, I knew it was over, so the best I could do was brace for impact. Almost no emotional resonance whatsoever.

Meanwhile, cried my eyes out when Qui-Gon died, and I'd barely known the guy for 100 minutes of my life. I have grown up with Han Solo as possibly my all-time favorite film character. He deserved a better death, dammit!

I love the new characters. Anxious to see them really get at it in the next film, as I suspect we will diverge severely from everything going forward. This was a gift to fans, but I have no doubt we're into new territory now, and I'd imagine that helicopter shot at the end was the biggest indicator of that.

Also first Star Wars movie to end on a cliff hanger, yeah? I'd've been much happier with it ending on the beginning of Rey's journey to find Luke. Not just a quick shot of Luke to keep all the fan boys at bay.

Edit - Uncharitable points:
*So that was Luke's light sabre that previously belonged to Annakin? When and how was that recovered from Cloud City?

I can't even begin to get over this mistake. So I watched the scene from Empire again. I mean...it's POSSIBLE the saber landed next to Vader and didn't fall down the shaft. In that case, It's POSSIBLE he picked it up and took it with him and it's POSSIBLE over the course of time it changed hands and ended up locked away somewhere.


But come on:

It's going out into the shaft.

*R2D2 perked up out of nowhere, save for plot convenience.

This might've been one of the laziest bits of screen writing I've ever seen. BUT, in a movie full of lazy writing, I just couldn't care by the time it happened. There was a LOT of convenience at work here. Han finding them out about in the galaxy like that in the first place? Jeeeeeez.

*After all the criticism of a second Death Star in RotJ, they think a third is a good idea? Dispatched of just as easily?

I don't understand how the thing blew up in the first place. Weren't they on a planet at one point? then suddenly they were fighting a space station...I clearly missed something. Plus, I thought they were going to just disable it, not blow it up...

It won't have many of the weaknesses. It will likely not have any of its peaks, either.

BOOM!

"Give the people what they want" was the name of the game, apparently. A real shame, because the new characters are all great and deserved something better than going through the same situations as their forbearers.

It's almost funny how much I was afraid of this movie not being anything like the other films, and then my major complaint was that it was TOO much like the other films. Everyone's already saying it, but it's basically note for note A New Hope with some BRILLIANT new additions that get a little lost in the shuffle. Some really great cinematography here, decent direction, I like the new characters pretty well. I think the idea of a broken sith lord is fun, but they've made him far too simple a character so far, so I'm looking for more.

Not really sure how

Spoiler

someone who never touched a lightsaber before is able to easily defeat someone with considerable dark side powers.

And the result is that it makes the main villain a lot less threatening.

That fight hurt my Star Wars loving soul. I wanted to love it, but it was so beyond belief.

Anyways, easy to make complaints, but I really DID love it.

8/10

My current ranking:

Empire
A New Hope = Sith
Clones
Awakens = Menace
Jedi

Empire
RotJ
RotS
A New Hope
Awakens
Phantom Menace




Clones still remains the only movie I actively dislike. Despite a few really great scenes.

 

[LemonMelon]

My current ranking:

Empire
A New Hope = Sith
Clones
Awakens = Menace
Jedi

It's a unique ranking.

 

[monkeyskin]

Empire
New Hope
Jedi
Awakens


Prequels

Regarding Rey:

Spoiler

She demolished those creeps trying to steal BB8 and Ren was seriously injured by the time they fought (Chewie's bow plus Finns damage). Add on the fact that she probably trained as a youngling and it more or less holds water. But it's a detriment to the film that it has to be justified this way.

I also like to imagine BB8 lighting a 1 minute flame for Han afterwards.

 

[Lancemc]

I like Return of the Jedi.

 

[GirlsAloudFan]

Why is everyone so obsessed with immediately ranking things?

Fuck, you're lame.

 

[Lancemc]

monkeyskin
bono 212
elmel

...

laz

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gaf

 

[GirlsAloudFan]

See...I can actually get behind that ranking.

I saw this movie last night and loved it very much. Rey is my fav.

 

[Irvine511]

all early reviews from friends who waited 3 hours to see it last night range from "good! i had fun. solid B+" to "one of the best movies i've ever seen."

i'm waiting until after Christmas.

and will not look at this thread until then.

 

[lazarus]

There's no way to say this without being condescending, but I'm flummoxed at how so many people have been duped.

How can you see all these scenes that are blatant lifts of the OT, done worse, and just give it a pass?

Is better dialogue, jokes, and acting a legitimate substitute for no imagination?

Death Star #3. Sand planet. Snow planet. Forest planet. Stolen plans in droid. Captured girl. Rebel meeting with pilots. Attack on powerful but vulnerable battle station. Mentor dies and passes torch to newcomer.

Can anyone honestly say the aerial attack on the base was thrilling in any way whatsoever? Or that it was totally fine that our heroes saunter in on foot and seemingly accomplish their mission AND escape with no challenges whatsoever,

Spoiler

Han only getting fucked because he actively sought out a villain who didn't even notice he was there?

This isn't lazy writing, it's TERRIBLE writing. A screenplay isn't just about the quality of the dialogue, it's about creating a story with some new ideas and situations, with powerful moments that are earned, and not spotted a mile away.

In short, the prequels were great ideas marred by inconsistent execution, whereas these films are inconsistent ideas propped up by great execution. One is not better than the other.

And have fun on your repeat viewing, when the nostalgia wears off and you realize you're watching pale imitations of things you've seen before.

 

[Lancemc]

I'll probably end up liking it a lot more than Laz, but honestly yeah... did we expect anything else from this? Anticipating it being exceedingly self-referential, ever since the first trailer really.

 

[bono_212]

monkeyskin
bono 212
elmel

...

laz

...

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gaf

Awww

I'll probably end up liking it a lot more than Laz, but honestly yeah... did we expect anything else from this? Anticipating it being exceedingly self-referential, ever since the first trailer really.

I thought, I really thought, it was going to be a completely different movie from the others, in look, in feel, in style.

Maybe I'm reacting in relief, Idk, but I enjoyed the film.

But yeah, the storytelling was kinda awful. I definitely concede that point.

 

[bobsaget77]

Don't care about being all nitpicky. I loved it.
Basically 100% to what LemonMelon said in his post.
1 Empire
2 New Hope
3 Awakens
4 Jedi
5 Sith
6 Menace
7 Clones


Sent from my iPhone using U2 Interference

 

[Mack_Again]

am i the only one who want spoilers before watching it or am I going insane?

 

[GirlsAloudFan]

You're going insane. But not necessarily because of that post.

 

[GirlsAloudFan]

I will start the petition for Laz to write and direct a Star Wars movie.

 

[deep]

the score was good

 

[deep]

am i the only one who want spoilers before watching it or am I going insane?

I prefer the spoilers, this is not great art
I have to see this with family over the holidays and now expect not too much
as for your last question, don't work your joystick in public and you will be ok

 

[LemonMelon]

all early reviews from friends who waited 3 hours to see it last night range from "good! i had fun. solid B+" to "one of the best movies i've ever seen."



i'm waiting until after Christmas.



and will not look at this thread until then.

My reaction ranges from yes to FUCK YES.

It's a gorgeous movie with great new characters and the promise of Luke and Rey kicking ass all over the galaxy. I'm very happy.

I look forward to the tubing planet Laz introduces in Episode X.

 

[bono_212]

the score was good

Yes.

 

[Oregoropa]

Just got out of the theater and all I can say its WOW !!!. JJ take a bow. Yes there were parts that were derivative of A New Hope, Empire, and Jedi, but I don't view them as carbon copies. More like a Tribute Band that wrote an awesome original track. For me the most important takeaways are the new characters and some iconic imagery that will be forever imprinted into the Star Wars legend.

Spoiler

- The story really belongs to Rey. Her character has the biggest story arc and still some mystery left to her origins

- Finn gives us something we haven't seen before. A defector from the evil side. Great comic timing.

- BB-8 was well thought out as the "white whale" everybody is hunting when in actuality is a little fun puppy dog.

- The iconic moments that remain stuck in my mind. The Falcon chase through the skeleton of the Star Destroyer. Hux screaming to his troops like a Nuremberg Rally. Solo and Kylo on the bridge. The snow lightsaber fight. The closing moment on the Island.

- One complaint I had. Leia projects strength to her troops but, she needed a moment where it all breaks down and lose it more when she hugged Rey after you know what.

 

[GirlsAloudFan]

My reaction ranges from yes to FUCK YES.

It's a gorgeous movie with great new characters and the promise of Luke and Rey kicking ass all over the galaxy. I'm very happy.

I look forward to the tubing planet Laz introduces in Episode X.

Can I like this post? Or maybe retweet it?

 

[lazarus]

Still waiting for El Mel to address any of my criticisms above.

I did enjoy everything Oregoropa mentioned, and have high hopes for the next one. But this should have been something much more creative.

 

[Oregoropa]

After 30 years I was worried about Luke's whining

Spoiler

Instead, its his best movie, because he has no lines

 

[LemonMelon]

I have nothing to address. Ask Ashley to confirm; because I'm terrible to watch movies with, I was whispering to her many of the same points you took away as I watched. The incredulous look on her face when

Spoiler

the long-lost blue lightsaber returned out of nowhere

was priceless. And even I was mildly annoyed when

Spoiler

R2-D2 flipped himself back on because the plot called for it.

As a whole, however, my experience wasn't ruined by these flaws. Not at all. I'm not a very critical Star Wars viewer and never have been because my knowledge of the overall series mythology is minimal outside of the main films. The one point I will make w/r/t the light saber duel in the snow (visually, one of my favorite scenes of the year):

Spoiler

Rey dominated Kylo because she's more closely attuned to the Force, not because of a plot contrivance. Everything came to her naturally, too naturally to be explained by skill alone. I'm guessing that if it's true that she is Luke's daughter as has been theorized, the midi-chlorians in her blood are through the roof, whereas Kylo is a generation separated from Anakin. His parents are Leia (not a Jedi) and Han, who is about as insensitive to the Force as a person can be. Kylo is right to fear that he will never be as strong as Vader. As I said, I'm no expert, so correct me if I'm wrong, it's just the first thing that sprung to mind in the theater.

 

[lazarus]

Just because Leia hasn't been trained doesn't mean the midichlorians wouldn't be passed on. And no reason to believe her count wouldn't be as high as Luke's. They're twins, after all.

 

[cobl04]

The force strong with this one tho, over 9000 midichlorians say so