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Old 06-25-2009, 10:35 PM   #496
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Not to encourage you any more, but:



This is from wikipedia, about the first case in 93. The negotiations to settle were initiated by the kid's parents. If you're the parents of a kid who you believe has been molested, do you want to settle and get the money while the person responsible goes free, or do you want to go to trial and see the person responsible go to jail?
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Hey Laz, are you a parent? I am, and here's a few somewhat related ramblings:

- If Bono himself invited my kids for extended sleepovers or pyjama parties, the answer would be no.

- If ANYONE touched one of my children, there would be no trial for that person.

- If anyone actually did get away with it and the police managed to protect them to get it to trial, $22M would not make me drop the charges, period. No amount of money would do that

Unproven allegations and bullshit. Any parent that settles for $22M if their kid was supposedly abused and then refuses to let their kid testify at the criminal trial is a sack of shit and deserves to be shot. They have no credibility, period.

Not that the parents weren't greedy themselves, but any sane person would know that going up against a legal team paid for by MJ would be unlikely to result in a conviction.

Secondly, there's a flipside to your argument: If you had been accused of molesting a child, would you not want to go to trial so your innocence would be officially proven, instead of giving a large portion of your accumulated wealth to the people supposedly falsely accusing you?

There's also the matter of the conduct of Jackson's handlers/security, with potential witnesses who were threatened, and if I'm not mistaken one was coincidentally almost run over by some crazy anonymous driver. Lot of unanswered questions there.
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Old 06-25-2009, 10:36 PM   #497
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Hey Laz, are you a parent? I am
Quick, someone get this guy a trophy!
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Old 06-25-2009, 10:37 PM   #498
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For those of us that got up on a Saturday morning back in the day to watch the Jackson 5 cartoon:

YouTube - Jackson 5ive Cartoon
yay!!!
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Old 06-25-2009, 10:38 PM   #499
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That's really well said, VP.

It's weird. My reactions throughout the afternoon/evening have been kind of that only-in-the-age-of-the-internet of information overload, kind of shaking my head at the extreme outpouring of grief (not knocking anyone, just hadn't expected so much of it).

Only in the past hour or so has it started sinking in that one of my first idols, one of the first people who had me really interested in music, is dead. I don't know that I'll be among the "omg shaking and crying" crowd, but I'm going from bemused shock to actual sadness.
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Old 06-25-2009, 10:41 PM   #500
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Oh, and dear MTV:

I'm happy you're playing his videos now, but this song? The one I don't know the name of?

YOU JUST PLAYED IT TEN MINUTES AGO.

Come on, now.

I guess I shouldn't be surprised that you can't even play videos right anymore.
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Old 06-25-2009, 10:42 PM   #501
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There are some reports that MJ left the rights to the Beatles songs to Paul McCartney (in his will).
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Old 06-25-2009, 10:42 PM   #502
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Two birds with one stone FTW:

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Old 06-25-2009, 10:44 PM   #503
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There are some reports that MJ left the rights to the Beatles songs to Paul McCartney (in his will).
I'm glad to hear that.
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Old 06-25-2009, 10:44 PM   #504
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Not that the parents weren't greedy themselves, but any sane person would know that going up against a legal team paid for by MJ would be unlikely to result in a conviction.
So the $22m is supposed to somehow soothe that? The $22M was a civil matter. How much does is a conviction, or, in your argument, not getting a conviction, worth to you? That's why I asked if you had kids, not as an insult, but because I know there is no price that would make me drop criminal charges, liklihood be damned. How could I ever look my kid in the eye and say 'yeah well, it didn't look promising on the criminal aspect, but hell, we're rich now!'


Like I said, unproven allegations.

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Quick, someone get this guy a trophy!
Aren't you a comedian? I was using that as a reference point as I think most parents are revolted by the thought of molestation and to reinforce that if he was in fact guilty and was convicted, I would have an entirely different opinion, being a parent. Grow up.
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Old 06-25-2009, 10:46 PM   #505
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Originally Posted by corianderstem View Post
That's really well said, VP.

It's weird. My reactions throughout the afternoon/evening have been kind of that only-in-the-age-of-the-internet of information overload, kind of shaking my head at the extreme outpouring of grief (not knocking anyone, just hadn't expected so much of it).

Only in the past hour or so has it started sinking in that one of my first idols, one of the first people who had me really interested in music, is dead. I don't know that I'll be among the "omg shaking and crying" crowd, but I'm going from bemused shock to actual sadness.
I always thought that if any positive would come out of him being convicted, it would have been that he would be forced to undergo treatment. But alas.

That's pretty much the way I've been feeling all evening. Well, since I realized that "Ben" is apparently my trigger, and turned it off.
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Old 06-25-2009, 10:46 PM   #506
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I was really looking forward to his comeback at O2....

Hes been dealt some unfair luck the last few years.

Whether you liked the guy or hated him most people would say he was one of the best musicians and entertainers of his time...and certainly had a love for it.

RIP Michael as Bono says I dont believe you are Bad.
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Old 06-25-2009, 10:47 PM   #507
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I'm glad to hear that.
Yeah, if it's true, very classy.

Plus, what a way to get around Yoko.
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Old 06-25-2009, 10:47 PM   #508
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I was too young for Michael Jackson to be an icon for me. Yes, I did grow up during the height of his fame. But I was 10 when he was accused of child molestation. For that moment on, he was a pariah, the butt of every joke. So, I never got to enjoy his music while he still seemed sane.

Yes, his music was great, especially in the 80s. But I was only baby when Thriller came out, along with the moonwalk and everything. Right now, I wished I had enjoyed Michael Jackson's music. But I couldn't; there was too much controversy surrounding him.

The way I see Michael Jackson's life is that he was a true gift, an incredible-beyond-words talent, but he destroyed himself. It really is sad, a total tragedy.

I just hope the best for his family, especially his children, who did not have a normal childhood, much like their father.
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Old 06-25-2009, 10:48 PM   #509
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Maybe I'm just a big ol' softie who believes there is still good in the world, but I honestly believe Paul would make sure Yoko got John's share as well.
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Old 06-25-2009, 10:53 PM   #510
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So the $22m is supposed to somehow soothe that? The $22M was a civil matter. How much does is a conviction, or, in your argument, not getting a conviction, worth to you? That's why I asked if you had kids, not as an insult, but because I know there is no price that would make me drop criminal charges, liklihood be damned. How could I ever look my kid in the eye and say 'yeah well, it didn't look promising on the criminal aspect, but hell, we're rich now!'


Like I said, unproven allegations.
You didn't respond to my second point. About defending yourself against those kinds of allegations? How much would that be worth?

As far as "unproven allegations" goes, at worst, this guy molested a child or children. At best, he had an unhealthy attitude towards them; someone who keeps nude photos of children and also likes to sleep in bed with them is extremely disturbing. He may not have been a pedophile in action, but in thought...
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