Michael Jackson rushed to hospital - He was not breathing / Michael Jackson is dead

[Jive Turkey]

Jackson said his nude children photo books (PLURAL) were art and that he had the right to own them. Which is fine on its own, but combined with everything else? Fairly damning.

See, I dont quite agree with that. Its either child porn or its not. We dont even know what the images were of. For all we know it could've been cutesy Anne Geddes style baby pictures. The guy obviously had a weird affinity towards children, theres no denying that, and owning these books was probably an extension of that. Its strange. If you owned a bunch of those books, I'd think you were a weirdo. I just dont think he had alternative motives to hanging out with kids. He just seemed like a strange guy who didnt fit in with social norms. Doesnt automatically make him a pedophile. then again, I didnt know the man and could be completely wrong

 

[deep]

From Wiki:

.

you do realize that interested parties edit wiki for personal reasons

all I am saying is that wiki is a weak source to validate something controversial

I try and do a lot of multi-sourcing, it is difficult,
because so much is just re-tweets, these days

glad to see you write that MJ did not have kitty porn books

nude subjects in art, are not always whack material

 

[BrownEyedBoy]

YouTube - The Jacksons at Madison Square Garden (Part2)

That performance of I want You back is amazing. Forgive me for posting it but I just think that watching the guy perform realy gives you an idea of who exactly just passed away. I still can't believe. Truly an artist. Never really from this Earth. Never one of us. Truly a genius but being so extraordinary had its price and Michael paid dearly. May he finally rest in peace.

Please, the guy is dead, can't defend himself. Can we cut him a break, for once?

 

[indra]

And there's a difference between having photography books featuring naked children, and not having those books.

I'm not familiar with the details of this, but were these books of photos of naked children in pornographic poses or were these real photography books which had some pics of children sans clothing? Because there is a BIG difference between the two.

Hell, I have photography books which have some pics of children without clothing and I'm no child molester.

 

[lazarus]

but that baby most likely has had a better life than most because MJ was his father

If you want to talk in terms of nice clothing, good food, traveling the world, and a big house, then yes. Definitely better than starving in Calcutta or Somalia.

But the sheltered life and psychological effects of MJ being your "father"...not sure if that's something I would wish on any kid.

 

[deep]

If you want to talk in terms of nice clothing, good food, traveling the world, and a big house, then yes. Definitely better than starving in Calcutta or Somalia.

But the sheltered life and psychological effects of MJ being your "father"...not sure if that's something I would wish on any kid.

So this hard on you have for MJ
is it all you or viagra assisted?

 

[impy13]

Alright, I'm going to defend my stance, which has been of the joking variety.

Jackson was an extremely divisive figure, and there are those of us who believe some of the charges levied against him were quite true. Those are the judgments we've made in our time. For a few of us, the still-black Jackson of Thriller and the Jackson 5 will be the lasting image. For others, the mincing, boy-hungry pedophile will resonate. Yeah, I understand it's all ALLEGED, but many of us take the known facts and make logical assumptions. I think he fooled around with kids. I'll not waver from that viewpoint.

Now I completely understand why some of you are upset about this, and I think you have every right to be. As I told Sicy via PM earlier, I'd be a complete fucking mess if Dylan died. I don't want anyone to think I'm condemning their dismay at Jackson's death. I'm not at all. It's completely valid. If his art brought joy to your lives, I'm sorry for your loss and hope you continue to enjoy his records for years to come.

Me? I'm going to continue to post Pedobear macros because I think they're hilarious. I'm also going to continue enjoying "Billie Jean" because it's a great fucking song. I don't see how those are mutually exclusive. And if laughing at a funny picture of a child molesting bear hanging out with a pedophile (allegedly) makes me more "childish" than Jackson himself, then get me some Legos and Play Doh. Goo goo ga ga.

 

[lazarus]

I'm not familiar with the details of this, but were these books of photos of naked children in pornographic poses or were these real photography books which had some pics of children sans clothing? Because there is a BIG difference between the two.

Hell, I have photography books which have some pics of children without clothing and I'm no child molester.

They were ruled to be non-erotic or pornographic. And as I said, that alone does not make someone a molester. There are many people into photography as art. Sally Mann if I'm not mistaken is a notable photographer who became known for this kind of material, and I think there are several others.

But when you combine it with his other practices, it's disturbing.

 

[lazarus]

you do realize that interested parties edit wiki for personal reasons

all I am saying is that wiki is a weak source to validate something controversial

I try and do a lot of multi-sourcing, it is difficult,
because so much is just re-tweets, these days

glad to see you write that MJ did not have kitty porn books

nude subjects in art, are not always whack material

I read more about this case when it happened, Wiki is just the quickest source of info. You'll notice it's heavily footnoted, which is not as common when people are making shit up on there.

 

[lazarus]

So this hard on you have for MJ
is it all you or viagra assisted?

Sorry, I thought we were having an intelligent discussion.

 

[deep]

I plant fake shit with foot notes all the time

yes, I am easily amused

 

[Jive Turkey]

...Pedobear macros because I think they're hilarious.

Regardless about what I think of some of the posts in here, this is undeniable fact

 

[yolland]

People were paying their respects to Saddam Hussein??

The thread starter (who was active-duty military at the time) explained in the thread why he created it.

Extending RIP sentiments doesn't mean you believe the deceased was a noble, righteous, all-around admirable individual whose example everyone should seek to emulate. If it did then far fewer people, 'non-fuckups' included, would ever attract such sentiments at all.

Maybe memorial services should always feature an anti-eulogist whose job it is to list and loudly condemn every last moral failing the deceased had...you know, just to protect our fragile moral compasses from corruption by fleeting sentimental recollections of happy moments somehow associated with them, shit like that.

 

[Lancemc]

I look back on my good times with Saddam with bitter-sweet nostalgia. Warm summer days in the park, tossing the football around and playing Frisbee with our dog Rover. And those serene weekends when he took us down to the shore. Oh how he'd laugh when the crabs would pinch at my toes in the shallow ocean blue... I miss the old guy.

 

[impy13]

tossing the football around

Short distance?

 

[deep]

MJ didn't do anything today
but die


he has not had any questionable behavior mentioned in the press since 2005
when he was acquitted


at his passing
the reasonable thing to do
would be to look at his whole life contributions

yes, the accusations are a part of that

but, not the main part or even a major part, when one looks at the totality of his life

so all the ones that are wanting to fix and focus the spotlight on that one part do not have a sound basis for their postings

 

[lazarus]

Extending RIP sentiments doesn't mean you believe the deceased was a noble, righteous, all-around admirable individual whose example everyone should seek to emulate. If it did then far fewer people, 'non-fuckups' included, would ever attract such sentiments at all.

...but this isn't an RIP thread.

Maybe memorial services should always feature an anti-eulogist whose job it is to list and loudly condemn every last moral failing the deceased had...you know, just to protect our fragile moral compasses from corruption by fleeting sentimental recollections of happy moments somehow associated with them, shit like that.

Strawman arguments FTW!

This isn't a private memorial service, it's a discussion thread on an essentially public forum dedicated to U2.

Or do you think some of us are spending the rest of our free time trolling on Michael Jackson fan sites?

 

[last unicorn]

I'm really sad right now. Michael was part of my childhood, I grew up with his music, I used to love him back in the day, went to concert, I had all his records. Today I feel as if an era has ended, but also a part of my life. It makes me so sad and angry to look at the tragedy that his life has become in recent years. I hope he can find peace now and is no longer hunted.

 

[lazarus]

MJ didn't do anything today
but die


he has not had any questionable behavior mentioned in the press since 2005
when he was acquitted


at his passing
the reasonable thing to do
would be to look at his whole life contributions

yes, the accusations are a part of that

but, not the main part or even a major part, when one looks at the totality of his life

so all the ones that are wanting to fix and focus the spotlight on that one part do not have a sound basis for their postings

Well my original post in this thread was about much more than the accusations. It was about the delusional world he constructed for himself, the cosmetic surgery, and his relevance in the music world.

Also, his bizarre behavior has been going on since the late 80's, so it's a pretty sizable portion of his life.

And by your rationale, aren't the people who are only talking about his positive contributions to music and/or charity also operating on an unsound basis?

 

[impy13]

I still can't believe Farrah Fawcett, Michael Jackson, the immortal Jeff Goldblum, and Harrison Ford managed to die on the same day!

 

[Lancemc]

Always remember, IMPY.

It's really all we can do.

 

[namkcuR]

I totally understand where you're coming from. I'm still trying to grasp the whole attachment most people have to celebrities and this obsession with celebrity culture. It's amazing how his death overshadowed Farrah Fawcett's death (and to a lesser extent, Ed McMahon's), when in the end they're just two people who very few people actually know.

It's strange. I'm not condemning anyone for being emotional that someone has died, but why them, you know?

I'd like to hear some thoughts on this. I'm sure someone can express it better than I have.

I think it's because Farrah Fawcett and Ed McMahon never had the air of immortality that Michael Jackson had and that the few other celebrities of Michael Jackson's stature have. Michael Jackson is looked at as a god in the music business, despite his personal eccentricities and shortcomings, and gods don't die.

Farrah Fawcett's story, on the other hand, was the exact opposite - hers was a story about her mortality, about her fight with her disease, and the strength, courage, and love that she exuded in that fight, and how her illness and Ryan O'Neal's illness brought them back together and their love, and what a beautiful and loving and optimistic person she was.

Ed McMahon was loved for his kind, jovial, and inherently warm nature, for making people laugh with Johnny Carson every night for three decades and for his own infectious laugh, for being a comforting personality, like Johnny, for people to watch every night for those three decades. These are very human characteristics and attributes.

But neither were ever seen as this god-like figure the way Michael Jackson has been for decades.

 

[impy13]

Thanks for not even mentioning the Blum.

He was the quintessential scat man:

YouTube - Jeff Goldblum Scatting

 

[lazarus]

He was the quintessential scat man:

OMG MAYBE HE IS LANCE'S DAD!!!!!1!!1!!







Sheizen.

 

[Eliv8]

M.j.r.i.p.

'If You Wanna Make The World A Better Place Take A Look At Yourself, And Then Make A Change'

K.O.P.R.I.P.

 

[BrownEyedBoy]

P Diddy said a true thing "Michel Jackson taught me that you can actually see the beat."

Wow. What a thought. Rest in Peace King of Pop.

 

[Lancemc]

OMG MAYBE HE IS LANCE'S DAD!!!!!1!!1!!







Sheizen.

Was, Laz... was.

Show some respect.

 

[impy13]

P Diddy said a true thing "Michel Jackson taught me that you can actually see the beat."

You see all sorts of crazy shit after enough Jesus Juice.

 

[GirlsAloudFan]

I'm always on the lookout for the next ex-Mrs. Malcolm

 

[lazarus]

You see all sorts of crazy shit after enough Jesus Juice.

Juice For Jesus?