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He asked, “Just because technology gives you the ability to do something, does that mean you should?” He answered, “Not always.”

:lol: riiiight. if i have the technology for something as minor as skipping commercials on a tv show, i'm gonna watch them anyway. it's not like we're talking about the atomic bomb or anything. he's coming off a bit like a whiny bitch who's way up in the 1% who doesn't get why people don't want to watch commercial after commercial. i'm sure when it's all said and done, he's probably way too busy to watch that much tv anyway so he hardly understands how annoying it gets for us commonfolk after a while :rolleyes:

that all being said, i hate the nielsen system. it's so archaic, built on the old days back when you couldn't skip past things. then tivo came along and now every cable and satellite carrier offers their own dvr too so lots of people have them. i know these execs want to look at all this as how many people are ultimately watching ads, but people obviously don't watch tv to watch ads. if i'm watching live tv, i'll either mute the tv (if it's a new show) or change the channel during the break (if it's a rerun so i can afford to miss a minute if i don't change back in time).

to me this story is yet another case of execs with an archaic way of looking at things from back in the good old days yet they refuse to conform to current technology. if tv, (and even music, movies, etc.) got with the times and realised not everyone can watch stuff live and if it's recorded, most will opt to skip the commercials, then progress can be made. i don't want banners or pop ups to start appearing during the show or anything to force people who dvr to see some sort of ad, but it's not fair to punish shows and then the rest of us by cancelling supposed low-rated shows that aren't really that low-rated just because the enough people dvr them to drop them a few places or something.
 
Was going to say, I don't think he'll be getting much sympathy on the commercials thing amongst people. People are recording because they want to watch the show, not the commercials, duh.

i don't want banners or pop ups to start appearing during the show or anything to force people who dvr to see some sort of ad, but it's not fair to punish shows and then the rest of us by cancelling supposed low-rated shows that aren't really that low-rated just because the enough people dvr them to drop them a few places or something.

Agreed. I absolutely HATE it when I'm watching a show and half the screen or a corner or whatever is suddenly taken up by an ad for something. So incredibly annoying, and I don't get how the network heads don't realize that. I understand advertising is a big part of how networks make money, but there's got to be a way to do that without annoying the viewers in the process. In our newfangled technological age, I'd have to think something novel could be thought up in regards to that.

And I still maintain that if networks didn't feel the need to own half the channels on TV, that might free up quite a bit of money for them to put into their own network, so they can develop quality programs and hire good writers and actors, and keep their channel going strong and letting shows have more of a chance.
 
If people keep skipping through the commercials, advertisers won't buy spots and networks won't have the money to invest in programming. Either you can't skip ads on DVRs, you have to deal with pop-up ads in programming or all shows are going to have product placement.
 
To get us out of this boring conversation... ya (8) bit?!!

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He asked, “Just because technology gives you the ability to do something, does that mean you should?” He answered, “Not always.”

:lol: riiiight. if i have the technology for something as minor as skipping commercials on a tv show, i'm gonna watch them anyway. it's not like we're talking about the atomic bomb or anything. he's coming off a bit like a whiny bitch who's way up in the 1% who doesn't get why people don't want to watch commercial after commercial. i'm sure when it's all said and done, he's probably way too busy to watch that much tv anyway so he hardly understands how annoying it gets for us commonfolk after a while :rolleyes:

that all being said, i hate the nielsen system. it's so archaic, built on the old days back when you couldn't skip past things. then tivo came along and now every cable and satellite carrier offers their own dvr too so lots of people have them. i know these execs want to look at all this as how many people are ultimately watching ads, but people obviously don't watch tv to watch ads. if i'm watching live tv, i'll either mute the tv (if it's a new show) or change the channel during the break (if it's a rerun so i can afford to miss a minute if i don't change back in time).

to me this story is yet another case of execs with an archaic way of looking at things from back in the good old days yet they refuse to conform to current technology. if tv, (and even music, movies, etc.) got with the times and realised not everyone can watch stuff live and if it's recorded, most will opt to skip the commercials, then progress can be made. i don't want banners or pop ups to start appearing during the show or anything to force people who dvr to see some sort of ad, but it's not fair to punish shows and then the rest of us by cancelling supposed low-rated shows that aren't really that low-rated just because the enough people dvr them to drop them a few places or something.
I get his point, and it's the one made above by D-Smith. They're already strapped for cash as a network. Are you now going to be happy with things that lower the enticements for advertisers to invest in shows like Community? That seems like a problem. I see his point there. And I totally agree with his point on the Nielsen system, which basically everybody agrees on except CBS.
 
I get his point, and it's the one made above by D-Smith. They're already strapped for cash as a network. Are you now going to be happy with things that lower the enticements for advertisers to invest in shows like Community? That seems like a problem. I see his point there. And I totally agree with his point on the Nielsen system, which basically everybody agrees on except CBS.
yeah, because until these posts i thought the money for tv shows just came from some huge vault like scrooge mcduck. it never occurred to me that maybe the ads they show financed it.

come on. i know how ads work and i also know me watching ads or not doesn't even matter unless i actually go out and buy the stuff. but that wasn't even the point of my post.
 
To get us out of this boring conversation... ya (8) bit?!!

Love how you Chang'ed the reference for these. :hi5:



Anyone see McHale on Leno last night? :lol:


Also, after last week, how can anyone's favorite character not be Troy at this point?
 
That might have been it. Now I'm wondering if it had just been the Comicon reference. Oh well. I'll just stop wondering and say "that whole scene was funny."

The turn of the century brick & Antiques Roadshow spiel?

"Hello? Rich people? Troy's joining you. Yes I'll hold"

:lol:
 
You know, I haven't read anywhere that the fourth will even be the last season.

But 13 eps and a move to Fridays is probably not a great sign.

Friday isn't the kiss of doom it once was, it's where network cult shows can survive. Community has the most die hard fanbase on television, and now it doesn't compete with Big Bang Theory, if it holds most of its audience it should get it's back 9 & possibly continue after season 4. Look how Fringe has survived for 3 seasons on Fridays and that's way more expensive, and Chuck is the best example because that's also a show that belongs to Sony that Sony wanted to air more episodes of so they'd have more for syndication & so they made it really cheap for NBC to keep on for 2 seasons or so on Fridays. Community's in the exact same boat, and already has a syndication deal in place for 2013.

Also, as we know Sony's keen on more episodes for syndication, and NBC doesn't own the show, if they do can it, Sony can pivot it onto cable, a hope that's strengthened by the TBS rescue of Cougar Town last week.


All that said, I want them to know when the show's going to end so they can plan the ending arcs properly, and I don't want it to get dragged out if it's going to go down hill. It could turn weird like what happened with Scrubs, always a cult show that somehow got pimped out for 2 or 3 years after it should have ended because of syndication money & wore down its reputation.

The show set up its date with destiny with Jeff planning his graduation dinner for May 2013 at the very beginning of the show, unless they make a strong effort to pivot the show away from Greendale & make it work, I'd rather they get their back 9 and end around graduation in season 4.

If it doesn't continue to be about these 7 characters, it wouldn't be worth it, but then again Greendale gives the show its live action Simpsons quality with its universe of background characters, so it'd be weird to lose any of that too, even though they've already successfully separated the characters from the campus for the bulk of this season.
 
Anyone see McHale on Leno last night? :lol:

Yep. "Scottish gigolo" :giggle:. The story about the grape drink was great, too. He makes me happy.

Also, after last week, how can anyone's favorite character not be Troy at this point?

I love Troy. It's pretty hard to pick a favorite, though, they're all wonderful. I freely admit the end of the last of the three episodes tonight actually brought a bit of a tear to my eye-I'm glad this show's getting another season, even if it does wind up being a shortened one.

Also, the video game episode was excellent.
 
If people keep skipping through the commercials, advertisers won't buy spots and networks won't have the money to invest in programming. Either you can't skip ads on DVRs, you have to deal with pop-up ads in programming or all shows are going to have product placement.

I pay 100 bucks a month for cable. I don't want to watch commercials. If they fuck with the dvrs and prevent people from skipping commercials, I'd just go back to torrenting my shows. If they really go full retard with the pop up commercials, I'll just wait for my shows to come on netflix or for the DVD rips.

These companies have to realize times are CHANG-ing. Old ways of raising revenue no longer work. The rating system is flawed. They either have to get with the times and adapt, or become obsolete.





Those episodes were excellent by the way. That would have been an excellent series finale, but I'm even more glad it isn't.
 
I pay 100 bucks a month for cable. I don't want to watch commercials. If they fuck with the dvrs and prevent people from skipping commercials, I'd just go back to torrenting my shows. If they really go full retard with the pop up commercials, I'll just wait for my shows to come on netflix or for the DVD rips.

These companies have to realize times are CHANG-ing. Old ways of raising revenue no longer work. The rating system is flawed. They either have to get with the times and adapt, or become obsolete.





Those episodes were excellent by the way. That would have been an excellent series finale, but I'm even more glad it isn't.

I agree with this. Some people say that anyone who torrents is ruining a show but I've spent the past ten years watching almost every show that's really good and stands out get cancelled because of the terrible ratings/commercial system. Meanwhile mediocre* shows get to run for 8+ seasons long past the point where the show should have ended (example: HIMYM).

It's time for a change. I am so tired of sitting through five minutes of commercials 2-3 times in a single episode. Hulu is so much more tolerable. I could do a more in depth post on this later, so bear that in mind. My brain is kind of foggy right now (four hours of sleep)

*When I say "mediocre", I just mean that the show doesn't have a "wow!" factor. The show may have been good at first, but they drag it out for so long that it starts to feel repetitive and like you're not getting anything new out of it anymore. Sometimes shows will change just for the sake of getting more viewers and it will alienate the original viewership. Yet these are the shows networks pay attention to because they appeal to the old audience of tired adults that come home from work and veg out all evening, not people who schedule time out of their busy day to sit down and watch a show.
 
I agree with this. Some people say that anyone who torrents is ruining a show but I've spent the past ten years watching almost every show that's really good and stands out get cancelled because of the terrible ratings/commercial system. Meanwhile mediocre* shows get to run for 8+ seasons long past the point where the show should have ended (example: HIMYM).

It's time for a change. I am so tired of sitting through five minutes of commercials 2-3 times in a single episode. Hulu is so much more tolerable. I could do a more in depth post on this later, so bear that in mind. My brain is kind of foggy right now (four hours of sleep)

*When I say "mediocre", I just mean that the show doesn't have a "wow!" factor. The show may have been good at first, but they drag it out for so long that it starts to feel repetitive and like you're not getting anything new out of it anymore. Sometimes shows will change just for the sake of getting more viewers and it will alienate the original viewership. Yet these are the shows networks pay attention to because they appeal to the old audience of tired adults that come home from work and veg out all evening, not people who schedule time out of their busy day to sit down and watch a show.

Exactly.

They cry that piracy is killing the industry, but they don't realize that 7 minutes of show/4 minutes of commercials, the constant intrusive pop up advertisements that take up the bottom half of the screen, and the shitty quality of most shows are driving people away.

Most of the stuff on the networks is atrocious. Whitney is awful, but gets another season. Big Bang theory is blackface for geeks. Two and a half Men is crap. FX and AMC are putting out good shows, but I can't get lost in what's on screen if I'm constantly being pulled out because of stupid commercial breaks. Thank God for HBO and DVRs.

I'm leery about trying out new shows because I don't want to get into one and then it suddenly gets cancelled to make way for another reality show or laugh tracked sitcom. The half dozen network shows I watch all seem to be coming to an end next year. Once they're all done, I may cut the cord for good.

Community is a great show and it will live on like Arrested Development did on Netflix and through DVDs.
 
One day my mom was watching a DVD of "Bewitched" episodes. After it'd stopped and I went to take the DVD out I noticed the time limit on the episode that had stopped.

It was about 25 minutes, without the commercials. Whereas "Community" episodes are noted as clocking in at 21, 22 minutes minus the commercials. Found that rather interesting.

I'll be willing to sit through whatever I have to sit through in order to watch shows I love, but yes, there's a LOT of revamping that TV networks need to do, be it with advertising or the shows themselves. I haven't seen the shows people talk about here that you feel suck or have gone downhill (did read cobl's post/rant in the "How I Met Your Mother" thread, though-I don't watch that show, but I do like to read the thread for some reason. Yeouch), so I can't comment on them. And what doesn't appeal to me will appeal to others and vice versa.

But I do think originality is a very valuable trait and more shows should strive for it. At the same time, I also understand that some viewers out there aren't obsessive about TV the way others are, they just want something that doesn't tax their brain after a hard day and just want a half hour of entertainment, or background noise. So I dunno how we can balance that out so that everyone's happy.
 
One day my mom was watching a DVD of "Bewitched" episodes. After it'd stopped and I went to take the DVD out I noticed the time limit on the episode that had stopped.

It was about 25 minutes, without the commercials. Whereas "Community" episodes are noted as clocking in at 21, 22 minutes minus the commercials. Found that rather interesting.

I'll be willing to sit through whatever I have to sit through in order to watch shows I love, but yes, there's a LOT of revamping that TV networks need to do, be it with advertising or the shows themselves. I haven't seen the shows people talk about here that you feel suck or have gone downhill (did read cobl's post/rant in the "How I Met Your Mother" thread, though-I don't watch that show, but I do like to read the thread for some reason. Yeouch), so I can't comment on them. And what doesn't appeal to me will appeal to others and vice versa.

But I do think originality is a very valuable trait and more shows should strive for it. At the same time, I also understand that some viewers out there aren't obsessive about TV the way others are, they just want something that doesn't tax their brain after a hard day and just want a half hour of entertainment, or background noise. So I dunno how we can balance that out so that everyone's happy.

Back in the 50s and 60s advertising was mainly right before a show started and right after, and it was usually one sponsor adverting a program, that's why the Flintstones did ads for Philip Morris for example. Shows ran longer then. When they air stuff on TVland and those types of channels they really butcher some of the shows to squeeze in commercial breaks, it's especially evident with hour long programs.

I'd have no problem with product placements within shows, as long as it doesn't distract from the story and it's not evident, but dropping in longer commercial breaks with stupid ads that are almost insulting is just ridiculous.


I've never seen BBT summed up so aptly. Seriously impressed with this.

*bows*
 
I thought the finale itself was the weakest of the three, but holy shit, those first two were stellar.

You guys - I even liked all the Chang stuff. :ohmy:

The little Abeds killed me.
 
I thought the finale itself was the weakest of the three, but holy shit, those first two were stellar.

You must be my evil doppledeaner- or I you-as I thought the last episode was a solid rescue from the disappointment of the first two. All three episodes had a good string of funny jokes, and Danny Pudi really knocked it out of the park the whole way through, but it was hard to stop noticing how clumsy the setup writing was and the unearned emotional beats they were trying to hit. Over and over, characters would walk into a room and then decide to start dropping clear exposition. It felt stilted, like we were watching a televised stage play. I mean, really? You're doing an homage to Super NES games, but concerned about making sure casual viewers wouldn't feel left out?

A detail I really liked was having Jeff in the last episode be pre-occupied in court with trying to study for his Biology final. It was a welcome reminder of something sometimes shunted aside, which is that the study group members have diverse motivations. Too often it gets boiled down to something like "give Pierce the selfish and racist dialogue". End character. I have to confess that I understand why Chevy's a bit disgruntled with Harmon's writing: after three seasons, I've dropped my expectations to a Better Off Ted-level of "well, it's a good joke vehicle".

The little Abeds killed me.

Little Abeds. :heart:
 
Back in the 50s and 60s advertising was mainly right before a show started and right after, and it was usually one sponsor adverting a program, that's why the Flintstones did ads for Philip Morris for example. Shows ran longer then. When they air stuff on TVland and those types of channels they really butcher some of the shows to squeeze in commercial breaks, it's especially evident with hour long programs.

So I've heard, yeah. My mom's ranted about that before, how shows will be edited and bits taken out to save time to get the ads in. You see the full unedited version on DVDs only most of the time now.

I'd have no problem with product placements within shows, as long as it doesn't distract from the story and it's not evident, but dropping in longer commercial breaks with stupid ads that are almost insulting is just ridiculous.

Agreed. As stated, commercials in and of themselves aren't necessarily the problem. Advertising helps pay the bills. We get that.

It more often seems to be that the commercials people make now are really stupid and obnoxious. They're patronizing, or nonsensical, or loud compared to the shows, or whatever. Again, I mention the ads for TV shows during other shows. It's one thing to have a thing in the bottom corner mentioning a show-visible enough to notice, but doesn't distract too much from what you're currently watching. A subtle means of saying, "Hey, this show's coming on if you want to watch it!"

But no, ads of that sort have to have people from the show popping up in the corner to walk around or dance or something, or the ad has to be taking up half the freaking screen. Hell, I remember watching an episode of a show once and it hadn't even finished yet, and all of a sudden some character from a new show being advertised literally pushed the current screen aside, and a promotion for that new show ran. That sort of tactic doesn't make people any more interested in what you're selling. It annoys them and makes them turn elsewhere to watch their shows where they don't have to put up with such intrusions.

Plus, some would argue that if the product is that good, you shouldn't have to resort to such measures to promote it.
 
I'm in agreement with mobvok. The video game episode draaaaaaaaaagggged. Once again, another episode with next to no laughs that the fans will go crazy over because it's another high concept one.
 
I laughed quite a bit at the video game episode :shrug:. When I saw the promo things online for that episode I wasn't sure if it would work, but I thought it was fine. I'm not a gamer at all, but I don't feel like the show was holding my hand and explaining everything to me as the episode went on.
 
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