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Old 06-08-2008, 06:20 PM   #91
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^Hanoi Hilton is a fairly common American term for a notorious POW camp in Vietnam
http://www.vietnamwar.com/hanoihilton.htm
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Old 06-08-2008, 06:29 PM   #92
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That would be the place where McCain got his 'degree' on torture.

He also, eluded to it in a speech the other day,

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“A few days ago, Senator Clinton tried to spend one million dollars on the Woodstock concert museum. Now my friends, I wasn’t there. I’m sure it was a cultural and pharmaceutical event. I was, I was tied up at the time.."
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Old 06-08-2008, 06:30 PM   #93
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OK, thank you. I was afraid it was more literal belittling his time as being POW.
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Old 06-09-2008, 01:46 AM   #94
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The primary reason I’ll be voting for Hillary in November, it has been the media which is increasingly blurring the line between news and commentary...I want no part of these coronaters and I want no part of this coronation if those are the tools they chose to use. Strong women aren’t wanted if they don’t go along with the plan. That is the message I took away. From my party. That’s the message I don’t forgive.
What specifically would you have liked to have seen the Party/high-ranking Democrats do? Which specific media incidents should they have spoken out on? And do you think there's precedent for expecting that? (I do understand what you mean by "the narrative," and it may be that campaign coverage in today's newsmedia is unprecedently more reckless there than in the past...though even as I type that, I'm getting flashbacks to the coverage of Jesse Jackson's 1988 campaign--Time's front cover incredulously screeching JESSE?!? over a grotesque facial portrait, stuff like that.)

This is an observation, not a criticism nor a justification, but I think one important way in which the incidents logged by that Post column differ from their (real or hypothetical) racist counterparts is that, sadly, the people laughing along at the 'Hillary Nutcracker', or at NPR's political head proclaiming "Hillary Clinton is Glenn Close in Fatal Attraction," or at Chris Matthews' assorted ugly nudge-nudge-wink-winks, are quite often women themselves, operating under that all-too-familiar delusion of "Well I can't stand her either, so it's OK." So long as that kind of thinking remains widespread at the grassroots level, it's hard to feel much optimism about the prospect of the higher-ups feeling motivated to speak out. I can't say I was shocked by any of it.
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Old 06-09-2008, 03:48 AM   #95
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The writer of the article thought that the high-ranking Democrats should have spoken out. I don't think I required that particularly. "From my party" meant that too many of those talking heads were, I presume, Democrats. That was probably sloppy way of putting it. I remember the Time article. It sickened me. I never had much interest in the primaries. PA has a late primary and we are rarely a factor in choosing the nominee so in most years the primary is moot for me. But I was kind of rooting for Jesse that year partially because of that cover (though he was carrying some baggage with the Hymietown remark).

I absolutely agree with you that many, many women play into it. We eat our own sometimes for reasons I can only speculate. I think there is an inherent sexism among women--at least for leadership roles. My mother does not believe women should be leaders. My father--staunch conservative that he is--has absolutely no problem with women leaders (or women priests, for that matter). He's thrilled with our new woman commissioner (a Democrat, no less). And I have no doubt if a woman was running, that he found ideologically suitable, he would vote for her.

Obama's campaign was right though. Words do have meaning. Not just the positive ones.
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Old 06-09-2008, 01:01 PM   #96
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It won't be the first time self-righteous Democrats have shot themselves in the foot.
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Old 06-09-2008, 01:03 PM   #97
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^The above comments brought to you by the numbers 6 and 8.
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Old 06-09-2008, 05:46 PM   #98
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it seems to me that if what you loved about Hillary was her support for the Iraq fiasco as well as the Kyl-Lieberman resolution, than McCain is your (wo)man!
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Old 06-09-2008, 05:52 PM   #99
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OT, but am I alone in thinking that Cindy McCain looks like she drinks Botox? She's sort of plastic.
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Old 06-09-2008, 06:47 PM   #100
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OT, but am I alone in thinking that Cindy McCain looks like she drinks Botox? She's sort of plastic.
Yes you are. I think Cindy is stunning and would make an excellent first lady.
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Old 06-09-2008, 06:52 PM   #101
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I just typed "Cindy McCain" into Google images and this was the first image that appeared:
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Old 06-09-2008, 07:17 PM   #102
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Cindy is stunning .
Botox tends to make you look stunned. She's pretty, but nothing special; very pageant queen perfect. It doesn't matter, it was just an observation.
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Old 06-09-2008, 07:22 PM   #103
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Cindy McCain's looks have nothing to do with the election.
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Old 06-09-2008, 07:26 PM   #104
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and would make an excellent first lady.
I don't know much about her, what makes you say this?
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Old 06-09-2008, 07:27 PM   #105
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Hence the reason I said OT. I remember hearing about a poll back during the 04 campaign asking if people preferred Laura Bush or Theresa Heinz-Kerry for First Lady. Because, you know, that's totally relevant.
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