coemgen said:
See, I find this interesting. Even though you're attracted to men, it was gross at first to see two men holding hands?
no, i find myself still finding it unusual. when i was thirteen, i might have thought it was gross, but that was a knee-jerk reaction when reality was different (and i was interested in kissing another boy, but that's a long, long story).
but what complicates this is that kissing or holding hands or cuddling with a boyfriend is as natural as breathing to me. i never think, "weird, two guys kissing," whereas if i saw two guys kissing outside of a gay bar, i'd take notice. i certainly don't think it's gross (now, i might be jealous) but even for me, as a gay man living in a gay-friendly city, gay public displays of affection are so rare and i was brought up without any gay-positive images, that any gay PDA is going to catch my eye.
that's how deep social homophobia goes.
[q]Yes, but again, my whole point is that race is different than sexuality. I know you're saying they're the same because people are born that way, but we're talking about skin color verses what you do when you're naked with somebody. Apples and oranges, man.[/q]
have you met any genuinely racist people? how they think of black people (or whomever) is really very much the same as how homophobes see gay people, and a genuine racist would find a black man kissing a white woman as repulsive as a homophobe finds two men kissing.
and what i'm getting at is that the revulsion we feel is more due to social conditioning than anything else. no, a straight man doesn't want to perform oral sex on a man, and a gay man doesn't want to perform oral sex on a woman. that, to me, seems indicative of one's sexual orientation. that which turns you on. but when you are repulsed by the thought of a sexual act that is not natural to your orientation, that, to me, is indicative of how heteronormative society is.
again, i use myself as an example. i am uninterested in female sex organs. but i know straight men are. and they can do what they want. i have no interest, but i respect their interest, and i don't find it, or them, gross.
but you seem to be saying that it's perfectly okay for someone to find me gross, and that it's a perfectly normal extention of their heterosexuality to deem gayness gross. and i'm saying that the "gross" distinction is socialized and conditioned, it's not intrinsic to heterosexuality.
What verses are you refering to to justify that crap? I've honestly never heard of any . . . unless they come from the Book of Mormon. [/B]
i'd have to go digging, but it's no secret that the Bible was used to justify slavery, and to support anti-miscegenation laws, not least of which was in Loving vs. Virginia in 1967, where only 40 years ago it was illegal for blacks and whites to marry.