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Old 11-08-2004, 05:55 AM   #46
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Kerry's campaign relied too much on image and not enough on substance. He tried to sell an image of himself as a "brave Vietnam veteran" when he should have been articulating plans for the fiture. We vote for presidents, not a package from GM. Also, he tried selling Clinton's message without Clinton's political skills, and it didn't work.
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Old 11-08-2004, 06:02 AM   #47
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Originally posted by diamond on another thread




Looking at this got me thinking about another thing that backfired on Kerry. He and his people were always pushing the 'this is the most important election of our lives!' thing, and 'the time is now, this will decide the future of our nation, we all must get out and vote, it matters!' Well. Apparently the message DID get out, because we had a record number of voters. However, unfortunately for him, he overestimated and misjudged how many people agreed, but not in the way he wanted
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Old 11-08-2004, 06:04 AM   #48
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It's encouraging to see California so red.
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Old 11-09-2004, 05:44 AM   #49
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http://www.cnn.com/2004/ALLPOLITICS/...icy/index.html

"Before criticizing the Democrats or Kerry too strongly, it is worth remembering that if out of the 115 million-plus voters nationwide, some 70,000 had switched sides in Ohio last week, we would be trumpeting President Kerry instead of President Bush. We would be discussing the groundbreaking miracle of a Catholic, a senator and a Northeastern liberal winning the presidency against a talented and well-funded wartime commander. But as my father taught me long ago, life is a game of inches, and so once again Bush won a difficult presidential election.

In analyzing the 2004 Democratic effort, many political observers will focus on "MMC": the messenger, the message and the campaign. Many of those critiques are likely to be right on. Kerry could have been a more charismatic and enjoyable candidate; Democrats should have had a clearer policy message -- a brand so to speak; and the campaign's television ads and get-out-the-vote effort could have been better.

But one critique that you may not hear is that the next Democratic candidate needs to love policy more. What do I mean? I mean that one of Kerry's real weaknesses may ultimately have been that he did not seem to love policy broadly and know what he wanted to do -- separate and apart from the political strains of the moment or the polls. And so when he discussed creating jobs, fixing the situation in Iraq or helping kids improve their education, the talk sounded to undecided or uninspired voters like just that -- talk. It did not sound concrete and real to many voters (including more than 80 million people who were eligible to vote but did not cast a ballot for Bush, Kerry or anyone else last week).

Part of that may be because while senators create new programs and guidelines, they do not implement them. They often do not see firsthand the jobs being created or destroyed, the list of parks to be cleaned up across a state or the number of new courses the state universities will offer this year. But governors do see such things.

Now that does not mean that any governor is automatically better than any senator as a presidential candidate. But it does mean that the most effective presidential candidates love policy, think deeply and broadly about it, and can personalize it as well. So as the Democrats head into 2008, they would do well to find not only a politically talented candidate or a candidate who just happens to go to church, but a policy-talented candidate whose ideas as well as her or his image and manner will connect with voters."
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Old 11-09-2004, 10:03 AM   #50
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On another board that I frequent, someone mentioned that maybe the next Democratic candidate should be pro-NRA/ guns. They would still maintain the whole pro-abortion rights/ gay rights thing but just concede on that issue. That would swing some states supposedly. Interesting theory/ idea and something the party should consider...
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Old 11-09-2004, 10:35 AM   #51
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Kerry's goose photo op didn't seem to help.

People who support gun control are anti-choice
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Old 11-09-2004, 10:41 AM   #52
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Quote:
Originally posted by Flying FuManchu
On another board that I frequent, someone mentioned that maybe the next Democratic candidate should be pro-NRA/ guns. They would still maintain the whole pro-abortion rights/ gay rights thing but just concede on that issue. That would swing some states supposedly. Interesting theory/ idea and something the party should consider...
Good grief, do you know which Democratic big shot has a perfect score from the NRA? None other than Howard Dean! He even gave John Kerry some passion, he might give it to the left again in the future. He's someone else to watch out for, in my book. I'm sure he's learned alot from his presidential run. If Iraq goes the way I think it will go, into the Quagmire From Hell--I'm sorry, I'm really pessimistic about Iraq's future-- we just might be ready for him next time.
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Old 11-09-2004, 10:53 AM   #53
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If Dean takes the DNC leadership post, he will not be able to run for 2008. He seems like he's seriously thinking about it.

I think it was funny how Dean got bashed by his own party and media for talking about trying to reach out to the guys in pick-up trucks, with confederate flags, and guns... LOL... now it seems like that part of the country/ populace may have cost Kerry and the democrats the election. The Dems must be scratching their heads sheepishly now...
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Old 11-09-2004, 11:07 AM   #54
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Quote:
Originally posted by U2Kitten
Kerry's goose photo op didn't seem to help.

People who support gun control are anti-choice
The photo-op defintely did not help.

This isn't so cut and dried. I know people who are for gun rights but are pro-abortion rights. The south isn't all about/ filled with Evangelcals or southern Baptists.

Its not about taking a whole lobby/ group from another party. 4 years isn't enough time to do that. Its called dividing the base of your opponent so that they won't vote for the opposing candidate or for them to vote for your candidate. There are single issue voters out there who could care less about economic policy for instance. However gun rights are extremely important to them b/c it is personal. The NRA mobilizes their base well and when an election system such as ours in which an electoral college system determines basically the winner, these small voting blocs probably count. Some people look at gun rights an issue concerning individual freedoms. The democrat party proclaims to be a party of choice and civil rights and freedoms. IMO it wouldn't be hard for their party to embrace the "individual's right to own a gun." Of course it would probably antagonize some of the dems in their party, but politicians aren't above the idea of compromising their ideals in order to win.
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Old 11-09-2004, 12:01 PM   #55
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True, if Dean takes the DNC post he won't be able to run in 2008. He might steer the DNC in the right direction as party head, however. Perhaps he's better off in the DNC role than he would be as a candidate, anyway. He's got some good ideas for the party.
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Old 11-09-2004, 12:11 PM   #56
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The one potential negative for Dean would be, if by the end of Bush's 2nd term, Iraq becomes stable and relatively successful. Remember how much egg Dean got when Saddam was caught... sure he ain't Osama, but Dean came off as too negative when Hussein got caught. Personally, I hope for success and that by the end of the 2nd term, Iraq becomes a successful venture. Without that little Iraq thing, Dean IMO doesn't look as appealing. However, Dean is charismatic and seems to want to reach out for votes which doesn't hurt.
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Old 11-09-2004, 12:14 PM   #57
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The one thing about being the head of the DNC is that he becomes an annoying talking head on every news station/ paper. People got on Dean for his scream and other verbal gaffes. Well the scrutiny stays the same if you are the DNC head IMO. Face it, Dean will be in everyone's face just as McCauliffe was b/c that seems to be the nature of the postion. I always wonder with Dean's temperment, how he will come across to being in the public eye.
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Old 11-09-2004, 12:48 PM   #58
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Quite frankly, I think the "scream" incident in Iowa was a classic case of the press making a mountain out of a molehill. For some reason, Americans are a bit leery of politicians who express too much emotion. I think this is unfortunate. It's the passionate ones who are the ones who can ignite passion in the electorate if you ask me. But actually, I just officially joined Dean's group, Democracy for America, and signed up for a Meet-Up that will occur on the first of December. I can't stop now. It's amazing how many people have signed up with them just since the election. Maybe I'll find out more about his plans at my first meeting.
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Old 11-10-2004, 07:16 AM   #59
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WASHINGTON - Leaders of several women's groups said Tuesday that Democrat John Kerry fell short in his bid for the White House because he didn't make a more direct appeal for support from women voters.

They noted 2000 Democratic nominee Al Gore got 11 percent more support from women voters than George W. Bush did. Kerry's advantage over Bush among women was less — 51-48 in national exit polls.

Democratic pollster Celinda Lake said the candidate's support eroded from 2000 levels among white women, working women and married women.

"There was an assumption women would be behind the Kerry campaign," said Kim Gandy, president of the National Organization for Women.

The Bush campaign referred to the liberation of Afghan and Iraqi women to appeal to women voters, said Eleanor Smeal, president of the Feminist Majority. But "Kerry never drew a very strong contrast with Bush" on women's issues until the end of the campaign, said Martha Burk, chair of the National Council of Women's Organizations.

Kerry campaign strategist Michael Meehan said: "John Kerry got 5 to 6 million more votes than any Democrat running for president. Clearly, we appealed to a lot of people, but fell short.
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Old 11-10-2004, 12:00 PM   #60
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I'm not going to bash democrats, but their party needs reformation and definition. They used to appeal to the working class, instead of Hollywood. Now they appeal to the rebellious crowd, which is not a good thing. Campaigning for issues like gay marriage, stem cell research, and abortion are not going to get you elected. Trying to appeal to gays and feminists is killing their party's moral standards. Dropping those issues altogether and focusing on what can benefit the working class - black and white - is how they could get my vote.

Karl Rove is a genius. I'm surprised Bush ran for re-election the way his term had been going. However, I think moral issues should matter much more than they do. People should vote for what they believe in, not just what they were raised with, or vote based on what their ethnicity is. I think it's headed closer in that direction though. The Hispanic population is finding that republicans are for a strong family, and breaking their ethnic gap.

I think the real reason Kerry lost is because he didn't show mainstream America how he could unite the country. Instead, the Kerry campaign I saw was loaded with Bush-bashing and bordered by radicals like Michael Moore, who would've badmouthed the president even if we found bin Laden.

My message is that we should work together instead of bash the president, because it doesn't do any good. People are tired of hearing accusations, so am I. You don't have to be in power to be patriotic and support your leaders, even if they have a different view.
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