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Old 11-21-2006, 08:14 PM   #46
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Originally posted by AEON
If kids have both a crappy home and a crappy school - are they simply destined for failure?
Yeah, some are.

And some aren't.

But a crappy home has much more influence in a child's life than a crappy school.
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Old 11-21-2006, 08:17 PM   #47
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Originally posted by martha


Yeah, some are.

And some aren't.

But a crappy home has much more influence in a child's life than a crappy school.
True. But a good, inspiring teacher can at least offer a ray of hope.
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Old 11-21-2006, 08:19 PM   #48
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True. But a good, inspiring teacher can at least offer a ray of hope.
I try.
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Old 11-21-2006, 08:26 PM   #49
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Quote:
Originally posted by AEON

I think we all agree there are some pretty crappy parents out there. I admit, mine were crappy. But along the way - there were several AMAZING teachers that convinced me I could make something of my life.
I presume you went to public schools?

I went to mediocre public schools myself.

My question,
if your parents had the voucher option, do you believe you would have received a better education?
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Old 11-21-2006, 08:35 PM   #50
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Don't forget where all the voucher money comes from: the public school budget.

Just keep that in mind before you start giving away my funding.
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Old 11-21-2006, 08:44 PM   #51
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i suppose

if we offered vouchers in Michigan

our tax dollars could set up a few madrasahs' in the detroit area
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Old 11-21-2006, 08:53 PM   #52
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Quote:
Originally posted by martha
Don't forget where all the voucher money comes from: the public school budget.

Just keep that in mind before you start giving away my funding.
I am pretty sure that any effort to level out the quality of our K-12 education is going to involve richer people losing money in some way or other. I can't buy this argument as an essential argument against vouchers.
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Old 11-21-2006, 08:54 PM   #53
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Originally posted by deep
i suppose

if we offered vouchers in Michigan

our tax dollars could set up a few madrasahs' in the detroit area
I suppose they could, if the madrasahs were sponsored by a university or a board of education.
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Old 11-21-2006, 08:57 PM   #54
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I am pretty sure that any effort to level out the quality of our K-12 education is going to involve richer people losing money in some way or other. I can't buy this argument as an essential argument against vouchers.
Dude, then you have no idea how schools are funded.
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Old 11-21-2006, 09:17 PM   #55
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Dude, then you have no idea how schools are funded.
Dudette, I am confused by your remark. Are you implying that (1) crappy inner-city schools receive as much funding as high-achieving suburban schools, (2) you have a plan for fixing education in crappy inner-city schools that doesn't somehow involve higher taxes or redistributing funds, or something else?
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Old 11-21-2006, 09:37 PM   #56
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Quote:
Originally posted by deep


I presume you went to public schools?

I went to mediocre public schools myself.

My question,
if your parents had the voucher option, do you believe you would have received a better education?
Yes. I was able to attend Catholic School High School when I went to live with the Jesuits. If I had been in Catholic grade school - I am certain I would have had a better education.
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Old 11-21-2006, 10:30 PM   #57
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Originally posted by speedracer


Dudette, I am confused by your remark. Are you implying that (1) crappy inner-city schools receive as much funding as high-achieving suburban schools, (2) you have a plan for fixing education in crappy inner-city schools that doesn't somehow involve higher taxes or redistributing funds, or something else?
Dude, schools are (partially) funded per student. This means that when students don't attend school, the schoos loses funds. In my state, absences cause lost funds. The kids who get vouchers, take the per student funding away with them.

As per the inner-city school $ question, schools with high ratios of lower-income students get federal Title 1 money. Your average suburban school doesn't see a dime of Title 1 funds. Hell, we're lucky to get our Title 5 money.

And, where do you think the voucher money will come from? The Funding Fairy? It's all tax dollars, and it's all school budget dollars. No one's going to take highway funds and buy little Johnny a private school educatiuon. Nope, the money comes out of public school classrooms.

You want better inner city schools? Pay the good teachers to stay there, get the parents involved, and then see what happens.
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Old 11-21-2006, 10:46 PM   #58
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Quote:
Originally posted by speedracer


I am pretty sure that any effort to level out the quality of our K-12 education is going to involve richer people losing money in some way or other. I can't buy this argument as an essential argument against vouchers.
When you calculate the amount of money taken from the school per child, you may have a different opinion.
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Old 11-21-2006, 10:47 PM   #59
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Quote:
Originally posted by martha

You want better inner city schools? Pay the good teachers to stay there, get the parents involved, and then see what happens.
Increasing teacher salaries still involves taking money away from rich(er) people. If crunching the numbers shows that this is a more efficient solution, then great.
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Old 11-21-2006, 10:52 PM   #60
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Originally posted by speedracer


Increasing teacher salaries still involves taking money away from rich(er) people. If crunching the numbers shows that this is a more efficient solution, then great.
It (vouchers) does not take away from the teacher salary. It does not take any more or less away from the rich.

The salary's are stagnant. They are what they are. The next largest expense in our school budget is utilities.

It comes out of texts, supplies, aids...

And that $10-25,000 that leaves with a voucher hurts the school, not the teacher.
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