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Old 01-29-2003, 08:41 PM   #1
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War Stories

This topic has been brought up before, but no real response has been given. In the movie and in real real life one of our smart bomps accidentily dropped on a refugee camp.

I'd like to hear the response from the supporters of this war on their view of the loss of human life. Not propoganda from either side. How can we as the nation that believes most in the individual stomach the loss of life we will be starting. NOT FINISHING, BUT STARTING.

Please no rhetoric, no parties, I want want guts and feelings. How will you feel the next day?
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Old 01-29-2003, 10:00 PM   #2
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Re: War Stories

Quote:
Originally posted by Scarletwine
This topic has been brought up before, but no real response has been given. In the movie and in real real life one of our smart bomps accidentily dropped on a refugee camp.

I'd like to hear the response from the supporters of this war on their view of the loss of human life. Not propoganda from either side. How can we as the nation that believes most in the individual stomach the loss of life we will be starting. NOT FINISHING, BUT STARTING.

Please no rhetoric, no parties, I want want guts and feelings. How will you feel the next day?
I do not particularly relish the thought of possibly killing an innocent Iraqi civilian.

For that matter, I do not particularly relish the thought of killing an Iraqi soldier or ruler either.

Now let me turn the question around...

Scarletwine, how can you stomach the loss of life that will be allowed to continue over the next 10, 20, maybe 100 years, in Iraq and elsewhere, if the Ba'ath party is not removed from power?

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Old 01-29-2003, 10:05 PM   #3
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I do not want civilians to be killed. I want a regime change in Iraq to occur.

~U2Alabama
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Old 01-29-2003, 10:06 PM   #4
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What Speedracer said!
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Old 01-29-2003, 10:07 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally posted by U2Bama
I do not want civilians to be killed. I want a regime change in Iraq to occur.

~U2Alabama
exactly.
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Old 01-29-2003, 10:31 PM   #6
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In Bono's words, "I can't cope with the idea that an idea is greater than a human life."

Those people are no less our brothers and sisters than our neighbours. I can't cope with the idea of killing them. They're not collateral damage, they are human beings. I want no blood on my hands.
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Old 01-29-2003, 10:36 PM   #7
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The potential number of civilians that will die in the longterm, if Iraq is not disarmed and the regime changed, is far greater than those that might die in a 3 week war that does not target civilians.
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Old 01-29-2003, 10:38 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally posted by STING2
The potential number of civilians that will die in the longterm, if Iraq is not disarmed and the regime changed, is far greater than those that might die in a 3 week war that does not target civilians.
this is also true.
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Old 01-29-2003, 10:51 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally posted by anitram
In Bono's words, "I can't cope with the idea that an idea is greater than a human life."

Nobody said anything about "ideas".
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Old 01-30-2003, 08:09 AM   #10
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Re: War Stories

Quote:
Originally posted by Scarletwine
How can we as the nation that believes most in the individual stomach the loss of life we will be starting. NOT FINISHING, BUT STARTING.

Please no rhetoric, no parties, I want want guts and feelings. How will you feel the next day?
I don't think we can. I certainly can't. I think about the thousands of people who died last time, about the children growing up without parents and the families torn apart by the loss of a loved one. I think about the newspaper reports on children as young as seven and eight who are taking anti-anxiety medication because they're so traumatised by the thought of a war. I think about the hundreds of thousands of refugees forced to leave their homes, their families, everything that is familiar to them and somehow attempt to put their lives back together in a new country. I think about the people injured and unable to get medical help, about the people who go without food because war disrupts food supplies, the people with no clean water because again because of the disruption of war.

How will it make me feel if my government attacks Iraq? I don't know. Either it will make me just so sad that we could engage in an action that's going to kill innocent people, or else I'll be just plan ANGRY with the government and want to do whatever I can to demonstrate that.
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Old 01-30-2003, 08:12 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally posted by STING2
The potential number of civilians that will die in the longterm, if Iraq is not disarmed and the regime changed, is far greater than those that might die in a 3 week war that does not target civilians.
How do you know how many people would die "in the longterm?"

How do you know it'll only be a three week war?

The aim of the war according to you would be regime change, and yet if Saddam doesn't lose power immediately, for example through a coup by opposition within Iraq, then the only way to take him out of power would be through on-the-ground fighting, which is likely to take place in Baghdad, and is surely likely to kill many innocent civilians.
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Old 01-30-2003, 09:28 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally posted by STING2
The potential number of civilians that will die in the longterm, if Iraq is not disarmed and the regime changed, is far greater than those that might die in a 3 week war that does not target civilians.
I thought we were going to use "shock & awe" tactics. Once again - no feelings
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Old 01-30-2003, 10:01 AM   #13
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Id feel like a killer.
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Old 01-30-2003, 10:44 AM   #14
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The answer? I don't know.

With Afghanistan, it was apparent that anything was better than the Taliban, and it was also very clear that the Taliban and terrorism were very much tied together. The only thing that really concerns me now about Afghanistan is that I think we may have created yet another weak government in a nation that will otherwise be run by feudal warlords. Again, that doesn't quite shock me. :/

But for Iraq? Even though their quality of life has plummeted since the UN sanctions, they could still get worse, if, again, like Afghanistan, they are given a weak puppet government. Lest we forget, this was once a relatively wealthy nation before the Gulf War, and I doubt that they'll accept being an oppressed third-world nation being exploited by American venture capitalists after the U.S. comes in and topples Saddam.

So, my answer is "I don't know." A lot of it depends on if Bush's morals are just a voting ploy to attract the Christian vote or the real thing.

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Old 01-30-2003, 10:49 AM   #15
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I suspect the supporters of the war, from here at Interference, will feel the same as those who oppose it in regard to the loss of life.
I'd hate to think there is a 'means to an end' mentality by those people. Perhaps there exists a kind of conflict among them where they are also fearful for the potential loss and the belief that the war, not the losses, has a purpose and a valid cause?

Collateral damage is a dreadful term.
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