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Old 09-02-2004, 11:51 AM   #46
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Quote:
Originally posted by A_Wanderer
You can prevent 1000 terrorist attacks with your intelligence agencies but it only takes a single one to shatter the fascade oif safety, I would rather end the problems that are creating terrorists than have to sit on my hands watiting for an attack. The number 1 lesson of 9.11. is that fighting terrorism cannot be done by law enforcement and intelligence alone - it is a pity that many have not realized this yet.

Yep. It was proven with 9/11.
The FBI & CIA were too busy being secretive with each other than working
with each other.
Bureaucracy at its worse.
I don't know what the solution is.
A combination of intelligence and law
enforcement? Maybe the best bet is
iinfiltrating these terrorist groups
Fact is these terrorists hate us, and
everything we stand for.
Knocking out terrorist cells and getting
rid of the leaders does put a dent on it,
but it seems there's always some other
loonies to take their place.
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Old 09-02-2004, 02:51 PM   #47
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Quote:
Knocking out terrorist cells and getting
rid of the leaders does put a dent on it,
but it seems there's always some other
loonies to take their place.
Of course there are allways people who take over the place of them.
You simply can't kill ideas, you can just convince people that their ideas are wrong
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Old 09-02-2004, 04:29 PM   #48
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I quote a left leaning person... when I say "Bush saying that the war on terrorism can't be won," as being one of the most sensible things he's said. IMO, people, especially on the side of the democrats, harping on Bush's recent comments, (and then saying "It can be won", "How can Bush say that?") just makes them look stupid.
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Old 09-02-2004, 04:36 PM   #49
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Quote:
Originally posted by Klaus
Of course there are allways people who take over the place of them.
You simply can't kill ideas, you can just convince people that their ideas are wrong
Actually I think that having a war against an idea is a brilliant political idea. Unlike the old-fashioned wars, where you can determine progress by how much land you've occupied, how many ships you've sunk, etc, a war on an idea can make whatever progress you'd like it to.

If you need to win an election, you can claim you're winnng it. If you need funding, you can say you're not doing so well and need more money. Who's to say otherwise? It's genius.
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Old 09-02-2004, 04:40 PM   #50
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Quote:
Originally posted by Flying FuManchu
I quote a left leaning person... when I say "Bush saying that the war on terrorism can't be won," as being one of the most sensible things he's said. IMO, people, especially on the side of the democrats, harping on Bush's recent comments, (and then saying "It can be won", "How can Bush say that?") just makes them look stupid.
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Old 09-02-2004, 04:56 PM   #51
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"After months of listening to the Republicans base their campaign on their singular ability to win the war on terror, the president now says we can't win the war on terrorism," said Democratic vice presidential candidate John Edwards, "This is no time to declare defeat."

``Let me tell you something: We can, we must and we will win the war on terror,'' Kerry said.
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Old 09-02-2004, 04:59 PM   #52
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Whoops, I screwed up how I was quoting or maybe paraphrasing.... I meant to say that I agree with this sentiment...

Bush saying, "that the war on terrorism can't be won," is one of the most sensible things he's said so far.
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Old 09-02-2004, 05:04 PM   #53
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Damn i haven thought of that one - bushs spindoctors are smart
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Old 09-02-2004, 05:42 PM   #54
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I have to say I (mostly) agree with Bush. Terror, abstractly, will pretty much always be a factor in geopolitical conflict. It's already been around for a long time in many different forms, and it will continue to be with us. We can develop new tactics and try to fight what we can, but a war on terror is, by definition, unwinnable. It's very much like the war on drugs.

To quote Dennis Miller: "Even if we could conceivably ban every single mind-altering drug and absolutely stop them from getting into people's hands, folks would spin around in circles on their front lawns until they fell down and saw God."
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Old 09-02-2004, 06:03 PM   #55
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Quote:
Originally posted by cydewaze

Actually I think that having a war against an idea is a brilliant political idea. Unlike the old-fashioned wars, where you can determine progress by how much land you've occupied, how many ships you've sunk, etc, a war on an idea can make whatever progress you'd like it to.

If you need to win an election, you can claim you're winnng it. If you need funding, you can say you're not doing so well and need more money. Who's to say otherwise? It's genius.


Nineteen-Eighty-Four came 20 years late.
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Old 09-02-2004, 06:22 PM   #56
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It's not 1984 we have to worry about so much as Brave New World.
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Old 09-02-2004, 06:32 PM   #57
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Sure, that too
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Old 09-02-2004, 06:37 PM   #58
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ThatGuy, did you ever read Amusing Ourselves to Death by Neil Postman? I think you'd enjoy it. My younger sister gave it to me and I thought it was a really powerful read.
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Old 09-02-2004, 06:49 PM   #59
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I have not read it but it looks very interesting. I'll definitely check it out. Thanks for the recommendation.
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Old 09-02-2004, 10:05 PM   #60
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Quote:
Originally posted by Klaus


I couldn't agree more!

Military, Inteligence and Foreign Policy have to play together to solve the problem.
Hypocracy in foreign politics simply feeds the terrorists because they can show potential followers that the other side is a "big satan" who dosn't act like he talks. (Example: supporting "good terrorists" to destabilize a country you disslike)

Intelligence is neccessary to prevent us from daily terrorist attacks, military is necessary to defend us against an IMMINENT threat.



Japan wanted to become a "western" country, Germany was allready a democracy before hitler (Weimarer Republik) (I'm sorry, i don't know much about the history of South Korea)

I think there are situations where a Military strike is necessary but i think military strikes against terrorism are overrated because you can't win against terrorists when you are bombing their bases. They are not structured like our military, it's like bombing a single country to destroy the internet - it simply wouldn't work.

It's no big deal if they call themself "Al-Quaida", "Islambuli-Brigades" or whatever, they don't need one big mastermind behind that. They don't need huge training camps, if they want to they could simply send their people as volunteers to the US army for some years to get the basic training they need.
These men are "powered by hate" and if we don't care about the sources of their hate, we are doomed.
Of course we can't make every single person happy in this world but we can stop the majority of people to support the extremists.
The US military and coalition forces are absolutely necessary in the war on terrorism. Without them, Afghanistan will still be a huge base for terrorist. Intelligence agence would have been easily defeated by Al Quada and the Taliban if that is all we had sent to Afghanistan.

The Military is absolutely necessary in the war on terrorism regardless of the tactics or training of the terrorist. Most of the terrorist that have been captured or killed in this war have been captured or killed by the military.

Japan wanted to fight to the last man for their dictator. It was not a country that was on the verge of democracy at the start of the World War II. It was a very different culture and the United States enforced a change. The constitution Japan uses today was written by the United States.
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