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Old 02-21-2007, 07:56 PM   #106
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Originally posted by Justin24
I am pro-war because it's my choice to believe in such a thing as destructive as it is. But do I say have war all the time no, but when it does happen especially when it happens in ur country you must support it to destory your enemy.
So, if I had lived some 65 years ago I should have supported the war my country waged?

No, I would have welcomed every country that joined to smash these assholes (hopefully).

Sometimes, you can't avoid a war because the other party only wants war. But as long as there is any alternative, you should exploit it.
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Old 02-21-2007, 11:08 PM   #107
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Originally posted by BonoVoxSupastar


What?! So if the Klan start war in your city, you'd support it?
Nope I would fight against them, why? Because they want to destroy which leads to war, so coming around again war is unavoidable.
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Old 02-21-2007, 11:34 PM   #108
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Originally posted by Vincent Vega


So, if I had lived some 65 years ago I should have supported the war my country waged?

Ironically, it was the "peace" crowd of the late 1930's that made the eventual World War that much worse.

Inaction is action. If you sit still and watch a murderer stab someone to death, that puts the knife in your hands as well.

Sometimes, there is a time for war.
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Old 02-21-2007, 11:36 PM   #109
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Originally posted by AEON


Ironically, it was the "peace" crowd of the late 1930's that made the eventual World War that much worse.

Inaction is action. If you sit still and watch a murderer stab someone to death, that puts the knife in your hands as well.

Sometimes, there is a time for war.
One could make an argument that it was the preceding war (WWI) and the harsh punitive sanctions imposed on the "losers" by the "victors" that created the conditions for WWII. In which case it would be a matter of war creating more war. It really never is the answer.
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Old 02-21-2007, 11:41 PM   #110
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Originally posted by AEON

Sometimes, there is a time for war.
I agree in principle.

But I also recognize this is a toss-away statement thrown around mostly by people who have never experienced war. Definitely not in their homes and on their streets and with the possibility of losing their children on a daily basis.

People who have lived through that - you quickly recognize them, because the way they talk about war is entirely different.
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Old 02-21-2007, 11:42 PM   #111
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Originally posted by sulawesigirl4


One could make an argument that it was the preceding war (WWI) and the harsh punitive sanctions imposed on the "losers" by the "victors" that created the conditions for WWII. In which case it would be a matter of war creating more war. It really never is the answer.
That certainly did play a part. I can't argue with that. However, it was clear to many people very early on what Hitler master plan was - yet those in power decided to sit on their hands.
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Old 02-22-2007, 10:57 AM   #112
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Holy Fuckin' Shit! I can't believe that you wrote that you were pro-war, pro-life and pro-peace all in the same sentence, Justin. If you're pro-war, then I don't see how you can be pro-life. We should just ship your ass off to the Middle East and see how you really feel. You probably wouldn't last 5 minutes. Then you wonder why I say that it appears as if you are between the ages of 15-19 and not 25 like you allege that you really are. Because of foolish comments like this. Don't you realize that if you say enough foolish things like this, that no one is going to value you're opinion?
So let me break it down for you:
War=Bad
Peace=Good
War has never solved anything.
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Old 02-22-2007, 11:19 AM   #113
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Quote:
Originally posted by AEON


Ironically, it was the "peace" crowd of the late 1930's that made the eventual World War that much worse.

Inaction is action. If you sit still and watch a murderer stab someone to death, that puts the knife in your hands as well.

Sometimes, there is a time for war.
What I intended to say was, that in war you shouldn't always blindly support your own country.

I'm well aware of the fact that the inaction, and also the appreciation of Hitler by people such as Lioyd George and Winston Churchill before 1939, of politicians and the ordinary people, and their blindly following led to the war, and I know that the people here in Germany, but also in Austria and Italy knew at least to some extent what was going on with the Jews, Sinti & Roma and other minorities, and what happened in the concentration camps.

Justin made the statement, that you should be pro-war in order to support your own country, when not physically then morally, so that your country can "smash the enemy".
I just wanted to show that you shouldn't support your country in each and every war, or that your country isn't always the right one to fight this war.

Like in the case of WWII it would've been better to be in favor of the allies instead of the Nazi crap.

This, however, is not meant in any way to critizise or blame the German, Austrian or Italian citizens that weren't opposed to the war, or just didn't undertake anything, as it was very dangerous at that time to say anything wrong, and you never know how you would act yourself.

I have the utmost respect for people like Sophie and Hans Scholl and their fellow "White Rose" activists, as for Dietrich Bonhoeffer, as for all other people that in some way or another did their part in fighting the Nazis.

But people that didn't do anything, although they didn't agree to what happened, aren't to be blamed as it was a very risky thing to do anything, and not everybody is a person to put his own life to risk, or that of his/her whole famile ("arrest of family" was the least that happened, still very brutal).
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Old 02-22-2007, 11:27 AM   #114
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I should have made it clear, I meant to support your country when it needs to be made right. So let's say the Klan was becoming a huge force, I would support my country to stop them since they are an enemy. If I were living in Germany during the Third Reich I would be opposed to it and try to stop it.
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Old 02-22-2007, 11:30 AM   #115
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Quote:
Originally posted by MrPryck2U
Holy Fuckin' Shit! I can't believe that you wrote that you were pro-war, pro-life and pro-peace all in the same sentence, Justin. If you're pro-war, then I don't see how you can be pro-life. We should just ship your ass off to the Middle East and see how you really feel. You probably wouldn't last 5 minutes. Then you wonder why I say that it appears as if you are between the ages of 15-19 and not 25 like you allege that you really are. Because of foolish comments like this. Don't you realize that if you say enough foolish things like this, that no one is going to value you're opinion?
So let me break it down for you:
War=Bad
Peace=Good
War has never solved anything.
But Peace can also be a mask. If you go to China people will say there happy, and that they live in Peace. But in reality they have to live under a government that tells them what to do and if you don't you go to jail or are re-educated.
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Old 02-22-2007, 11:35 AM   #116
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Really, going by the things you've said in the last few pages, I think you'd be suiting up for Hitler and fighting for Germany. During WWII, the Klan was the entire country of Germany. If you weren't with Hitler, they found you and killed you or they shipped you to a camp. Sorry, but your response is bogus because you've ruined your credibility with you previous responses.
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Old 02-22-2007, 11:38 AM   #117
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Please. I hate hitler and his nazi regime and the KKK. My grandfather fought in WW2 and Korea. So if we were invaded would you be part of the flower power brigade and put dandilions in the barrels of your enemies?

You must live in a world were you think everything will be peaceful "SomeDay"
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Old 02-22-2007, 11:45 AM   #118
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Quote:
Originally posted by Justin24
I should have made it clear, I meant to support your country when it needs to be made right. So let's say the Klan was becoming a huge force, I would support my country to stop them since they are an enemy. If I were living in Germany during the Third Reich I would be opposed to it and try to stop it.
I hoped so. I just wanted to make clear that your country isn't always on the right side.

Here in Germany we always say something to the extent of, "I hope, if I lived at that time, I would have done something against it."
We never say something like "I would" or "will" because it's too hard to say for sure.

But that may be something cultural here in Germany as we still have a very special "relationship" with that time.
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Old 02-22-2007, 11:47 AM   #119
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Do you reaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaalllllllllllllllly want to know something. As I was explaining the yin and Yang theory right. So here we have people (Vincent Vega and Mr Pryck and others against who are against) Then you have me who is for so you see you need a balance. And just to let you know. I would rather have peace in this world. I am just showing you how everything needs a balance. Other wise FYM would be so fucking Dull.
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Old 02-22-2007, 11:57 AM   #120
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Quote:
Originally posted by Justin24
Please. I hate hitler and his nazi regime and the KKK. My grandfather fought in WW2 and Korea. So if we were invaded would you be part of the flower power brigade and put dandilions in the barrels of your enemies?

You must live in a world were you think everything will be peaceful "SomeDay"
To the first paragraph: I think, if the Vietcong or the North Vietnamese Army, or any other army, had invaded the USA something like the hippie movement wouldn't have existed, as people would have fought to defeat the enemy and save their country.

There are wars, like WWII, that happened, and there was no way it didn't happen, except for some miracle killing Hitler and his fellow idiots. So, to fight against Nazi Germany was a war to be fought, and had the leaders of the world read his book more carefully, they would hopefully have started a war way earlier instead of enjoying the Olympic Games in 1939 and falling for his lies in Munich. Hitler wanted this war, so sooner or later the war would have happened.

Whenever there is a reasonable possibility to avoid war, one should take this, and really only go to war when every other means failed, or it is obvious that the other side clearly wants a war to happen.

Before WWI every European country was waiting for the final incident to declare a war. If there was no assassination of Crown Prince Franz Ferdinand, some other incident would have led to the war, as the tensions between the European countries were too strong.

To the second paragraph: Why should we abandon the hope that sometime in the future war will be history?
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