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Old 07-31-2003, 10:33 AM   #1
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vatican issues guidance for politicians dealing with same sex marriage

and the advice is dont allow it. a 12 page document approved by the pope states
Quote:
Marriage exists solely between a man and woman ... Marriage is holy, while homosexual acts go against the natural moral law.
...
Legal recognition of homosexual unions or placing them on the same level as marriage would mean not only the approval of deviant behavior ... but would also obscure basic values which belong to the common inheritance of humanity.
the globe and mail's posted excerpt from the vatican

a few countries in europe already having long ago made the bold move to legalize marriage for homosexuals as well as heterosexuals, canada has now become a focal point for the issue as canadian courts have ruled laws making marriage only possible for a union of man and woman are unconstitutional and presently null and void. the federal government stated it would not appeal this ruling and went about rewriting the law which is now waiting for constitutional evaluation from the supreme court.

america seems to be lacking the champions of this issue canada has. bush yesterday stated marriage
Quote:
is between a man and a woman.
cnn link

much like america and bush however, the leaders of canadian government are devout catholics. the three most important people in this situation are pm jean chretien, virtual shoe-in for incoming pm paul martin and justice minister martin cauchon. all of whom have described themselves as practicing catholics. and now a calgary bishop has openly criticized chretien for his apparent divergence of personal values,
Quote:
"He doesn't understand what it means to be a good Catholic," Bishop Fred Henry of Calgary said in an interview. "He's putting at risk his eternal salvation. I pray for the Prime Minister because I think his eternal salvation is in jeopardy. He is making a morally grave error and he's not being accountable to God."
globe and mail link

it seems apparent that chretien is placing the state above his religion and bush vice versa. for this i am pleased.

it is long since past the time when this barrier fell for homosexual couples. i would be indignant if the catholic church was successful in its bid to turn the tide of canadian legislation toward reinforcing this societal inequality.
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Old 07-31-2003, 10:34 AM   #2
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It definitely makes one wonder about the separation between church and state.
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Old 07-31-2003, 10:38 AM   #3
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The Vatican makes me sick to my stomach.

I do not mean offense to any Christian people out there, I simply feel the establishment of the Vatican and their edicts are not modern, not forward-thinking, and truly intolerable to those who follow their faith (especially in this case, homosexuals.)
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Old 07-31-2003, 10:51 AM   #4
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Old 07-31-2003, 10:57 AM   #5
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Bush is not Catholic.
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Old 07-31-2003, 10:58 AM   #6
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No he is not, but he is Christian and it is a coincidence the Vatican comes out with its edict the same day the President of the United States comes out with his...
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Old 07-31-2003, 11:09 AM   #7
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"He doesn't understand what it means to be a good Catholic," Bishop Fred Henry of Calgary said in an interview. "He's putting at risk his eternal salvation. I pray for the Prime Minister because I think his eternal salvation is in jeopardy. He is making a morally grave error and he's not being accountable to God."
It's comforting to know there are so many direct mouth pieces from god here on earth to aid us in our day to day walk.
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Old 07-31-2003, 11:35 AM   #8
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"He doesn't understand what it means to be a good Catholic," Bishop Fred Henry of Calgary said in an interview. "He's putting at risk his eternal salvation.
To me, this is the most dangerous statement of all. The Bishop is trying to take away what only God can give. This is a perfect example of how religious authority abuses the pulpit for political purposes.

Threaten excommunication (you can always find another church), but threatening loss of salvation is inexcusable.
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Old 07-31-2003, 11:53 AM   #9
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nbcrusader: absolutely

since i din't search the bible yet for homosexuality, any hints in which books the bible writes about homosexuality?

And.. wouldn't it be a good idea to (like planed in GB) alow the Homosexual mariage, but just give it a different name but with exactly the same rights like in a hetrosexual mariage?

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Old 07-31-2003, 12:05 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally posted by nbcrusader


To me, this is the most dangerous statement of all. The Bishop is trying to take away what only God can give. This is a perfect example of how religious authority abuses the pulpit for political purposes.

Threaten excommunication (you can always find another church), but threatening loss of salvation is inexcusable.
Exactly!! This made me quite angry to read, and it's this type of "I'm right, you're wrong" behavior that is just bullocks.

sula, separation of church and state. It's the only freaking way people can live as they want to, and as God let them live: with free choice!!

Imagine loving God and being a Christian, but also being gay and being told by those who run the church that you're immoral for being who you are. Doesn't the church see they are pushing people away (straight & gay)? When did Jesus ever do that??

Sorry but any marriage is about love, and people's OWN lives. So long as they aren't hurting anyone else, that is none of the state's business.

AND good for Chretien. If Bush doesn't like it, well then first change the law to say that the church can rule the state (which I'm sure he will/is/would try to do). And then make the decisions about who can marry who (and other things like which women can receive birth control). Until the church and state aren't separate, these issues shouldn't be coming up.
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Old 07-31-2003, 12:21 PM   #11
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oliveu2cm:

Verry good! I guess we really don't need laws that everything the current leader of the country disslikes is forbidden.

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Old 07-31-2003, 12:38 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally posted by nbcrusader


To me, this is the most dangerous statement of all. The Bishop is trying to take away what only God can give. This is a perfect example of how religious authority abuses the pulpit for political purposes.

Threaten excommunication (you can always find another church), but threatening loss of salvation is inexcusable.
I agree, and heck, I'm even a practicing Catholic also. It burns me up that the Vatican and the bishops are singling out gays and people who defend gay unions as "risking their salvation". They are acting like a bunch of Inquisitors, terrorizing any one who disagrees with their *politics*. This is *not* cool.
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Old 07-31-2003, 03:36 PM   #13
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and i wonder why i am thinking about leaving the Catholic church.
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Old 07-31-2003, 04:01 PM   #14
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Wow, how can the vatican, full of unmaried males that are living together can say something like this. priests are not contributing to the inheritance of humanity .
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Old 07-31-2003, 04:11 PM   #15
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The Vatican has been out of touch with the people and reality of existence for decades now. As AIDS ravages the world, they speak out against condoms. This is just another edict in a long line.

That Bishop should be concerned with his own salvation, leave people to theirs.
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