US Presidential Election XII
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BVS
Blue Crack Supplier
Why would you believe this? He's specifically telling you otherwise.
Hewson
Blue Crack Supplier
Did you just say that the US will reassert its right to free trade by scrapping free trade?
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LuckyNumber7
Blue Crack Addict
No no. Nobody has heard Donlad Trump clearly. He's not opposed to "Fee Trade" with China. He's okay with making China produce everything. He's going to talk to the right people. He's going to negotiate "a better deal." Just believe him, they're gonna pay for it.
IWasBored
Blue Crack Supplier
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Wait, so he's going to create jobs by building? Is this more shit about that goddamn wall? Are those the "jobs" he's creating? Is this like how he's good for LGBTQ people because he's going to ban Muslims and they hate gay people? 
Bluer White
New Yorker
https://youtu.be/d99E4R4GS9Q
Goddammit, don't they know this is just whitewater 2.0?
So tired of conservative propaganda machines like The Young Turks. They're clearly in the bag for Trump.
Disgusting.
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Goddammit, don't they know this is just whitewater 2.0?
So tired of conservative propaganda machines like The Young Turks. They're clearly in the bag for Trump.
Disgusting.
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Ok, and what's the point here? This is how the system works. Cheney worked for Halliburton, who got contracts in Iraq?? Obama basically kept placing Goldman Sachs execs into his administration and treasury department.
It sucks. It shouldn't happen, but it does. Is it shady, bad decision making, or illegal? Maybe in some cases.
Life isn't black and white. And elections suck.
I am going to take someone who's acted in their own interest, even if somewhat reckless or slight disregard for rules, versus an orange idiot who wants to ban brown people, and make the best deals
Why? Because I don't want to see the entire system crash and burn. I don't want Mike Pence making the decisions. I don't want to see marriage equality set back, or voter rights, or whatever else.
Because I don't think Clinton is going to start WW3, or Nuke someone willy nilly
Clinton is more than qualified based on her resume and experience. She doesn't appear to have the best judgement all the time, but we're talking about setting people up with her foundation and/or staff. Hosting a private server (which others have done)
Not asking questions like "why can't we use nukes?"
There is such a difference here.
Again, we don't have perfect choices. We don't live in a perfect world. This is the hand we are dealt with. Do your best
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It sucks. It shouldn't happen, but it does. Is it shady, bad decision making, or illegal? Maybe in some cases.
Life isn't black and white. And elections suck.
I am going to take someone who's acted in their own interest, even if somewhat reckless or slight disregard for rules, versus an orange idiot who wants to ban brown people, and make the best deals
Why? Because I don't want to see the entire system crash and burn. I don't want Mike Pence making the decisions. I don't want to see marriage equality set back, or voter rights, or whatever else.
Because I don't think Clinton is going to start WW3, or Nuke someone willy nilly
Clinton is more than qualified based on her resume and experience. She doesn't appear to have the best judgement all the time, but we're talking about setting people up with her foundation and/or staff. Hosting a private server (which others have done)
Not asking questions like "why can't we use nukes?"
There is such a difference here.
Again, we don't have perfect choices. We don't live in a perfect world. This is the hand we are dealt with. Do your best
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I'm married to one of you geeks.
Surely nobody actually believes that construction ("building") is going to turn around the economy? And what are we turning around to be exact?
I guarantee you can't actually defend this point.
What decision did Joe Biden make for the country? Unless you're arguing that, should Trump die, Pence would govern from a much more Religious Right perspective. If so, this is a legitimate point.
Look, I feel the need to emphasize once again that I think Trump is obviously unacceptable. But to really make a claim for the moral high ground when shilling for Hillary is just beyond the pale to me.
Vote Hillary. Shit, I was heavily considering doing this until very recently. But at least acknowledge what this election is. A completely incompetent candidate vs arguably the most openly corrupt candidate of modern times. We can keep debating whether she is, but I can go days with the evidence.
http://www.politifact.com/wisconsin...y-clinton-took-money-kings-four-countries-go/
Huh, I can't imagine why Clinton's state department approved weapons deal after weapons deal for Saudi Arabia. I wonder how much money has flowed into her pockets from Saudi during this election? Nah, Hillary's not the type to let that sway her.
Besides, it's not like Saudi used those weapons to bomb mostly civilians in Yemen, the poorest country in the Middle East. And it's not like Saudi kills gays. Or beheads atheists.
Even if, trump wants to kick out illegals. The moral choice is clear!
EDIT: I'm really tired of making the distinction between private email and private server. They aren't equivalent. Some Secretaries of State have used the former. Hillary Clinton has used the latter. As far as I know, she is the only SoS to do so. I could be wrong, but I do not believe I am. Also, you all realize that these new emails were discovered amongst emails that had been deleted from her server, if I understand this correctly, right? We still gonna argue over whether she had a private server for less-than-legitimate reasons?
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Oregoropa
Rock n' Roll Doggie Band-aid
Brace yourselves for the next wikileaks dump
I'll put it this way, Hillarys issues/shortcomings aren't as big of a deal compared to Trump. Simple as that.
Hillary isn't calling for mass deportation of illegals. I can promise you she doesn't want illegals here either. No one does. It's Trumps plan that lacks any sort of sense, and compassion at all. You cannot just up and deport 11 million people. It isn't feasible, but that's his plan.
He also wants to ban the other brown folk from the Middle East coming into the country, and has made statements about creating a database to monitor the ones already here. I get it, he means it's a temporary ban on anyone from countries that sponsor or have had issues with terrorism. So guess someone from France or Germany can't migrate here since they're a hotbed of Islamic terror right now. For a person who talks about the values of America, and a party that gets hard over anything in the constitution, this proposal goes against everything this country was founded on, and continues to stand for. You cannot be a free country, and deny others based on religion, country, ethnicity, etc
We have a vetting process, I think it's pretty good.
He's just the worst. No experience, no knowledge of law, economics. And already he's surrounded himself with idiots (Pence) and Wall Street guys. He told Kasich that he would be in charge of domestic and foreign policy, and I imagine the same is true for Pence. Trump will be too busy making us Great
It is his complete lack of knowledge on any subject, his overt racist and nationalistic tone, and disregard of any moral compass that disgusts me more than a person getting funky with emails or deals with bad guy countries. Until Hills is actually convicted of something, I will hold my nose and vote for her.
I guess my struggle is how anyone could vote for Trump.
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Hillary isn't calling for mass deportation of illegals. I can promise you she doesn't want illegals here either. No one does. It's Trumps plan that lacks any sort of sense, and compassion at all. You cannot just up and deport 11 million people. It isn't feasible, but that's his plan.
He also wants to ban the other brown folk from the Middle East coming into the country, and has made statements about creating a database to monitor the ones already here. I get it, he means it's a temporary ban on anyone from countries that sponsor or have had issues with terrorism. So guess someone from France or Germany can't migrate here since they're a hotbed of Islamic terror right now. For a person who talks about the values of America, and a party that gets hard over anything in the constitution, this proposal goes against everything this country was founded on, and continues to stand for. You cannot be a free country, and deny others based on religion, country, ethnicity, etc
We have a vetting process, I think it's pretty good.
He's just the worst. No experience, no knowledge of law, economics. And already he's surrounded himself with idiots (Pence) and Wall Street guys. He told Kasich that he would be in charge of domestic and foreign policy, and I imagine the same is true for Pence. Trump will be too busy making us Great
It is his complete lack of knowledge on any subject, his overt racist and nationalistic tone, and disregard of any moral compass that disgusts me more than a person getting funky with emails or deals with bad guy countries. Until Hills is actually convicted of something, I will hold my nose and vote for her.
I guess my struggle is how anyone could vote for Trump.
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Is uprooting an illegal alien worse than giving weapons to a dictatorship that murders civilians left and right?
At the very least, you've gotta call that a wash lol.
I'm not saying Trump is better. I'm simply saying that to conclude that anyone voting for trump is a moral cretin, while anyone supporting Clinton is simply voting virtuously is very, very self serving.
Also, let's have an intellectually honest conversation. Describing having corrupt businessmen guilty of defrauding Nigeria donate millions of dollars to your campaign in order for you to connect them with Lebanese advisors so that he can have his say in policy decisions is not a "funky email." Does this ever get tiring?
A deal with a bad guy country makes it sound like we're trading with countries with bad civil rights records. That's one thing. Having the leadership of said bad guy country funnel insane amounts of money into your pockets in order for you to approve weapons deals that provide them with the weaponry to unleash death on the civilians of the poorest country in one of the poorest regions of the world is something quite different. Does this ever get tiring?
And you've the hubris to sit there and contemplate how anyone could be so debased as to vote for Trump? Does this ever get tiring?
I really don't mean to make you the focal point of this - I actually agree with you more than I agree with most other posters on this board. But the Hillary shilling going on from the majority of posters here is just exasperating.
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At the very least, you've gotta call that a wash lol.
I'm not saying Trump is better. I'm simply saying that to conclude that anyone voting for trump is a moral cretin, while anyone supporting Clinton is simply voting virtuously is very, very self serving.
Also, let's have an intellectually honest conversation. Describing having corrupt businessmen guilty of defrauding Nigeria donate millions of dollars to your campaign in order for you to connect them with Lebanese advisors so that he can have his say in policy decisions is not a "funky email." Does this ever get tiring?
A deal with a bad guy country makes it sound like we're trading with countries with bad civil rights records. That's one thing. Having the leadership of said bad guy country funnel insane amounts of money into your pockets in order for you to approve weapons deals that provide them with the weaponry to unleash death on the civilians of the poorest country in one of the poorest regions of the world is something quite different. Does this ever get tiring?
And you've the hubris to sit there and contemplate how anyone could be so debased as to vote for Trump? Does this ever get tiring?
I really don't mean to make you the focal point of this - I actually agree with you more than I agree with most other posters on this board. But the Hillary shilling going on from the majority of posters here is just exasperating.
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Oregoropa
Rock n' Roll Doggie Band-aid
Bluer White
New Yorker
about Trump being a builder...
Look at his past. He has built buildings, golf courses, casinos and an ice rink in NYC. He is talking about bringing back jobs. That means building factories, where people can work making things again. He really is a voice for the disenfranchised blue collar worker.
I am confused what he exactly said otherwise...?
agree
No, it will be tough, but nothings worth it that isn't hard to do, if you believe that cliché. Why are we taking the easy way out and unloading shipment after shipment from China while the unemployment rate (the real one) stands so high.
Oregoropa
Rock n' Roll Doggie Band-aid
cobl04
45:33
Of all the things Trump has said, the Obama founding ISIS thing is one of his more reasonable. It's rhetoric, but I get where he's coming from.
nbelcik
Refugee
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Lowering taxes and reducing regulations is the basis of trickle down. His economic plan is based on lowering taxes, it's a trickle down believers wet dream.
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He has clarified that it was not rhetoric.
And if you get what he is coming from, then why isn't it Bush's fault? But for him invading Iraq on a lie, nothing else that followed would have happened (including ISIS).
IWasBored
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Didn't the democrats blame him for Al-Queda? (or his father at least?) can't give their family all the credit now.
Seriously, this man is an imbecile.
If he wants to make a rhetorical point that Obama's policies and decisions contributed to the founding of ISIS, he can. I will disagree, and like you direct the blame back further to Bush and Blair, but the argument's there to be made and he was given a wide open opportunity to embrace it.
But to double down and claim Obama is actually a founder of ISIS? That's fucking delusional, no matter where you stand.
I cannot fathom how Trump has any support left even from his own side of politics. His party needs to knife him. Come visit Australia to learn how; our two main parties are world experts in the field! We'll knife a leader for almost anything.
Oregoropa
Rock n' Roll Doggie Band-aid
Kieran McConville
ONE love, blood, life
Is there a small outside possibility that he thinks Osama is the founder of ISIS? I'm just grasping for straws here.
He flat out said Obama is the founder, and Clinton Cofounder.
You could make the argument that our policies helped form ISIS (going as far back as Colin Powell mentioning Baghdadi and giving him cred)......but that's not what Trump replied. He said FOUNDER.
It's insane. Even when presented with a topic he could clearly make a great point, he goes full retard
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Kieran McConville
ONE love, blood, life
I was mostly joking.
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