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Old 05-13-2017, 08:17 AM   #91
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Well PizzaGate hasn't really stopped despite being enough evidence that it wasn't true (and for being so stupid )

Unfortunately with someone like Trump, we are going to see a ton. Someone like Bannon on staff also knows how to play up this angle.

At least with Bush there was some obvious angles but still stupid. 9/11 Truthers for example, and to prove point they still exist.

The toughest part of all of this is being patient and trusting our intelligence agencies to do their job.
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Old 05-13-2017, 08:49 AM   #92
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Well PizzaGate hasn't really stopped despite being enough evidence that it wasn't true (and for being so stupid )

Unfortunately with someone like Trump, we are going to see a ton. Someone like Bannon on staff also knows how to play up this angle.

At least with Bush there was some obvious angles but still stupid. 9/11 Truthers for example, and to prove point they still exist.

The toughest part of all of this is being patient and trusting our intelligence agencies to do their job.
In the case of people believing in conspiracy theories, there is an inverse relationship with evidence to debunk the theory: The more you confront them with facts counter to their theory, the stronger their belief in it.

I loved the humor of this tweet: "Trump is mad about leaks from his White House, according to leaks from his White House"

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Old 05-13-2017, 06:44 PM   #93
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For those who want a good laugh or cry. A wtf week! This doesn't even include today where trump called cnn anchors lunatics and the dumbest people lol. This is truly a comedy show!! Spicer hiding in the bushes? Who needs SNL when you have a real life SNL at the Whitehouse!

Most WTF Moments From Trump's WTF Week - Rolling Stone
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Old 05-13-2017, 11:24 PM   #94
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Wow! Russia just wrote the White House press release about the North Korea missile test!...

https://twitter.com/kylegriffin1/sta...88815499395072

This can't be real can it?
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Old 05-14-2017, 02:05 PM   #95
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What are the thoughts on North Korea in here? The world has kind of just ignored them to the point that these little outbursts don't seem too serious.

I know they don't have the technology to do a lot of damage (supposedly) at the moment, so it could all be just a show.

I don't want a war, but I really think it's time Russia and China starts putting more pressure on them. If NK does somehow do some real damage, that hurts everyone. Not just the West. I would think it's in everyone's best interest to not let NK keep doing what they're doing.

And if they don't, regardless of Trump being in charge (or anyone else) I would not be that upset with us using military action.

Eventually NK will hurt another country.
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Old 05-14-2017, 02:50 PM   #96
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the US unilaterally making a preemptive military strike or starting a war would be an unfathomable foreign policy mistake and unless the chinese are fully and openly involved and supportive of the action i can't see how that wouldn't lead to a humanitarian crisis that would make syria look like fun party, or even to a full-on shooting war with china in the end.

i wouldn't be surprised if there is a particularly greedy general working under kim who's on the chinese payroll. i think best case scenario something happens to kim and this general steps into power, takes control of the NK military, and invites the chinese in to rebuild the country.

i can't find the article anymore but i read something recently that says intelligence makes it clear that there is no succession plan whatsoever in the case of kim's untimely death or removal, because part of the political philosophy of juche is that the leader is semi-divine while on earth, but ultimately immortal and death is merely just his passing on power to the next generation and heading off into retirement as a dictator-emeritus/god. hence why kim il sung is "eternal president" and revered as if he was taken up into heaven like jesus rather than having died. they just believe that the leader is going to live as long as he chooses, so making plans for anything else is effectively high treason against the dictator.

in the event that there's a coup or assassination the vacuum of power would inevitably lead to a struggle between the next most powerful men in the country; the generals. the one who wins would almost certainly be the one that had the backing of china, of course. we know chinese intelligence is operating at all levels throughout the kim administration. i think this is probably the most ideal endgame as it wouldn't lead to korean war II, any destruction in SK, geopolitical problems with an american-backed korea on the chinese border, the movement of refugees out of NK into china/SK is probably more controlled, the chinese would make giant sums of money rebuilding the entire country and this way north korea could be integrated back into the international community at a reasonable pace. sure, north korea would then fully be a chinese puppet state, but considering they kinda are that already (albeit a not very obedient one lately), and of all the other possible outcomes this seems like the least painful and the one least likely to ultimately lead to a much bigger war. just my amateur assessment
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Old 05-14-2017, 03:15 PM   #97
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Thank you for your opinion.

I don't want war. I don't want war with Trump at the helm.

And while I said I support military action I should have qualified that with support, specifically from china and that prob would never happen. I don't want the US to go alone at anything anymore.

My point is that a dangerous NK is a threat to the world. Russia, China, Germany, UK....what do they think would happen if NK does somehow lash out?

I feel it's time China starts flexing their muscle and knock NK in line.
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Old 05-14-2017, 04:39 PM   #98
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i do think china is starting to shift in its thinking on NK from idealism to pragmatism. the earlier generation that actually fought in korea is mostly gone now and the notion that they should prop up this unpredictable dictatorship out of principle is on its way out as well. especially when they have all that undeveloped land which is full of natural resources and an uneducated starving population that could be used in productive and prosperous ways if they're given the means and (controlled) freedom to do so. there's big money to be made bringing a market economy and social prosperity to north korea.

basically kim is getting less lucrative to keep in power and the new generation is seeing dollar signs. so it wouldn't shock me if things keep going the way they are for the chinese to eventually say "fuck it" and offer the most powerful general in the country the presidency (and the resultant license to print money that comes with it) in exchange for keeping the military under control when kim has a "heart attack" in the middle of the night. it'll still be a dictatorship, but at least a true chinese puppet state re-entering the international community wouldn't be a threat to global stability all on its own anymore.
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Old 05-14-2017, 04:50 PM   #99
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The fact South Korea now has a new president that wants to talk to the North and is against military action would almost kill any action by the US now surely? The US would have to be insane to strike without the assistance and approval of South Korea which is certain the new SK president wouldn't give.
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Old 05-14-2017, 05:32 PM   #100
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Yes.

https://newrepublic.com/minutes/1426...eories-twitter

There are endless examples of her buffoonery, how much of these does it need to take for many to stop treating her with credibility?
to be fair, she's not the only one harping on about the Russian thing - masses of credible journalists are on it as well, and a Dutch film-maker has just done an interesting documentary on alleged Trump ties to Russian mafia going back a loooong way...

it's kind of nice she's in the US and out of Brit politics though
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Old 05-14-2017, 06:32 PM   #101
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are you fucking kidding me?

Quote:
A torch-wielding mob chanting racist slogans descended on a Charlottesville, Virginia, park Saturday evening, to protest the removal of a Robert E. Lee statue.

Chanting "All White Lives Matter," and "No More Brother Wars," the crowd, which said they were protecting their "white heritage" from the Charlottesville City Council's decision to remove a statue in the Virginia town's park.

They also chanted "You will not replace us" and "Russia is our friend." Dozens of protesters also brought bamboo tiki torches to a second rally once it became dark out.

White Nationalist Leads Torch-Bearing Protesters Against Removal of Confederate Statue - NBC News

someone needs another punch to the face.
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Old 05-14-2017, 06:56 PM   #102
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Just saw that on the front page of Yahoo .

What. The. Hell?
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Old 05-14-2017, 07:21 PM   #103
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Wrong way to "defend" a statue of Lee. I don't view Lee as having anything to do with white supremacy. He was a great general, even though he fought for the wrong side. Did he own
slaves? They totally lost me with the "Russia is our friend" comment.
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Old 05-14-2017, 08:29 PM   #104
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Wrong way to "defend" a statue of Lee. I don't view Lee as having anything to do with white supremacy. He was a great general, even though he fought for the wrong side. Did he own
slaves? They totally lost me with the "Russia is our friend" comment.


You mean the same Robert E. Lee who turned down President Lincoln's request to lead the north against rebellion in the south, only to resign and become the military leader of a campaign that sought to ensure slavery continued to exist?

The same self righteous Robert E. Lee who routinely sent Americans to their death when outmanned, outgunned, and out-supplied, as though they were pawns?

The one that encouraged the beating of slaves due to their race?

I will never understand Lee apologist mentality. Robert E. Lee was a horrible person. He's no Erwin Rommel.
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Old 05-14-2017, 09:02 PM   #105
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You mean the same Robert E. Lee who turned down President Lincoln's request to lead the north against rebellion in the south, only to resign and become the military leader of a campaign that sought to ensure slavery continued to exist?

The same self righteous Robert E. Lee who routinely sent Americans to their death when outmanned, outgunned, and out-supplied, as though they were pawns?

The one that encouraged the beating of slaves due to their race?

I will never understand Lee apologist mentality. Robert E. Lee was a horrible person. He's no Erwin Rommel.
I don't have a problem with Lee resigning his post to fight for the South.
The slavery issue was not the main issue regarding the Civil War.
The South felt they were being squeezed economically by the North.
Lincoln believed at one time it would be better to send all the slaves
to Africa, because they couldn't exist in a "white society. Lincoln
quickly changed his opinion on that.

You are accurate that Lee's actions later in the war led to the
death of many of his own men. One has only got to look at Pickett's
Charge in Gettysburg. That was suicide pure and simple. Up till then,
Lee was a very good tactician.

I have never heard about Lee encouraging slaves to be beaten. If true,
I will certainly change my opinion about him.

I totally agree with your views on Rommel. He was by no means
a Nazi. My uncle served under him in the Africa Corps. My uncle
had nothing but praise for Rommel. My uncle also was not a Nazi.
He was a 19 year old forced to fight. It was either fight for your
country or go to prison.
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