United States would lose any war with China. - U2 Feedback

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Old 11-22-2005, 11:25 PM   #1
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United States would lose any war with China.

U.S. ground forces, with the exception of the Marines, are "extremely incompetent" and would be unable to stem a Chinese conventional attack.



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East Asia allies doubt U.S. could win war with China

Chinese troops lined up for a review by President Bush and China's President Hu Jintao on Nov. 20 in Beijing (Pablo Martinez Monsivais/AP)
The overwhelming assessment by Asian officials, diplomats and analysts is that the U.S. military simply cannot defeat China. It has been an assessment relayed to U.S. government officials over the past few months by countries such as Australia, Japan and South Korea. This comes as President Bush wraps up a visit to Asia, in which he sought to strengthen U.S. ties with key allies in the region.

Most Asian officials have expressed their views privately. Tokyo Governor Shintaro Ishihara has gone public, warning that the United States would lose any war with China.

"In any case, if tension between the United States and China heightens, if each side pulls the trigger, though it may not be stretched to nuclear weapons, and the wider hostilities expand, I believe America cannot win as it has a civic society that must adhere to the value of respecting lives," Mr. Ishihara said in an address to the Washington-based Center for Strategic and International Studies.

Mr. Ishihara said U.S. ground forces, with the exception of the Marines, are "extremely incompetent" and would be unable to stem a Chinese conventional attack. Indeed, he asserted that China would not hesitate to use nuclear weapons against Asian and American cities—even at the risk of a massive U.S. retaliation.

The governor said the U.S. military could not counter a wave of millions of Chinese soldiers prepared to die in any onslaught against U.S. forces. After 2,000 casualties, he said, the U.S. military would be forced to withdraw.

"Therefore, we need to consider other means to counter China," he said. "The step we should be taking against China, I believe, is economic containment."

Officials acknowledge that Mr. Ishihara's views reflect the widespread skepticism of U.S. military capabilities in such countries as Australia, India, Japan, Singapore and South Korea. They said the U.S.-led war in Iraq has pointed to the American weakness in low-tech warfare.

"When we can't even control parts of Anbar, they get the message loud and clear," an official said, referring to the flashpoint province in western Iraq.

As a result, Asian allies of the United States are quietly preparing to bolster their militaries independent of Washington. So far, the Bush administration has been strongly opposed to an indigenous Japanese defense capability, fearing it would lead to the expulsion of the U.S. military presence from that country.

On Nov. 16, Mr. Bush met with Japanese Prime Minister Junichiro Koizumi. The two leaders discussed the realignment of the U.S. military presence in Japan and Tokyo's troop deployment in Iraq.

During his visit to Washington in early November, Mr. Ishihara met senior U.S. defense officials. They included talks with U.S. Defense Deputy Undersecretary for Asian and Pacific Affairs Richard Lawless to discuss the realignment of the U.S. military presence in Japan.

For his part, Mr. Ishihara does not see China as evolving into a stable democracy with free elections.

"I believe such predictions are totally wrong," Mr. Ishihara said.
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Old 11-23-2005, 12:27 AM   #2
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well may i ask what you think of this?

first off, a war between china and the U.S. would not be guerilla war like iraq

it wouldnt even be much of a ground war

and nukes would fly
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Old 11-23-2005, 12:31 AM   #3
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Quote:
Originally posted by Joshua87
well may i ask what you think of this?

first off, a war between china and the U.S. would not be guerilla war like iraq

it wouldnt even be much of a ground war

and nukes would fly

So nobody wins.
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Old 11-23-2005, 12:39 AM   #4
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i still dont even think that is true, even if the war didnt go nuclear. the us carrier fleet is gigantic, theres no way china could conventially attack the american homeland. now whether or not the US navy/air force could defeat the chinese airforce and bomb them into submission is a different question.
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Old 11-23-2005, 01:25 AM   #5
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Thread title gave me a laugh..
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Old 11-23-2005, 01:27 AM   #6
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The overwhelming assessment by Asian officials, diplomats and analysts is that the U.S. military simply cannot defeat China.
What I think they mean to say is that the Asian countries represented by these officials could not defeat the Chinese army, and cannot rely on the current strength of the US military currently in place in these countries to act as a deterrent.
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Old 11-23-2005, 03:15 AM   #7
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What's this, are we being softened up for an 'inevitable' war with China now? Not the first time I've heard it mentioned recently.
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Old 11-23-2005, 03:21 AM   #8
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more to the point, why?

I mean, I'm sure they're all dirty commies or whatever, but they buy a lot of US dollars, and they make a lot of the stuff that the US buys. So why?
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Old 11-23-2005, 12:07 PM   #9
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If the Americans and the Chinese decide to nuke each other, it's the rest of us who are shit out of luck, through no fault of our own.
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Old 11-23-2005, 01:16 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally posted by nbcrusader


What I think they mean to say is that the Asian countries represented by these officials could not defeat the Chinese army, and cannot rely on the current strength of the US military currently in place in these countries to act as a deterrent.


i think this is correct.

it's quite distressing how mesopotamian adventures leave us more vulnerable to real, actual threats.
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Old 11-23-2005, 01:34 PM   #11
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Why does a Japanese say that?

Maybe this is a return because recently China brought up the cruel Japanese policy of conquering SE Asia in WW II.

Does Japan have beef with China? -> economy evryone wants to deal with the US?

I doubt China would attack the US, both are members in the Sec Council, what is that?
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Old 11-23-2005, 02:18 PM   #12
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America no longer has the spine do the things that a country must to win a war. America is too afraid of people's feelings to do the most brutal things that must be done in war.
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Old 11-23-2005, 04:13 PM   #13
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We've seen the last of the great clashes on this planet. The big players only get called upon to quiet down the noisy small-timers.

America vs. China = silly talk
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Old 11-23-2005, 06:34 PM   #14
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If America fought China in a conventional ground war, China would win. Chinese popular opinion simply does not have the same abhorrence to casualties that America does. That's not to say that the Chinese don't value life; it's just saying that they are more willing to sustain casualties.

China would use human wave attacks similar to the way they did it in Korea.

The only way the American Public is going to accept casualties at a rate that war with China will create is if said war is for American survival. One of those wars that if the US loses, the country is effectively done for.

A naval and air force war would likely be won by the US. The US Navy's capabilities now are comparable to the Royal Navy's capabilities in 1808.

A nuclear war - the entire world goes up.

Either way, it's a shitshow.
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Old 11-24-2005, 02:17 AM   #15
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:roll:

America would get whoop assed, limp back to the mainland and blame everyone else for their mistakes.

I think America is waving the 'democratic' flag a little to much in the face of a country who is doing well under its own steam.

I still think, until you've sorted out the problems in your own backyard, don't go point out others fault. And seriously, America is pretty fucked up.

But i just hope nothing comes of it, cause i already have a 5th of the world i can't go because of our "alliance" and that shits me off.
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