United States of Entropy - Page 29 - U2 Feedback

Go Back   U2 Feedback > Lypton Village > Free Your Mind > Free Your Mind Archive
Click Here to Login
 
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 10-03-2013, 03:07 PM   #421
Rock n' Roll Doggie
 
BEAL's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: San Diego
Posts: 3,574
Local Time: 07:31 PM
Shots fired on capital hill? Not surprising if true. People are angry. Especially start throwing out congress still gets paid during shutdown and you can see how tempers would flare
__________________

__________________
BEAL is online now  
Old 10-03-2013, 03:12 PM   #422
Blue Crack Addict
 
PhilsFan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Standing on the shore, facing east.
Posts: 18,880
Local Time: 02:31 PM
Preliminary reports are that a woman tried to drive through baricades around the White House and started a car chase that ended near the Capitol. She then apparently got out and fired shots. One police car sustained damage in the chase which may have been where the police officer sustained injuries.
__________________

__________________
PhilsFan is online now  
Old 10-03-2013, 03:13 PM   #423
Rock n' Roll Doggie
Band-aid
 
AEON's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: California
Posts: 4,052
Local Time: 12:31 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by anitram View Post
I think the Democrats are pathetic. I'm absolutely serious. Nowhere else in the world (yes I know the rest of us don't matter as we're not as free as ya'all) would they be considered a liberal party. I have very little idea of what they stand for and their leadership has been poor on a number of fronts over the last decade or so.
Agreed.

Quote:
Originally Posted by anitram View Post
But the Tea Party behaviour is unprecedented
What exactly do you mean by "behaviour" here? The protests? The lobbying? What is it they are doing different (that's a genuine question because I may be missing something). Also - is there anyone in office that is officially from the Tea Party? As far as I know, comparing the Democratic Party to the Tea Party is like comparing the Republican Party to Code Pink - but that is perhaps another false equivalence...

Quote:
Originally Posted by anitram View Post
and it is plain dishonest to suggest that there is the same sort of faction on the other side. It is NOT TRUE. Period, end of story.
This is why I need some clarification on the "behaviour" comment, because all special interest groups try to influence elected officials. How is the Tea Party different from that aspect? Are they doing anything illegal?

Quote:
Originally Posted by anitram View Post
Your chart isn't helpful at all because there is no context there. Yes, we can establish that previous shutdowns happened and that they were driven by both Parties.
That's all I was trying to demonstrate. There is at least a little context in the right column.


Quote:
Originally Posted by anitram View Post
That's like looking at WW2 and stating that all parties involved had started warfare in the past. So?
That's a false equivalence to my alleged false equivalence - because it was indeed suggested that the Democrats do not employ such tactics (which would mean in your WWII chart example - there would be a zero in the "wars started" column.)
__________________
AEON is offline  
Old 10-03-2013, 03:16 PM   #424
Rock n' Roll Doggie
Band-aid
 
AEON's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: California
Posts: 4,052
Local Time: 12:31 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilsFan View Post
This isn't just dodging the question, this is a strawman.
What IS the question?
__________________
AEON is offline  
Old 10-03-2013, 03:18 PM   #425
Blue Crack Addict
 
PhilsFan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Standing on the shore, facing east.
Posts: 18,880
Local Time: 02:31 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by AEON View Post

What IS the question?
She said:

Quote:
Please find me 50 House members on the Democratic side that are akin to the Tea Party, both in terms of loudness, vulgarity, obstructionism and IMPACT. Really, go ahead.
__________________
PhilsFan is online now  
Old 10-03-2013, 03:31 PM   #426
Rock n' Roll Doggie
Band-aid
 
AEON's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: California
Posts: 4,052
Local Time: 12:31 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilsFan View Post
She said:
I didn't think that was seriously a question...because of the 49 names listed in the Tea Party Caucus, I've only seen a few in the news - and they weren't doing anything extreme...
__________________
AEON is offline  
Old 10-03-2013, 03:32 PM   #427
Rock n' Roll Doggie
Band-aid
 
AEON's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: California
Posts: 4,052
Local Time: 12:31 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilsFan View Post
Preliminary reports are that a woman tried to drive through baricades around the White House and started a car chase that ended near the Capitol. She then apparently got out and fired shots. One police car sustained damage in the chase which may have been where the police officer sustained injuries.
The League of Shadows make their play...
__________________
AEON is offline  
Old 10-03-2013, 03:33 PM   #428
Blue Crack Addict
 
PhilsFan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Standing on the shore, facing east.
Posts: 18,880
Local Time: 02:31 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilsFan View Post
Preliminary reports are that a woman tried to drive through baricades around the White House and started a car chase that ended near the Capitol. She then apparently got out and fired shots. One police car sustained damage in the chase which may have been where the police officer sustained injuries.
Doesn't sound like anyone but the police fired shots now, but everything is still, as I said preliminary.
__________________
PhilsFan is online now  
Old 10-03-2013, 03:34 PM   #429
Blue Crack Addict
 
PhilsFan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Standing on the shore, facing east.
Posts: 18,880
Local Time: 02:31 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by AEON View Post

I didn't think that was seriously a question...because of the 49 names listed in the Tea Party Caucus, I've only seen a few in the news - and they weren't doing anything extreme...
Define extreme. I consider holding the government for ransom unless Obamacare is defunded pretty extreme.
__________________
PhilsFan is online now  
Old 10-03-2013, 03:47 PM   #430
Rock n' Roll Doggie
Band-aid
 
AEON's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: California
Posts: 4,052
Local Time: 12:31 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilsFan View Post
Define extreme. I consider holding the government ransom unless Obamacare is defunded pretty extreme.
I consider violence extreme.

Everything they've done so far (from what I've seen) is neither illegal nor unprecedented. They are using the "rules of the system" to increase their influence - as people have done before, and will do again.

Of course - I would agree the "rules of the system" must change...the fact that this is even possible seems totally ludicrous. There are too many lives at stake (missed paychecks and national security) to allow the politicians to use this particular tactic. Until then - we should expect more of this.

Again, we are nothing more than game pieces to these guys. And both sides are playing the game. The Democrats could choose to fund NHI, NASA, National Parks...and if they were only concerned about the "lives of the people" then they wouldn't hesitate to fund these and other agencies. But they are playing the "all or nothing" card.
__________________
AEON is offline  
Old 10-03-2013, 03:51 PM   #431
Rock n' Roll Doggie
Band-aid
 
AEON's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: California
Posts: 4,052
Local Time: 12:31 PM
Harry Reid yesterday...

Harry Reid: 'Why Would We Want To' Help One Kid With Cancer? - YouTube
__________________
AEON is offline  
Old 10-03-2013, 03:54 PM   #432
Blue Crack Addict
 
anitram's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: NY
Posts: 16,289
Local Time: 02:31 PM
I don't really have time to go through every obstructionist or otherwise ridiculous action they've taken and frankly I'm a bit surprised you're asking as it should be fairly obvious to anyone paying attention since 2010.

But off the top of my head:
- Obama and birtherism - driven entirely by the Tea Party and exhibiting some of the most vulgar behaviour
- Obama's nominees - unprecedented obstructionism, there is something call the Index of Obstruction and Delay which is computed and maintained by a professor at UMass who found that in the last Congress, the Index was 0.92524, or in his words“That’s the highest that’s ever been recorded,” he tells me. “In this last Congress it approached total obstruction or delay.” (During Bush's era it was 0.6176)
- Repeated attempts to repeal the ACA - I lost count at 41, yes, forty-one which were all a giant waste of time but the Tea Party members of the House would rather waste time than legislate or concentrate on the economy
- government shut down and debt ceiling shenanigans in which the Democrats basically folded until now when again the Tea Party republicans are insisting on inappropriately attaching a defund of an existing law to a budgetary measure. And by the way, have you not been paying attention to what the moderate GOP has been saying about these individuals? It wasn't a Democrat who called them "lemmings in suicide vests" as an FYI.

This is to say nothing of their ridiculous behaviour on the state level, where they seem content to spend most of their waking hours legislating activity in women's vaginas.
__________________
anitram is online now  
Old 10-03-2013, 03:58 PM   #433
Refugee
 
U2NativeSon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: ROCKville
Posts: 1,246
Local Time: 07:31 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilsFan View Post
Define extreme.


social liberals... progressives


__________________
U2NativeSon is offline  
Old 10-03-2013, 04:21 PM   #434
Rock n' Roll Doggie
Band-aid
 
AEON's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: California
Posts: 4,052
Local Time: 12:31 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by anitram View Post
- Obama and birtherism - driven entirely by the Tea Party and exhibiting some of the most vulgar behaviour
The birth certificate issue was brought up during the campaign of 2008, the Tea Party was founded in 2009.

Quote:
Originally Posted by anitram View Post
- Obama's nominees - unprecedented obstructionism, there is something call the Index of Obstruction and Delay which is computed and maintained by a professor at UMass who found that in the last Congress, the Index was 0.92524, or in his words“That’s the highest that’s ever been recorded,” he tells me. “In this last Congress it approached total obstruction or delay.” (During Bush's era it was 0.6176)
Well, the opposite argument could be made that this is the least compromising president.

Quote:
Originally Posted by anitram View Post
- Repeated attempts to repeal the ACA - I lost count at 41, yes, forty-one which were all a giant waste of time but the Tea Party members of the House would rather waste time than legislate or concentrate on the economy
I don't get this either...

Quote:
Originally Posted by anitram View Post
- government shut down and debt ceiling shenanigans in which the Democrats basically folded until now when again the Tea Party republicans are insisting on inappropriately attaching a defund of an existing law to a budgetary measure. And by the way, have you not been paying attention to what the moderate GOP has been saying about these individuals? It wasn't a Democrat who called them "lemmings in suicide vests" as an FYI.
This is a valid point. However, it is a "right" congress has.

Quote:
Originally Posted by anitram View Post
This is to say nothing of their ridiculous behaviour on the state level, where they seem content to spend most of their waking hours legislating activity in women's vaginas.
How is this the Tea Party. Abortion is not a part of their platform. Are you simply attributing "all things conservative" to the Tea Party?

Quote:
from Wikipedia

The Tea Party has generally sought to avoid placing too much emphasis on traditional conservative social issues. National Tea Party organizations, such as the Tea Party Patriots and FreedomWorks, have expressed concern that engaging in social issues would be divisive. Instead, they have sought to have activists focus their efforts away from social issues and focus on economic and limited government issues.
__________________
AEON is offline  
Old 10-03-2013, 04:36 PM   #435
Rock n' Roll Doggie
VIP PASS
 
Pearl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: NYC
Posts: 5,653
Local Time: 03:31 PM
Quote:
“When you have a small segment who dictate to the rest of the party, the result is what we have seen in the last two days. People need to stand up and not be afraid of the Tea Party.”

“We are finding a marvelous way to grab defeat from the jaws of victory,” said Fred Zeidman, a Houston-based businessman who was a major donor to both of George W. Bush’s presidential campaigns. “The way we are handling this has been a mistake from the beginning. I think we misread where the country was.”
GOP Donors Revolt Against Republican-Led Government Shutdown - The Daily Beast
__________________

__________________
Pearl is offline  
 

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 02:31 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Design, images and all things inclusive copyright © Interference.com