Unitarian Church shooting suspect 'hated gays, liberals'

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Well when you have large portions of society that constantly demonize gays and liberals, then why are we surprised that some people buy into it and react in extreme ways?
 
:mad::scream::mad:

damn people like that!

++Strength++ to all suffrering from this Atroccity!!!

I may really hate what the neocons have done to this country, but SHIT it dosen't mean I'm going to go around shooting them!!

And i was very upset about this even BEFORE i found out what the gunman said, and what kind of church it was.
 
The fella liked to read:

Adkisson told Still that since "he could not get to the leaders of the liberal movement that he would then target those that had voted them in to office."

Adkisson told officers he left the house unlocked for them because "he expected to be killed during the assault."

Inside the house, officers found "Liberalism is a Mental Health Disorder" by radio talk show host Michael Savage, "Let Freedom Ring" by talk show host Sean Hannity, and "The O'Reilly Factor," by television talk show host Bill O'Reilly.
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Link.
 
Did I say anything like that? You like to imagine what people are thinking.

I think this man was probably mentally ill, or at the very least chronically clinically depressed (and untreated). The books he read don't inspire people to "go out and kill" but I think they prey on the lowest common denominator in a lot of ways, and he probably relied on them to justify his feelings of being oppressed by the liberal "elites."
 
anitram said:
I think this man was probably mentally ill, or at the very least chronically clinically depressed (and untreated).
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No doubt he was.

anitram said:
The books he read don't inspire people to "go out and kill" but I think they prey on the lowest common denominator in a lot of ways, and he probably relied on them to justify his feelings of being oppressed by the liberal "elites."
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I think even that is a stretch. As someone who has read some of the books mentioned, they focus mainly on what is good about America. Any attacks on the left are well thought out, and in the case of Hannity's book, mostly criticisms of the Clinton administration. I think bringing up what books assassins read when it's something as minuscule as Bill O'Reilly is a bad idea. I'm sure searching the homes of Gerald Ford's assassins and President Bush's assassins one would find far worse stuff than "Let Freedom Ring."
 
2861U2 said:
As someone who has read some of the books mentioned, they focus mainly on what is good about America.
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That may be your opinion. These people's opinions on gays do absolutely NOTHING to show me what's good about America, unless you think that bigotry is a characteristic one should be proud of.

I've also read excerpts of most of these and found them to be intolerant, and borderline hateful. My guess is that these guys (Savage, O'Reilly, Coulter, et al) are writing absurdities because they generate good business. But that was my point about the lowest common denominator - whereas a lot of people would read their crap and roll their eyes, there are also people who take what they say to heart or who think "see, I'm not the only one who thinks them gays are ruining the society!!" Feeding into people's fears and xenophobia should not be lauded.

For the record, I don't buy "leftist" books like Franken's or whoever's either, nor do I think they are productive or informative.
 
2861U2 said:
Come on, I pray you're smarter than this. You're blaming the books he read? I own and have read two of those books, and they don't make me want to go out and kill people.
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But those kind of books can contribute to an environment of hate against liberals where liberals are painted as subversive, mentally ill, anti-American, or whatever. I would draw a parallel with hardline Protestant preachers in Northern Ireland in the 1960's and early 1970's who preached that Catholics were 'subhuman', 'breeding like rabbits', that Catholics 'took their orders directly from the Pope who is the anti-Christ'. None of these preachers actually said 'It's ok to go out and kill Catholics' (they were too smart for that, but they knew what they were doing).

These preachers didn't PERSONALLY pull any triggers, or plant any bombs, but, yes, they bear part of the responsibility for terrorist activity during the Troubles.

Now the terrorists that may have been inspired by these preachers were largely psychopathic anyway, as this guy may well be also, and I am not implying that Savage, O'Reilly, et al, are complicit in murder. That would be an overly simplistic take on things, but, yes, they are partially to blame for creating that climate in the US which hopefully is now ended, where liberalism is a swear term, where questioning the President could brand you a traitor, or as Anitram put it:-

Anitram said:
Well when you have large portions of society that constantly demonize gays and liberals, then why are we surprised that some people buy into it and react in extreme ways?
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or, at the very least, they are responsible in my opinion for cheapening the political discourse.
 
so how would we feel if this guy had shot up a black church or a latino church, and then we found racist literature after the fact?
 
Excellent point Irvine. In a country that prides itself on "liberty and justice for all." These words don't ring true for all of it's citizens. The "right wing" media would have been all over this.
 
financeguy said:
But those kind of books can contribute to an environment of hate against liberals where liberals are painted as subversive, mentally ill, anti-American, or whatever.
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Just like Jonah Goldberg's Liberal Fascism: The Secret History of the American Left, from Mussolini to the Politics of Meaning. If Allan Bloom's book represented the starting salvo and "highest point" of the "culture wars," then this deceptive, intellectually dishonest garbage represents how low the discourse has sunk.
 
Irvine511 said:
so how would we feel if this guy had shot up a black church or a latino church, and then we found racist literature after the fact?
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There's quite a difference between true racist literature and a Sean Hannity book, Irvine. By the way, O'Reilly's book and Hannity's book don't even mention gay marriage. People like Hannity or whoever else can discuss their opposition to gay marriage, but never in a million years would they or I EVER wish violence on a gay person or for all homosexuals to be killed. Now unfortunately, this guy did. But that is not what a vast majority of conservatives believe (the world has no use for the small portion of people who DO). That is what a racist believes.

Please, for all our sakes, tell me you're not equating racism with opposition to gay marriage.
 
2861U2 said:
Please, for all our sakes, tell me you're not equating racism with opposition to gay marriage.
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I'm not Irvine and frankly racism and anti-homosexual bigotry are one and the same in my book.
 
2861U2 said:
There's quite a difference between true racist literature and a Sean Hannity book, Irvine. By the way, O'Reilly's book and Hannity's book don't even mention gay marriage. People like Hannity or whoever else can discuss their opposition to gay marriage, but never in a million years would they or I EVER wish violence on a gay person or for all homosexuals to be killed. Now unfortunately, this guy did. But that is not what a vast majority of conservatives believe (the world has no use for the small portion of people who DO). That is what a racist believes.

Please, for all our sakes, tell me you're not equating racism with opposition to gay marriage.
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I'm curious why it's off-base to discuss this nut's reading material while the right have blamed rappers and Marilyn Manson for teen suicide, gang violence, and school shootings for years.

And how is opposing same-sex marriage any different than opposing interracial (or interfaith for that matter) marriage? Not to induce another same-sex marriage argument but I'm curious.
 
How to tell people they sound racist

watch
 
2861U2 said:
There's quite a difference between true racist literature and a Sean Hannity book, Irvine. By the way, O'Reilly's book and Hannity's book don't even mention gay marriage.
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but, seriously, look at some of their titles:

Godless: The Church of Liberalism
Slander: Liberal Lies About the American Right
The Enemy Within: Saving America from the Liberal Assault on Our Schools, Faith, and Military
Liberalism is a Mental Disorder
Treason
Culture Warrior
Let Freedom Ring: Winning the War of Liberty Over Liberalism
Deliver us from Evil: Defeating Terrorism, Despotism, and Liberalism

i mean, honestly, who's equating being liberal with being a terrorist or a despot?





Please, for all our sakes, tell me you're not equating racism with opposition to gay marriage.
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yes, i am. it's pretty much the same thing. judging people on form, not content.
 
You know, as one of those hated gay liberals, I can't help but reply to this. But I just posted something on my politics blog about this guy...and it's pandering, and it's manipulative, and it's all the things that the Fox News Conservatives do...but I'll give you a hint. It's called: Why Sean Hannity and Other Conservatives Are Dangerous for Americans.

I may be exaggerating, but then it's exactly what the Neo-cons have been doing about Liberals. So I'm a pea in the other pot.

Whatever. I hope that guy goes to prison forever. And I really do believe Neo-Cons such as this guy and his Fox Cronies pose a threat to gays, Liberals, and people of color in the U.S.

One of the things I have really missed is the Free Your Mind forum.
 
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