Unconditional love

[BonosSaint]

Is there such a thing in this world? (OK, I might give a pass to some parents having unconditional love for their children)

Unconditional--no limits, no exceptions. This other person can do anything and you will still love them, including not love you back.

Is this something to which we can aspire? Is this something to which we should aspire? Or is the best we can achieve almost unconditional?

Are there people you love unconditionally? Are there many of them?

 

[BVS]

Does it exist? Yes.

Have I seen it? Yes

Is it easy? Heeellllllllllllll Noooooooooo!!!!!!!!!!

 

[VertigoGal]

does it exist? possibly- but only from a parent to their child (id imagine, since i dont have kids!)

i dont think i love anyone unconditionally. although there are plenty of people who i forgive over and over every f**kin time even when they dont deserve it. i dont know if that counts as "unconditional love" though. just me being a pushover i might love my dad unconditionally, maybe, but thats about it.

 

[Liesje]

I think it's most common in parent-child relationships. Also, this is dumb, but I'm pretty sure I love my cat unconditionally. He's just an animal who cares only about food, treats, and having his chin scratched so I'm pretty sure he doesn't actually love me back. He likes to run away and sometimes he's quite mean and naughty, but I still love him!

 

[nbcrusader]

The parent child relationship is a great example - especially with young children.

It exists, it is possible, but it goes against our sinful nature.

 

[verte76]

I love my parents unconditionally. Sure, we have disagreements and disputes, but that's normal for any relationship. If we never had disagreements, we'd all be apathetic about the relationship and just wouldn't give a damn about the important things in life. We all do give a damn, thus the disagreements.

 

[VertigoGal]

I think it's most common in parent-child relationships. Also, this is dumb, but I'm pretty sure I love my cat unconditionally. He's just an animal who cares only about food, treats, and having his chin scratched so I'm pretty sure he doesn't actually love me back. He likes to run away and sometimes he's quite mean and naughty, but I still love him!

hmm, now that i think about it, i may love my dog unconditionally. even when he does disgusting things like eat cute little bunnies, i still love him.

 

[echo0001]

Yeah, pet love. I love my cat. Sheds, barfs, filthy stinky cat box, claws, brain-the-size-of-a-walnut, but I love the little monster anyway.

But it's easier with animals; the rarely beat you up, steal your money, wreck your car, gossip about you behind your back, or steal your boyfriend. And even if they kill someone, it's usually someone with four legs and buck teeth, so nobody cares.

Brothers and sisters: they have stolen from me, called me names, gossiped about me behind my back, at times we've mutually treated each other like crap but...

I love them. If anything happened to any of them, I would be devastated, even if it was that vicious ho I'm not talking to this year.

But outside of family, I don't know if unconditional love can exist.

 

[80sU2isBest]

As Christ hung dying on the cross, he said of those who put him there, "Father, forgive them, for they know not what they do."

That's pretty unconditional.

 

[Sevikins]

Can it exist though? I mean, parents should always love their children, or else they wouldn't think to have them... but then again, accidents can happen which then in any case you should love them because you helped create them.

But can it exist though? If that child, even if you were careful and planned to have this child, and rear it giving it everything in the world, making sure that they have a great life-- and when they grow up, just go out, drink and just sleep around. Should you then love them? Even if they spit and curse at you calling you every name in the book (or blaming you for everything that went wrong in their lives)?

I mean I don't have children, I'm leaning towards having one someday (in quite a while as I'm only going to turn 20 ) but I've seen that senario in which the mother just gets abused by her good for nothing daughter and still loves her (by giving her food and letting her stay the night at the house whenever she decides to drop in to leech).

So I don't know, when I look at her senario, I can't help but be extremely angry. Why should the mother still love this when she doesn't really have to? I mean, when she turned 18 and ran out that door promising never to return, if I was the mother, I'd wipe my hands of her. She's caused enough trouble already... no need to die by heart attack because of worrying about her.

But then again, that's what unconditional love is all about right? To love even though the other abuse you either mentally, verbally, or even physically. IMO, it just isn't right. I don't want to love someone who won't love me back. It's just my opinion though.

I hope I wasn't too long, and I hope I made a bit of sense.

 

[WinnieThePoo]

Star Wars , Red Sox , and Mars Volta

 

[Angela Harlem]

I absolutely believe in unconditional love. The parent-child examples are the most common, but at risk of sounding like a new age hippy, I do think those who have any kind of love for animals are included as well.

I have a complicated start on a theory based on studies done on violent offenders in prisons and how many of them start out with cruelty to animals. In a nutshell, I think some people are just plain incapable of unconditional love, and those types of people certainly are. To love an animal or child needs for love to be unconditional. Those who go one step beyond just not being able to love, and go so far as to be capable of cruelty and harm, are exceptions and I think in their emotional make-up they lack the ability to love, as love on it's own is a beautiful and gentle thing. So I think there are those who just cannot. I think they are faulty human beings.
I might be offending some here, but then I think there's the second group who for whatever reason do not like animals and children, but they in no way, I feel, are necessarily prone to going to the next level of intentionally harming. There's a big difference. I think you can be indifferent to animals and kids, but not be a cruel person. And certainly still be capable of love. But I do question how some cannot unlock that part of them which requires us to love and cherish anything which is entirely taking only of what we can give them in terms of love. Cats are a great example. I dont think those selfish little furballs would know how to love unless it was sitting in their bowls or in the form of a warm soft bed. To love a cat takes nothing but giving from the owner. I am a staff member to 2 of the critters, and they redefine selfishness lol. Dogs are the complete opposite and need to be your slave, but they require unconditional love in return because they have one track minds of their own in different ways.
Then there's the 3rd lot in my theory who seem to have this need to love. They might even prefer animals or children to adults, as undonditional love can sometimes be a lot more straightforward. They need to give and give. I think/hope most fall into this category, as believing that we are capable of love makes life so much more worthwhile.

 

[BonosSaint]

Enjoyed your post, Angela. As a cat owner with a particularly non warm and fuzzy disposition (unless it is cold out and she wants body heat), I can relate.

I think it is natural for many people to feel unconditional love for people and creatures who depend on us to survive. I think the unconditional part gets sticky when it is autonomous, independent people. I think you can love unconditionally even then, but I think you can only love a handful of autonomous people that way.

That is the question I am interested in. When it does not come completely naturally, do we do it?

 

[beegee]

The parent child relationship is a great example - especially with young children.

and i would say especially with pre-teens and teenagers

 

[BVS]

and i would say especially with pre-teens and teenagers

 

[echo0001]

Can it exist though? I mean, parents should always love their children, or else they wouldn't think to have them... but then again, accidents can happen which then in any case you should love them because you helped create them.

But can it exist though? If that child, even if you were careful and planned to have this child, and rear it giving it everything in the world, making sure that they have a great life-- and when they grow up, just go out, drink and just sleep around. Should you then love them? Even if they spit and curse at you calling you every name in the book (or blaming you for everything that went wrong in their lives)?

I mean I don't have children, I'm leaning towards having one someday (in quite a while as I'm only going to turn 20 ) but I've seen that senario in which the mother just gets abused by her good for nothing daughter and still loves her (by giving her food and letting her stay the night at the house whenever she decides to drop in to leech).

So I don't know, when I look at her senario, I can't help but be extremely angry. Why should the mother still love this when she doesn't really have to? I mean, when she turned 18 and ran out that door promising never to return, if I was the mother, I'd wipe my hands of her. She's caused enough trouble already... no need to die by heart attack because of worrying about her.

But then again, that's what unconditional love is all about right? To love even though the other abuse you either mentally, verbally, or even physically. IMO, it just isn't right. I don't want to love someone who won't love me back. It's just my opinion though.

I hope I wasn't too long, and I hope I made a bit of sense.

There will be people who don't like this. You may not like this very much. But a daughter who treats who mother like that has probably developed that attitude because mom has let her get away with it.

By the way, quietly accepting abuse is not proof of unconditional love. It can be a sign of intimidation, fear, or lack of coping skills (not knowing how to fix the problem).

A more strong willed or knowledgable parent, or one who seeks help or counselling, may be able to remedy such a situation.

But you do not have to accept abuse to prove your love to someone. Trust me. You don't.

Why should a mother still love a child who treats her so badly? Because that's human nature. And it's in us, and as strong as it is, to keep us from abandonning a child who has just flushed his shoe down the toilet, neccessitating $900 worth of home repairs. It's as strong as it is to try and make sure that our parents stick by us, and care for us long enough for us to grow up. And it is not something that can be switched off just because the kid has turned eighteen.

On the topic of uncondtional love between parent and child, the mothers of serial killers frequently admit that they still love their murderous children. The presence of love does not mean that you love that person's every action.

 

[Saracene]

I love my Mum more than anyone else in the world, but I don't know if I can call it "unconditional" when it's never really been tested and I feel 100% secure in her unconditional love for me.

 

[BonosSaint]

Excellent point. We don't know until it has been tested.

 

[echo0001]

What's the test, though? How do you test unconditional love?

And what if you test it, and it turns out to be less than unconditional?

 

[VertigoGal]

What if it's been tested and you still love the person? Does that mean it's unconditional, or that you just haven't reached "breaking point"? How can you ever know?

 

[BonosSaint]

What's the test, though? How do you test unconditional love?

And what if you test it, and it turns out to be less than unconditional?

Don't mean you deliberately test it? I mean if the relationship is betrayed or the other person stops loving you or exhibits traits not desireable to you, does the unconditional love remain?

And what if it turns out to be less than unconditional, then it is less than unconditional, that's all. Most of our relationships are less than unconditional and function well enough.

VertigoGal, you're right. I guess you can never know. But surmise.

 

[echo0001]

Don't mean you deliberately test it? I mean if the relationship is betrayed or the other person stops loving you or exhibits traits not desireable to you, does the unconditional love remain?

And what if it turns out to be less than unconditional, then it is less than unconditional, that's all. Most of our relationships are less than unconditional and function well enough.

VertigoGal, you're right. I guess you can never know. But surmise.

I think you'd have to be pretty stupid to deliberately attempt to test what is generally expected to be unconditional love, e.g., parental love.

I guess you're previous comment made me think, would anybody deliberately test their parents' love?

 

[BonosSaint]

echo, I was just responding to a post where Saracene was talking about her love for her mother and I think implied it has been a positive relationship, so she does not know whether it can be called unconditional because nothing has happened to challenge it. I thought that was an interesting observation.

 

[Sevikins]

There will be people who don't like this. You may not like this very much. But a daughter who treats who mother like that has probably developed that attitude because mom has let her get away with it.

I agree, but then her mother only lets her get away with it is because she always runs off to the father, who then yells and beats the mother for yelling at the daughter. But even then, she's seen how her daughter treats her, should she still try to love her? I mean, a person can only love so much before getting fed up from being treated like dirt.

By the way, quietly accepting abuse is not proof of unconditional love. It can be a sign of intimidation, fear, or lack of coping skills (not knowing how to fix the problem).

Totally agreed... I just wished that the mother wouldn't be like that. I wouldn't want to see my mother like that.

Why should a mother still love a child who treats her so badly? Because that's human nature. And it's in us, and as strong as it is, to keep us from abandonning a child who has just flushed his shoe down the toilet, neccessitating $900 worth of home repairs. It's as strong as it is to try and make sure that our parents stick by us, and care for us long enough for us to grow up. And it is not something that can be switched off just because the kid has turned eighteen.

True, but it's not fair is it? And of course, when they're little and they do what they do (ie: throw shoes into the toilet) of course, you can't really blame them for doing what they do, it's human nature and they were just curious and as much as we hate it, you just have to then teach them to not do that again. But when you're at a certain age, aren't you expected to know certain things and have certain guidelines to live your life? Maybe it's how I was raised up. It just breaks my heart to see these things at times.

I don't know, maybe it's just me but there has to be a point in where a parents just says "enough is enough." To tell the truth, I wouldn't want to be the parent that frequently has to bail out their kids from jail, or try to straighten them out and to see those efforts fail because the kids don't want to keep on the straight and narrow. Maybe that makes me hateful and unable to love, or maybe I just haven't really explained myself clearly. I have a problem with that.

 

[mystery girl]

This is such an interesting topic. I think whether you think 'unconditional love" exists or not depends on how you define unconditional love.

Personally, there are people in my life who I will love no matter what they do. But this doesn't mean that I will like/accept everything they do. It doesn't mean that I will put up with being treated badly by them. And it doesn't mean I will do everything they want me to do.

If someone I loved committed a crime that I find unforgiveable, I will probably still love that person. Because I'll never forget the good things they've done, the good times we've had etc.

Is this unconditional love? I find it hard to say! I guess it is in a sense - to me, anyway.

I think it's probably the same way for parents who have kids that don't treat them as they should. The mother whose daughter treats her badly might remember the way the daughter, when she was 5, made her a cup of tea when she wasn't feeling well, or something like that. And that kind of thing would probably make her love the kid even if she is being a brat.

 

[nbcrusader]

It is not hard to define, it is hard to do well

 

[echo0001]

Yeah Sevikins, there's a place where some people say 'Enough'.

They may be done enduring the behavior but I don't think they have gone from loving to hating their children. It's just not that easy to turn off your feelings for your family.

And you're right, it doesn't seem fair. All the more reason to call Nature a Mother....