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Old 01-25-2017, 12:25 AM   #61
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I usually try to avoid comparing real life political figures to 1984, Hitler, et cetera, because it's typically rather exaggerated (though I have a soft spot for Voldemort comparisons, of course). But the sort of lax attitude towards the truth that the Trump Administration has - the blatant lying and the euphemistic language like "alternative facts" - carries a distinctively 1984ish tone in a way I've never certainly experienced before in the US.


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Hm, yeah, I'll pay that. It's just something I've seen so often that I felt it lost all meaning - even if, finally, there is a legitimate parallel here.

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things really have a nice old-fashioned "may 1914" feel to them right now, don't they? #maga
I can't wait for a band called Donald Trump to emerge in 90 years time.
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Old 01-25-2017, 12:26 AM   #62
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things really have a nice old-fashioned "may 1914" feel to them right now, don't they? #maga

Do they?

I'm not exactly in love with the state of politics in the US or the UK or France right now, but the world also doesn't feel much like a powder keg about to explode into war. The risk of war between major powers is still essentially nil.

Trump is a disaster, and his presidency will harm a great many people, which makes me sick. But the world is still in a great many ways a hell of a lot better than it was a century ago.


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Old 01-25-2017, 12:29 AM   #63
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Hm, yeah, I'll pay that. It's just something I've seen so often that I felt it lost all meaning - even if, finally, there is a legitimate parallel here.

That's fair. But it frankly ties to my belief that Trump isn't just some other Republican whom I would oppose. I wouldn't be very happy ideologically with a Cruz presidency, for instance. But I consider Trump to be an entirely different kind of danger. Not just a difference in degree, but a difference in kind.

The boy may have cried wolf before, but this is a real wolf.


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Old 01-25-2017, 12:34 AM   #64
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Do they?
I'm not exactly in love with the state of politics in the US or the UK or France right now, but the world also doesn't feel much like a powder keg about to explode into war. The risk of war between major powers is still essentially nil.
i agree that the risk of war between major powers is essentially nil, but who said we need a conventional war between major powers to have the kind of destructive, world-altering effect the great war had?

i'm beating a dead horse now with this in this thread, but i'm pretty convinced that another american civil war is on the way in our lifetimes. i think trump's election is the first domino in a chain.

knowing the history of what happened at the start of the last century, and that humanity really likes to destroy an entire generation of itself every 75-100 years or so for the last 500 years makes me awfully pessimistic about what we're in for.
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Old 01-25-2017, 12:35 AM   #65
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I can't wait for a band called Donald Trump to emerge in 90 years time.
Ha .
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Old 01-25-2017, 12:42 AM   #66
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That's fair. But it frankly ties to my belief that Trump isn't just some other Republican whom I would oppose. I wouldn't be very happy ideologically with a Cruz presidency, for instance. But I consider Trump to be an entirely different kind of danger. Not just a difference in degree, but a difference in kind.

The boy may have cried wolf before, but this is a real wolf.


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It's the sheer unpredictability that gets me, and as reluctant as I am to prescribe it to the one individual - Trump's personal volatility is a worry (see recent WaPo/NYmag articles on his behaviour out of the sight around the time of the inauguration) .
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Old 01-25-2017, 12:58 AM   #67
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i agree that the risk of war between major powers is essentially nil, but who said we need a conventional war between major powers to have the kind of destructive, world-altering effect the great war had?

i'm beating a dead horse now with this in this thread, but i'm pretty convinced that another american civil war is on the way in our lifetimes. i think trump's election is the first domino in a chain.

knowing the history of what happened at the start of the last century, and that humanity really likes to destroy an entire generation of itself every 75-100 years or so for the last 500 years makes me awfully pessimistic about what we're in for.

I understand the concern, for sure. Trump is the most concerning development in American politics in a long time, with 2016 perhaps being the most concerning year in Western politics in a long time.

However, I am not convinced that some bad years make for an unalterable trend. I think another reasonable interpretation of recent events is that we're going through a time of upheaval and tension akin to 1968 - difficult, for sure, but not catastrophic in the end.

Some lessons may have to be learned by elites - perhaps both leftish elites (that we should treat middle America as an ignorable backwater at our own peril) and rightish elites (that perhaps it's necessary to take care of a social safety net and government-funded programs for increased opportunity to ensure social cohesion). And those may be learned in a difficult way.

And we are probably starting to realign in a real way, with Democrats grabbing up more and more urban elites (even in the south) along with non-whites of all walks of life, and Republicans basically grabbing up all of the rest of the whites. Sanders Democrats will remain somewhat awkwardly-placed, but I think things have a good chance of basically moving in this direction.

But I still don't think there's nearly enough evidence to panic about something like civil war yet. We are a divided country, but I think there are lessons learned from experiences like this. There will always be blips on the road forward, and they can be rough, but I don't think we are near true disaster yet.

Perhaps more cynically, I also don't see much of an economic incentive for something like a civil war, which was clearly not the case for the Confederate States of America.


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Old 01-25-2017, 03:25 AM   #68
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Smaller government:

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The bill, called the REINS Act, requires that any future major regulation adopted by an Executive Agency -- say a new toxic chemical standard required by the recently enacted Chemical Safety Act, or a new consumer protection rule about some innovative but untested kind of food additive -- must be approved by a specific resolution in each House of Congress within 70 days to take effect.

To give a sense of the scale of this road-block, in 2015 there were 43 such major federal regulations passed to protect the public; among them were food safety regulations, the Clean Power Plan regulating pollution from electrical generating facilities, net neutrality rules protecting the internet from monopoly, restrictions on predatory lending and energy efficiency standards for appliances.

If the REINS Act had been in effect, it's unlikely that the Tea Party-dominated Republican caucus in the House would have approved of any of these rules. Future standard setting under the entire body of legislation enacted over the past 40 years to protect the public, from the Clean Air Act to the Dodd Frank financial sector reforms, would be frozen.
The Most Dangerous Bill You've Never Heard Of Just Passed The House | The Huffington Post
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Old 01-25-2017, 06:02 AM   #69
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So threats of (seemingly?) martial law, the wall, false allegations of the biggest voter fraud in modern political history.... what else am I missing?

First week.

I don't know how to respond to this anymore. I feel stupid just sitting at my laptop reading all of this crazy shit.
I don't even live in the US, but am having trouble processing all this news... part of me wants to keep up with all the developments, but part of me wants to blackout for a few years...

this article does make a point...

https://medium.com/@chuckingrocks/bl...9b9#.t9kevj4uf
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Old 01-25-2017, 07:27 AM   #70
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He's now threatening to invade Chicago.

Seriously.

I hope he does.

Have you seen the latest numbers on homicides in Chicago? Check out some recent Chicago newspaper. Many criminals if convicted receive very little jail time and are paroled quickly.

President Obama sent federal prosecutors to cities.

What is wrong in trying to curb this killing spree?
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Old 01-25-2017, 07:30 AM   #71
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I think invading the NRA Headquarters would make more headway in stopping the killing spree ravaging the US.
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Old 01-25-2017, 07:50 AM   #72
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I hope he does.

Have you seen the latest numbers on homicides in Chicago? Check out some recent Chicago newspaper. Many criminals if convicted receive very little jail time and are paroled quickly.

President Obama sent federal prosecutors to cities.

What is wrong in trying to curb this killing spree?
So invading cities like dictators do is the solution to the crime problem? Hmm? Very smart! Very smart indeed! You trump supporters are something else I tell you! Nothing like living in a milatery state!
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Old 01-25-2017, 07:52 AM   #73
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I think invading the NRA Headquarters would make more headway in stopping the killing spree ravaging the US.
Yep lets shuts down the NRA they are half the reason the USA has so much gun violence! I agree with this!
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Old 01-25-2017, 07:54 AM   #74
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I hope he does.



Have you seen the latest numbers on homicides in Chicago? Check out some recent Chicago newspaper. Many criminals if convicted receive very little jail time and are paroled quickly.



President Obama sent federal prosecutors to cities.



What is wrong in trying to curb this killing spree?

Chicago is a distraction; it's a dog whistle for you Trumpets. Per capita there are almost 2 dozen US cities that have higher violent crime rates and higher murder rates per capita.

Facts are very important.



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Old 01-25-2017, 07:55 AM   #75
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I hope he does.



Have you seen the latest numbers on homicides in Chicago? Check out some recent Chicago newspaper. Many criminals if convicted receive very little jail time and are paroled quickly.



President Obama sent federal prosecutors to cities.



What is wrong in trying to curb this killing spree?


Yes, I have seen the numbers. It's tragic. It's also lower than it was in the 1980s (and its record from homicides was in 1974). It's also lower than cities like Memphis or Detroit or New Orleans. The only reason that Republicans suddenly care about black people getting murdered is so they can blame it on Obama.

Sending in the National Guard would be counterproductive, at least, and a wonderful pretext to take awa civil liberties, while at the same time ignoring the actual root causes of Chicago violence: crushing poverty and easy access to firearms.

Guns guns guns.

He also tweeted this in response to a criticism from Ralph Emmanuel about the size of his inauguration, which should worry you about how thin Trump's skin is, and now the resources he commands to enact whatever petty vengeance he's going to seek Week to week.
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