Trayvon Martin's murderer George Zimmerman is still a free man - Page 55 - U2 Feedback

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Old 07-17-2013, 01:28 AM   #811
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I don't think he murdered him regardless, I just don't know if he was totally justified in pulling that gun - EVEN IF - he thought he was going to be killed. Does Trayvon Martin 'freely' pay for his life because Zimmerman can't fight back with his fists?
I don't think you really believe this. Are you implying that Zimmerman, assuming he thought he might die, should just give up knowing he had a gun and could possibly save his life? Would the thought ever occur to you in that situation "well, this guy is physically stronger than me... I have a gun... but I'll just let him beat me to death"?
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Old 07-17-2013, 02:23 AM   #812
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There's also this.

New Trayvon lie: Media, LAPD falsely report “rowdy” protests - Salon.com
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Old 07-17-2013, 02:55 AM   #813
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Why give someone that killed someone the benefit of believing everything they say? How does anyone know Trayvon didn't ask him to leave him alone and then this idiot (everybody agrees) pull out his gun and then the fight happened?? And for goodness sakes Zimmerman was no where beaten that badly at all.

If Zimmerman did not have a gun he probably would have stayed in his car.

How anyone can say Zimmerman did not know he was black is just stupid, he saw his hands. And as for the hood up making him look suspicious? It was raining.
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Old 07-17-2013, 03:01 AM   #814
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I don't think you really believe this. Are you implying that Zimmerman, assuming he thought he might die.
Because someone is paranoid and they have a gun this verdict and bad laws make it easy to kill people. Now the standard is what did the killer believe?
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Old 07-17-2013, 03:17 AM   #815
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Because someone is paranoid and they have a gun this verdict and bad laws make it easy to kill people. Now the standard is what did the killer believe?
Or you could quote my whole post in context with the one I quoted
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Old 07-17-2013, 07:57 AM   #816
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How can you separate the two? The whole reason he was being so "vigilant" was because of the circumstances. Or are you implying he would've followed someone in a hoodie had there not been previous issues in the neighbourhood?
I'm just implying that he probably wouldn't have followed me.


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Following someone you believe to be suspicious is not necessarily "wrong"
So are we promoting that everyone with a gun should start following "suspicious" people?
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Old 07-17-2013, 08:03 AM   #817
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Wouldn't you have first told him to fuck off or at least ask why he was following you?
Not if I saw that he had a gun and he wasn't identifying himself.

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According to GZ, he didn't do any of that and just went immediately to attack mode. I don't think its unreasonable to suggest that in this situation it would have been more appropriate for Trayvon to use words first before fists
Excuse me? When did Zimmerman use his words? Apparently he's a lousy follower, so did he ever ID himself?
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Old 07-17-2013, 08:10 AM   #818
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And now my DOJ is still looking to charge him in a civil right violation so there has to be something there.
Did you hear this from Fox News? There has been no mention from the DOJ about a civil right case yet. The right just wants to stir up something.
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Old 07-17-2013, 08:33 AM   #819
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At the risk of adding more to a discussion about a case that I feel has long ago surpassed any sort of proportionate coverage, I kind of have to agree with deep here in that it's bizarre to me that so much of the discussion is based on the assumption that what GZ says happened that night actually happened that way. All we have is his account and to have that as a starting point is at best deeply flawed.
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Old 07-17-2013, 08:36 AM   #820
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Tweet from Anonymous last night:

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Why isnt the NRA saying the tragedy wouldn’t have happened if Trayvon Martin was armed,& calling on young black men to get themselves guns?
I generally have little time for Anonymous but it's a fair point. After gun incidents we always hear the NRA saying "if only the teachers or janitors or people sleeping at home or walking around the mall had been armed, this wouldn't have happened..." ETA: And yes I know that Trayvon was 17 (just turned?) but it's just an interesting observation about the NRA's priorities.
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Old 07-17-2013, 08:37 AM   #821
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I'm just implying that he probably wouldn't have followed me.
I don't know, man. There's no way for either of us to know, but I'd suspect that if you were walking around with your hood up and were around the right age, he might.


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So are we promoting that everyone with a gun should start following "suspicious" people?
I would never promote carrying around a gun in that way, but following a suspicious person? Maybe
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Old 07-17-2013, 08:39 AM   #822
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Because an autopsy was performed on the deceased whom the police were unable to assess before his death. They had the benefit of speaking with Zimmerman directly after the incident to determine whether he was under the influence of drugs or alcohol. Seems pretty standard to me. No need to make everything suspicious
But I'm speaking about perception. It's not standard procedure to test victims of gun related fatalities for drugs. Perception is reality and the dead was tested, the shooter wasn't(though later came out that he may have been under the influence) so perception is that the cops just took Zimmerman's story for fact and didn't proceed with any cautionary suspicion that his story could have been fabricated in anyway.

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You don't defend yourself by initiating physical contact. This is a joke. There's no proof Zimmerman was brandishing his gun.

I'll bite, since you've mentioned it several times. What exactly is your "training"?
No, we don't know if he brandished his gun or not, this part of the story is completely unknown to us. My scenario was only under the assumption that Martin knew of the gun and felt threatened.

I can outrun a knife on most days. But my odds of outrunning bullets are much less, so you want to draw the person with the gun in, OR go on the offense and bring your body closer in so that you can try and maintain control of the gun or inhibit their control of the gun.

25 years, two forms of martial arts.
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Old 07-17-2013, 08:47 AM   #823
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But I'm speaking about perception. It's not standard procedure to test victims of gun related fatalities for drugs. Perception is reality and the dead was tested, the shooter wasn't(though later came out that he may have been under the influence) so perception is that the cops just took Zimmerman's story for fact and didn't proceed with any cautionary suspicion that his story could have been fabricated in anyway.
But it is standard procedure if the 911 caller repeatedly says the deceased was "on something". Had they, after speaking with Zimmerman for hours, suspected that he was intoxicated, I'm sure they would have tested him too. In fact, and maybe anitram could set me straight, I would think it might be a violation of rights to test someone for drugs or alcohol without reasonable suspicion.

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25 years, two forms of martial arts.
What kind of martial arts? (I'm genuinely interested)
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Old 07-17-2013, 08:49 AM   #824
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I don't know, man. There's no way for either of us to know, but I'd suspect that if you were walking around with your hood up and were around the right age, he might.
I have a friend the same age, same stature, and pretty much the same upbringing. I've never been followed in my life outside of childhood games, but he still to this day has stories of being followed around in a store or certain neighborhoods. But you're right we really don't know about that particular night, maybe we all look the same in a hoodie, but if there's light enough to tell age than there's enough to tell skin color.


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I would never promote carrying around a gun in that way, but following a suspicious person? Maybe
I don't know, I say you call in and stay put. It makes absolutely no sense to me to follow since you don't know what they are carrying or capable of...
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Old 07-17-2013, 08:55 AM   #825
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I don't know, I say you call in and stay put. It makes absolutely no sense to me to follow since you don't know what they are carrying or capable of...
This is reasonable too. I'm just saying it's not all that outlandish to follow them. A little dumb though, you're right
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