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Old 03-29-2012, 12:34 AM   #166
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Washington Post, Mar. 28
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A police detective told the father of Florida teenager Trayvon Martin that his son initiated two confrontations with the neighborhood watch volunteer who fatally shot him. Tracy Martin, describing the police version of events in a meeting Wednesday with Washington Post reporters and editors, said he did not believe the official account, which was conveyed to him two days after his 17-year-old son was killed Feb. 26. The detective’s explanation, as relayed by Martin, largely coincides with recent news reports that George Zimmerman told investigators that he shot Trayvon Martin in self-defense.

According to Tracy Martin, the Sanford, Fla., detective recounted this sequence of events: Trayvon Martin walked up to Zimmerman’s vehicle and asked why he was following him. Zimmerman denied following the youth and rolled up the car window. Minutes after Trayvon walked away, Zimmerman got out of his vehicle. Then came the second encounter, according to Tracy Martin’s recollection of the detective’s account. Trayvon Martin appeared from behind a building in Zimmerman’s gated community, approached him and demanded, “What’s your problem, homie?” When Zimmerman replied that he didn’t have a problem, Martin said, “You do now.” The unarmed teenager hit Zimmerman, knocked him to the ground, pinned him down and told him to “shut the [expletive] up.” During the beating, Zimmerman pulled his gun and fired one shot at close range into Martin’s chest. “You got me,” the teenager said, falling backward.

Tracy Martin and the 17-year-old’s mother, Sybrina Fulton, said Wednesday that they have never accepted this explanation for their son’s death. “That was bull,” Tracy Martin said. “No way. At that point, I knew there was something terribly wrong.” The Sanford Police Department said in a statement Wednesday that it will no longer answer questions from the news media.

On Wednesday night, ABC released a police surveillance video taken the night of the shooting. The video shows Zimmerman, hands cuffed behind his back, arriving at the police station in a cruiser. He is frisked and led down a series of hallways. The video shows no blood or bruises on Zimmerman, and he did not check into the emergency room that night, the network said.

The official account given to Trayvon Martin’s parents conflicts with a version of the incident from his 16-year-old girlfriend, who was on the phone with him in the minutes before the shooting and has described their conversation to interviewers on the condition that she be identified only as DeeDee. According to her account, Trayvon Martin told her that someone was following him in a car. She has said that she heard another voice asking him what he was doing in the area before the phone went dead.

Tracy Martin said police asked him to identify his son from a crime-scene photograph. He said that authorities have yet to provide him with the autopsy report and that he was unable to view any injuries his son may have suffered in the fatal struggle. “We didn’t see the body until it got back to Fort Lauderdale and he was cleaned up and dressed up for the funeral,” Martin said.



Fox News Orlando, Mar. 28
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For the first time since that fateful night on February 26, the father of a neighborhood watch volunteer who shot and killed an unarmed teenager sat down for a television interview. Robert Zimmerman, father of George Zimmerman, said he decided it was time to speak out for his son, against the advice of others. He shared with us what George said happened on the night that 17-year-old Trayvon Martin died.

"It's my understanding that Trayvon Martin got on top of him and just started beating him," the 64-year-old Robert Zimmerman said.

He said he felt his son has been portrayed in the wrong way. He also said he and his family have received death threats and asked that we not show his face on camera.

Because there has been a lot of break-ins in the area, Robert said George thought it suspicious that someone would not be walking on the street or the sidewalk on a rainy night -- that Martin would be walking between the town homes. He said after making those observations, his son decided to call the police. "He called the non-emergency number first, and they asked him where he was, because he was at the rear of the town houses and there was no street sign," said Robert. Even though a dispatcher told George Zimmerman not to follow Martin, his father said his son continued his pursuit to locate an address to give to police. "He lost sight of the individual, he continued to walk down the same sidewalk to the next street, so he could get an address for the police," he said. "He went to the next street, realized where he was and was walking to his vehicle. It's my understanding, at that point, Trayvon Martin walked up to him and asked him, 'Do you have a [expletive] problem?' George said, 'No, I don't have a problem,' and started to reach for his cell phone...at that point, he (Martin) was punching him in the nose, his nose was broken and he was knocked to the concrete."

Robert said Trayvon, "continued to beat George, and at some point, George pulled his pistol and did what he did."

When asked about the screams for help which were heard on a 911 call, Robert replied, "All of our family, everyone who knows George, knows absolutely that is George screaming. There's no doubt in anyone's mind."

As for accounts from Trayvon Martin's girlfriend, who claimed she was on the phone with Martin right before the altercation, he said, "I don't believe that happened. I don't believe she was on the phone with him, and I find it very strange with the publicity involved...that all of a sudden, after three weeks, someone would remember that they were on the phone." Zimmerman said he had faith in the FBI and others investigating the case and that the truth will come out.

Robert Zimmerman, a former magistrate judge [Magistrates aren't "judges." Not sure what they mean by this ~y.] and Vietnam War veteran, said he has never had to deal with anything of this magnitude. "Unimaginable," he said. "Tough was being in Vietnam and other things. This is way beyond anything I can imagine." He believes his son will be cleared of any wrongdoing, but has a message to all the critics out there. "I'm sorry for the hate going around from the attorneys, from everyone involved. They're just making up things not true about George."
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Old 03-29-2012, 12:41 AM   #167
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The cop definitely checked the back of his head. I wonder if he was looking at a cut or bruise or looking for a cut or bruise
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Old 03-29-2012, 07:31 AM   #168
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This story is getting more and more strange. I find it hard to decide who to believe. But for now, I'll go with the victim's side. If Zimmerman walked off without having to see a paramedic, then that makes VERY little sense with the beating story. I also find it hard to believe that a kid his size could beat up a man Zimmerman's size...
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Old 03-29-2012, 07:59 AM   #169
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This story is getting more and more strange. I find it hard to decide who to believe. ... If Zimmerman walked off without having to see a paramedic, then that makes VERY little sense with the beating story.
Yeah, this whole thing gets stranger by the minute. But there are so many things that just are not lining up with Zimmerman's story, plus now I really have to question some of the cops' moves. I don't know about Florida but it's mandatory in many states to get checked out by medical staff when one is in an accident or fight, especially when a death is involved. But even in those states that don't require it they HIGHLY recommend in order to cover asses.
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Old 03-29-2012, 08:34 AM   #170
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If he hasn't been checled by medical staff, then how would they want to prove that he got hit? Just his testimony won't stand in a court of law, as far as I'm aware. You'll need evidence.
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Old 03-29-2012, 08:52 AM   #171
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i'm not posting this video to make some sort of point, other than to wonder how this person got elected in the first place...

Rep. Corrine Brown has a Meltdown - YouTube


this case has become a white vs. black case simply because the media wants it to be that way, because it'll get more ratings. a 5'9" hispanic guy vs. a black teenager doesn't sell advertisements. that's the sick, disgusting society we live in.

as irvine first pointed out... this is more about guns than anything else. if this pig zimmerman didn't have a gun, we wouldn't be having this conversation.
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Old 03-29-2012, 09:00 AM   #172
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At this point, I don't feel any urgent need to take either side, because I honestly don't have the faintest idea what actually happened.
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Old 03-29-2012, 09:05 AM   #173
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as irvine first pointed out... this is more about guns than anything else. if this pig zimmerman didn't have a gun, we wouldn't be having this conversation.
For the most part I think what you say is true, but I have to wonder if it has to do a little with age and appearance too?

In his 911 call there's a portion that is up for debate, does he say "punk" or "coon", to me it sounds like "punk", but I wonder if the person was older and dressed different if that would make a difference?
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Old 03-29-2012, 09:14 AM   #174
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i think it has to do with an unstable individual, who may or may not be racist, who a) shouldn't have a gun, and b) shouldn't be on any sort of neighborhood watch.
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Old 03-29-2012, 09:24 AM   #175
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plus now I really have to question some of the cops' moves.
Yeah, exactly. If Tracy Martin's recollections of what the detective originally told him are correct...how can an initial encounter at Zimmerman's vehicle be reconciled with the 911 tapes and the tie-in story that that was when he left his car? And the alleged dialogue..."What's your problem homie?" "You got me," then Zimmerman's father, in the Fox video I linked to, claiming Trayvon said "You gonna die tonight"...seriously? And what did Zimmerman's father mean, "I don't believe she was on the phone with him"? I thought T-Mobile had confirmed the call?
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Old 03-29-2012, 09:26 AM   #176
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I truly don't get why so many people are up at arms about the specifics of how Zimmerman self-identifies racially, or how the police or whoever else identify him.
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Old 03-29-2012, 09:29 AM   #177
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i think it has to do with an unstable individual, who may or may not be racist, who a) shouldn't have a gun, and b) shouldn't be on any sort of neighborhood watch.
I agree. I was just thinking out loud and applying this to society in general rather than this particular individual. I was thinking more about those that are empathizing with Zimmerman. But maybe that's part of the problem, we're using this story about two individuals to make a comment on society as a whole. Who knows?

At the end of the day, there may only be a few certainties that come out of this story, and unfortunately they may get lost.

1. This law is far too open. Even if at the end of the day Zimmerman's account is real, I think we've shown a scenario that shows how flawed this law is.

2. Citizens shouldn't be acting like cops.

3. No matter your beliefs on gun control, certain people should not have guns.
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Old 03-29-2012, 09:38 AM   #178
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I truly don't get why so many people are up at arms about the specifics of how Zimmerman self-identifies racially, or how the police or whoever else identify him.
What do you mean exactly? Sorry I haven't heard anything about how Zimmerman identifies himself racially.

Do you mean why so many are up in arms about "the media" calling him white? Yeah I think it's crazy too, but my feeling is that some are tired of being lumped in with the "devil white man". At least that's the sense I get from a lot of the conservative pundits that are getting up in arms about this.

But then again, racial definitions are sometimes weird. Don't some definitions lump hispanics and "whites" under caucasion?
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Old 03-29-2012, 09:49 AM   #179
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If he hasn't been checled by medical staff, then how would they want to prove that he got hit? Just his testimony won't stand in a court of law, as far as I'm aware. You'll need evidence.
What court of law? He hasn't been arrested for anything. That's the whole point.
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Old 03-29-2012, 09:59 AM   #180
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What do you mean exactly? Sorry I haven't heard anything about how Zimmerman identifies himself racially.
Well, as I said upthread, I don't know or care whether Zimmerman has a consistent racial self-identification; many people don't. Reports have said that his driver's license and voter reg identify him as Hispanic (I doubt the former since from what I can tell FL licenses never carry that info; FL voter reg forms have a "race/ethnicity" section on which the only "white" tickbox specifies "not of Hispanic origin"); the police report identified him as white; his father who is white called him Hispanic in the context of arguing why he couldn't possibly be racist (as if being Hispanic precludes racist attitudes towards black people?). Lately the media seem to have settled on "white Hispanic," which is a federal category (the census treats Hispanic as an ethnicity or "heritage," not a race, and millions of Americans identify as both "white" and "Hispanic" on census forms). So what? Who appointed all these people ranting about it in the comments section of virtually every article I've read on this case the arbiters of whiteness?
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Yeah I think it's crazy too, but my feeling is that some are tired of being lumped in with the "devil white man".
If someone feels personally implicated based on the specifics of how Zimmerman is classified, that says a lot more about them than it does about him, IMO.
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