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Old 10-11-2004, 02:40 PM   #46
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mR. sHELDBY hAD THIS TO SAY:

[Q]The law does not require us to wait to be attached with the other weapons in Saddam's arsenal before completing the task the Security Council has set for ending the threat Iraq poses to international peace and security. The law does not require this, and our security, and that of other countries in the region, and around the world, does not permit it.

I will close with these final thoughts. There are those at home and abroad who criticize U.S. intent to take action. I remind them that the United States did not pick this conflict. The United States doe not want this fight, Saddam Hussein forced our hand by not complying with his obligations under the 1991 cease fire. He forced our hand by not complying with U.N. resolutions. He forced our hand by building alliances with terrorists.

We do not make this decision lightly, we are very aware of the potential costs of taking action, but we are much more aware of the costs of not taking action. As said by Edmond Burke, ``All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing.''
[/Q]
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Old 10-11-2004, 02:45 PM   #47
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I am asking you the citizens of FYM to take the time to read the Congressional record on this vote.

I have spoken in here many times about HOLDING your representatives accountable. Not just your President. If you are going to hold the President accountable, as I plan to do, then you should also hold the Congress and the Senate to the SAME standards.

This election is not just a Presidential one. No matter where you stand on the issue, there are COngressman and Senators that need examination too.

The point of my thread was not to take sides, I posted quotes from people that I do not agree with in here. The point was to make you think. These people had access to the SAME intelligence as the President. The letter I quoted from DEOMOCRATS who were running for President urging President Bush to take action is very telling.

This is not a Republican or Democratic issue......It is an issue that needs examining. Is it acceptable to you, that we did not EVER have an official Declaration of War?

PEACE....TO EVERYONE.
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Old 10-11-2004, 02:46 PM   #48
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Congressional record Here:

http://thomas.loc.gov/r107/r107.html

Click on October 10

Peace
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Old 10-11-2004, 02:55 PM   #49
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Quote:
Originally posted by Dreadsox


This is not a Republican or Democratic issue......It is an issue

i think it's an honesty and an accountability issue.

db9
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Old 10-11-2004, 03:34 PM   #50
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ACCOUNTABLITY for politicians is the ability to make statements in such a way that you can claim you stood on either side of the issue depending on how things pan out.
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Old 10-11-2004, 04:37 PM   #51
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The analogy I best like for this is that Congress gave the president the keys to the car to drive it responsibly, not drive it off a cliff.

Congress was lied to and deceived when they voted for this. Perhaps the president was as well although I'm a little more skeptical of that one. Beside the point. The fact remains that things went horribly wrong when the president used the bill to run over Iraq. Hence, we're in a mess now.

As for Dread, he's a great poster who has alot of interesting things to say on alot of interesting topics. I usually don't agree with him but at least he makes me think why I don't agree with him.
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Old 10-11-2004, 04:44 PM   #52
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Quote:
Originally posted by sharky
The analogy I best like for this is that Congress gave the president the keys to the car to drive it responsibly, not drive it off a cliff.
Continue the analogy with all the back seat drivers.......
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Old 10-11-2004, 06:22 PM   #53
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Quote:
Originally posted by sharky
Congress was lied to and deceived when they voted for this. Perhaps the president was as well although I'm a little more skeptical of that one. Beside the point. The fact remains that things went horribly wrong when the president used the bill to run over Iraq. Hence, we're in a mess now.
If congress was lied to, then so were the Presidents of Germany and France who also agreed with the assessments of theintelligence presented to the congress. Germany had an equally grim take on the situation in Iraq. Their politicians did not agree with the course of action that the CONGRESS and the President took, however, their intelligence showed the same if not worse as far as WMD and Nukes. That is a fact.
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Old 10-11-2004, 06:29 PM   #54
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Quote:
Originally posted by sharky
The analogy I best like for this is that Congress gave the president the keys to the car to drive it responsibly, not drive it off a cliff.

Congress was lied to and deceived when they voted for this. Perhaps the president was as well although I'm a little more skeptical of that one. Beside the point. The fact remains that things went horribly wrong when the president used the bill to run over Iraq. Hence, we're in a mess now.

As for Dread, he's a great poster who has alot of interesting things to say on alot of interesting topics. I usually don't agree with him but at least he makes me think why I don't agree with him.
amen. thanks dread for making us think! you're really challenging my convictions, which is a good thing. i'm not challenged (politically) nearly enough.

do i disagree with the vote that was passed on iraq? yeah. but that's the past. we need to work for the future.
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Old 10-11-2004, 06:41 PM   #55
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Back seat drivers, patting the driver on the back while going on a joy ride into a tree?

LOL jamila...

Either way, Kerry and company should never have made a big issue of "going" to war b/c in the end they don't look any different then Bush.
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Old 10-11-2004, 07:12 PM   #56
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Thanks for taking the time to post these meaty bits of information. It's very easy to blame President Bush, he is the figurehead but in the end there's more to it than black and white. We pay our congress' salary so they can work for us and, in a sense, speak for us. I have more ammunition to fire off at the people who are supposedly representing me, and I plan on using the knowledge gained to hopefully make a difference. The pen is mightier than the sword, so I've been told.

But I have to say this thread really, really took a disappointing turn and it was enough to bring me out of lurk mode. (beating a dead horse, I know.) Making things personal as a means of attack. It's a real turn off, especially between two posters who I admire for their passion and dedication to the issues at hand. I would like to say, dread, that I think you're a good person who's been through a lot in order to arrive where you are. So without sounding too much like the dreadsox cheering squad, I'm out...

Take a deep breath and peace be, everyone.
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Old 10-11-2004, 08:46 PM   #57
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yo peace
out
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Old 10-12-2004, 09:26 AM   #58
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Quote:
Originally posted by adam's_mistress
Thanks for taking the time to post these meaty bits of information. It's very easy to blame President Bush, he is the figurehead but in the end there's more to it than black and white. We pay our congress' salary so they can work for us and, in a sense, speak for us. I have more ammunition to fire off at the people who are supposedly representing me, and I plan on using the knowledge gained to hopefully make a difference. The pen is mightier than the sword, so I've been told.
I would say that there were members of congress who passionately argued against giving up the power for war.

Sen. Kennedy(D), Senator Byrd(D), and Senator Spector(R) and one other republican who's name escapes me, spoke passionately against the resolution. In hindsight, they made excellent points on this issue, points at the time, I strongly disagreed with. Hindsite is a wonderful thing.
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