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Old 10-10-2004, 03:10 PM   #16
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[Q]"Over the years, Iraq has worked to develop nuclear, chemical and biological weapons. During 1991 - 1994, despite Iraq's denials, U.N. inspectors discovered and dismantled a large network of nuclear facilities that Iraq was using to develop nuclear weapons. Various reports indicate that Iraq is still actively pursuing nuclear weapons capability. There is no reason to think otherwise. Beyond nuclear weapons, Iraq has actively pursued biological and chemical weapons.U.N. inspectors have said that Iraq's claims about biological weapons is neither credible nor verifiable. In 1986, Iraq used chemical weapons against Iran, and later, against its own Kurdish population. While weapons inspections have been successful in the past, there have been no inspections since the end of 1998. There can be no doubt that Iraq has continued to pursue its goal of obtaining weapons of mass destruction." -- Patty Murray, October 9, 2002 [/Q]
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Old 10-10-2004, 03:12 PM   #17
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[Q]"The debate over Iraq is not about politics. It is about national security. It should be clear that our national security requires Congress to send a clear message to Iraq and the world: America is united in its determination to eliminate forever the threat of Iraq's weapons of mass destruction." -- John Edwards, Oct 10, 2002 [/Q]
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Old 10-10-2004, 03:12 PM   #18
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it's all Monica's fault
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Old 10-10-2004, 03:39 PM   #19
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Yeah well they all fucked up(Reps and Dems alike) and they should take responsibilty for their actions but they won't, they're politicians.
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Old 10-10-2004, 03:47 PM   #20
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A great day.
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Old 10-10-2004, 06:53 PM   #21
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Dreadsox - your point?

It's alluding me.

Instead of posting threads that could become confrontational and nonproductive, how about posting in your Africa thread here in FYM about your "progress" in working on the Global AIDS crisis?

That would be a productive use of time.

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Old 10-10-2004, 08:35 PM   #22
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Dreadsox,
Thanks for taking the time to find and post those quotes.

Jamila,
What's your point? Should everyone drop every other issue and only concentrate on AIDS? Is posting about AIDS progress the only productive use of time?
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Old 10-11-2004, 04:47 AM   #23
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Jamilla,

Thanks for your concerns about my work in my church. I appreciate that.

AS for your concerns about me "productively" using my time I would like to say that Friday night I gave up for free, two tickets to the Red Sox game so that I could drive the Lions Eyemobile to a Cranberry harvest festival. On Saturday, my team of Lions and two Dr.'s that I know screened almost 100 people for hearing loss, diabetes, glaucoma, and blood pressure for FREE.

On Saturday, I also collected bottles and cans for the Lions. This program I have been running for over a year now. Since June, my team and I have collected over $2000 in redeemable bottles and cans.

Now, you may not like this thread, but it has a purpose. You may believe that the only person who should be held accountable for the war in Iraq is George Bush. I however disagree, and have posted numerous times that the CONGRESS is responsible too.

I have also enjoyed discovering that TWO of the democratic candidates for president sponsored the bill that gave President Bush the suthority to go to war. Mr. Gephardt and Mr. Edwards.

The best quote is the Edwards quotes in which he is clearlyt saying he supports the US acting UNILATERALY if the Security Council is being held hostage.

Anyways, I hope the use of my time has been acceptable to you, I tend not to like bragging about things I have done lately. How about you, how is your time?
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Old 10-11-2004, 05:15 AM   #24
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Infairness here is someone with integrity!

[Q]Congressman Ron Paul
U.S. House of Representatives
October 8, 2002

Statement Opposing the use of Military Force against Iraq

Madam Speaker, I rise in opposition to this resolution. The wisdom of the war is one issue, but the process and the philosophy behind our foreign policy are important issues as well. But I have come to the conclusion that I see no threat to our national security. There is no convincing evidence that Iraq is capable of threatening the security of this country, and, therefore, very little reason, if any, to pursue a war.

But I am very interested also in the process that we are pursuing. This is not a resolution to declare war. We know that. This is a resolution that does something much different. This resolution transfers the responsibility, the authority, and the power of the Congress to the President so he can declare war when and if he wants to. He has not even indicated that he wants to go to war or has to go to war; but he will make the full decision, not the Congress, not the people through the Congress of this country in that manner.

It does something else, though. One-half of the resolution delivers this power to the President, but it also instructs him to enforce U.N. resolutions. I happen to think I would rather listen to the President when he talks about unilateralism and national security interests, than accept this responsibility to follow all of the rules and the dictates of the United Nations. That is what this resolution does. It instructs him to follow all of the resolutions.
[/Q]
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Old 10-11-2004, 05:26 AM   #25
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Senator Spector (R):

[Q]The resolution has numerous whereas clauses so that one can read the resolution to justify the use of force if the Iraqi Government continues to abuse its citizens. I would not want to say the Iraqi Government has not abused its citizens, but I do not believe anyone is seriously contending that is the basis for the President to take the United States to war. To stop Saddam Hussein from having weapons of mass destruction which pose a threat to the United States, is a reason.

Then there is the issue of regime change, which is in the whereas clause. The resolution contains a provision for U.S. national security interests. I posed questions to the Senator from Connecticut yesterday as to whether regime change was comprehended in our national security interest. That has yet to be answered.

[/Q]

He did his job.
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Old 10-11-2004, 05:35 AM   #26
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Quote:
Originally posted by U2democrat
The way the President mismanaged the lead-up to war is why people are so pissed.
?

Seems to me that a lot of people (including those members of Congress who Dreadsox quotes) are complaining about the "rush to war" only after the fact. What did they think, that Bush was going to let negotiations drag on for another 12 months?

I think Kerry would be much more effective if he'd drop the "wrong war at the wrong time" shtick and focus more on how he's going to fix things. As far as I can tell, Kerry's entire plan is entirely contingent upon getting foreign/UN troops into Iraq, which doesn't seem terribly likely to me.

While he was still in the running, it seemed to me that Howard Dean had given much more thought to fixing Iraq, despite his opposition to the war from the outset.
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Old 10-11-2004, 08:01 AM   #27
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You did not include Section 5 of the resolution - the Global Test.





Or was this added two years after the resolution???
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Old 10-11-2004, 08:05 AM   #28
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I was complaining about the lead up to war DURING the lead up to war. Democrats had to put pressure on Bush to go to the UN BEFORE the war. They WERE complaining about it at the time, just not loudly enough.

but speedracer you're right, we shouldn't focus on what happened before the war, we should focus on what we're going to do now that we're there.
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Old 10-11-2004, 08:15 AM   #29
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It would just seem that if Dreadsox is so concerned with his newly found conversion to AIDS activism, he would have shown the posters in his own thread about Africa the courtesy to first post in his own thread about AIDS before he starts this rather meaningless thread about the war.

And I would ask people in this thread not to put words in my mouth - I never said I was against the Iraq war (I stay out of those discussions), so please don't assume that you know my viewpoints on that matter.

And, Dreadsox, I find it incredibly callous of you to make your comments to me after I did all I could several weeks ago to support you in your supposed conversion to advocacy on the AIDS issue.

I gave you a lot of helpful info and sources which has been useful to me and others in reaching out to others in regards to the Global AIDS crisis.


I don't like to bring on the Internet everything I do in my community either, but I have mentioned this before so I will simply say that I am one of the main volunteers in my area with the organization that Bono started in May in Philly.

So, I was busy too this weekend doing things to help others.

Is this what "compassionate conservatism" is all about - trying to defame others who question you?
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Old 10-11-2004, 08:19 AM   #30
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Jamilia,

FYM is broader that the issues you wish to discuss. It is counterproductive to enter this thread just to tell us that "your issue is more important that Dread's issue".
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