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Old 07-22-2007, 04:48 AM   #31
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Re: Re: Re: Re: This guy gives me hope for the future of true Christianity

Quote:
Originally posted by LemonMelon
I have no idea why you're arguing in a Christian thread when you are not even a Christian anyway.
wow... you really showed him a thing or two! way to prove your point

someone roll out another barrel of fish for this young man to shoot. maybe he can win a members only jacket for a prize
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Old 07-22-2007, 08:31 AM   #32
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Re: Re: Re: Re: This guy gives me hope for the future of true Christianity

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Originally posted by LemonMelon
Your interpretation of the Bible is made through tinted glasses. I don't care if you think the whole thing is a damn fairytale, but please interpret it correctly so you don't mislead anyone.
Irony. You just described your own interpretation.
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Old 07-22-2007, 08:41 AM   #33
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Ok, I actually teared up a little bit at a couple of things he said.

JB: I’ve seen churches split on the color of the paint on the walls. With me and Stu, we have a great love for each other and our love is bigger than one particular misunderstanding. I don’t think we can write someone off because they don’t see what I see or we haven’t gotten to the same place yet. Church splitting is ridiculous most of the time.

Especially here:
JB: It took me a long time to get there. I had a lot of gay friends and even had some congregation members who were gay, and I just wasn’t sure where I stood. In my heart, I was like, “How can I condemn these people for their love of one another?”

Thanks for posting this!
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Old 07-22-2007, 10:16 AM   #34
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Quote:
Originally posted by LemonMelon


Yeah, moving on...

The only way you could "misinterpret" the Bible's view of homosexuality is if you're illiterate. Honestly, it's right in there. People's fear of admitting what is in there is part of our conditioning by the media and society in general to compromise our beliefs if they're too radical or just not PC enough. My Bible says to love thy neighbor, even if they're gay. Guess what, that means I'm supposed to love them enough to tell them what the rest of the Bible says too, to keep them from burning in Hell. And honestly, don't get mad at me for saying that; I'm not the one who wrote the Bible. "Love" is too often misinterpreted as being nice or kissing ass, but, according to Jesus himself, the greatest love is laying down your life for your friends (John 15:13), which sometimes involves putting yourself in a position to be called a hateful bastard, for the sake of telling them the truth.

Word up, bitches.




thanks for validating everything! feel good?

i'll see you in hell with all the other hateful bastards who wrap up their prejudices in the cloak of ecstatic righteousness in order to elevate themselves above other by whatever means are easiest.

being gay is not a sin. god made me gay.

and, no, i'm not a Christian, but that doesn't mean that actions and attitudes expressed by you don't harm my community. it's because of people like you that gay kids kill themselves. so i'm going to stand up and tell you to your face that not only are you terribly, embarssingly wrong -- and adds further evidence that, yes, the Bible is a collection of little stories that some wield in order to increase their sense of power and righteousness over others -- but that you're hurting people.

as for the Biblical stuff which, you're right, i personally don't give half a shit about, Ormus/Melon has argued in here in a manner far more scholarly than your grade school quoting -- "here's a fucking quote bitches! what does my decontextualized quote mean to you bitches! that's right bitches! i'm right bitches! you're going to burn in hell bitches!" -- and so, even if i gave half a shit about what the Bible says about me (even though it doesn't talk about gay people at all), i'd listen to an argument that has a modicum of intelligence, nuance, and historical context. the only thing i'll say is that there's nothing about being gay. nothing. show me where Jesus talks about loving relationships between members of the same gender.

it must be tough living in Maryland and not being able to eat shellfish. after all, you wouldn't want to burn in hell, would you?

so, here we are again. Christians embarassing themselves.

poor Jesus.
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Old 07-22-2007, 11:31 AM   #35
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Quote:
Originally posted by Sherry Darling
Ok, I actually teared up a little bit at a couple of things he said.

JB: I’ve seen churches split on the color of the paint on the walls. With me and Stu, we have a great love for each other and our love is bigger than one particular misunderstanding. I don’t think we can write someone off because they don’t see what I see or we haven’t gotten to the same place yet. Church splitting is ridiculous most of the time.

Especially here:
JB: It took me a long time to get there. I had a lot of gay friends and even had some congregation members who were gay, and I just wasn’t sure where I stood. In my heart, I was like, “How can I condemn these people for their love of one another?”

Thanks for posting this!
You're welcome!! I'm glad you liked it!
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Old 07-22-2007, 11:32 AM   #36
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Alright, to get this thread mildly back on topic (yet still stay somewhere in this tangent we've wondered off on) I just wanted to post something I just heard in a podcast from one of Jaime's services(which meets in a bar; I think that's awesome!) Again, he's echoing so much I've been thinking for the past year. He was talking about all the issues Christians talk about as sin and he said

"Rather than saying this is an abomination of God, and this is that, you know I don't care anymore of what people think of sin and sinners anymore. Sometimes I just wanna say kiss my ass and shut the hell up. That's my flesh. That's me. I just wanna say get the hell outta my face, I don't wanna hear you anymore, I don't wanna think about it anymore, because God has them in His hands."-Jaime Bakker.
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Old 07-22-2007, 03:23 PM   #37
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"Word up bitches"? I assume that's with a captial "W"?
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Old 07-22-2007, 03:41 PM   #38
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Re: Re: This guy gives me hope for the future of true Christianity

Quote:
Originally posted by the iron horse

but not telling the truth about sin.

Homosexuality is clearly defined, in my reading and understanding, as a sin according to the scriptures.

To you and LemonMelon, start here and then do some research before embarassing others:

http://www.mccchurch.org/AM/Template...&ContentID=583
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Old 07-22-2007, 07:30 PM   #39
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Re: Re: Re: This guy gives me hope for the future of true Christianity

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Originally posted by BonoVoxSupastar


To you and LemonMelon, start here and then do some research before embarassing others:

http://www.mccchurch.org/AM/Template...&ContentID=583

Yes, thank you BonoVoxSupastar,

Doing our research from the Metropolitan Community Church site
should give us a fair and balanced view on the topic.

Would it be fair to suggest a topic should be researched from all points of view to help one form an opinion?
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Old 07-22-2007, 07:46 PM   #40
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Re: Re: Re: Re: This guy gives me hope for the future of true Christianity

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Originally posted by the iron horse
Would it be fair to suggest a topic should be researched from all points of view to help one form an opinion?


are all points of view equally supported by logic, fact, and reason?

or do we give all opinions equal weight regardless of how little they might employ logic, fact, and reason?
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Old 07-22-2007, 08:04 PM   #41
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Quote:
Originally posted by anitram
A while ago I began to believe that the entire notion of sin is kind of nonsensical to me. Don't believe in it, and don't believe in hell either.


A person can have a strong sense of right and wrong

have very good values

have decent morals

without the concept of sin.

Sin permits and encourages judgements on some actions or behaviors that many times are not the judgers business at all.
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Old 07-22-2007, 08:09 PM   #42
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Re: Re: Re: Re: This guy gives me hope for the future of true Christianity

Quote:
Originally posted by the iron horse



Yes, thank you BonoVoxSupastar,

Doing our research from the Metropolitan Community Church site
should give us a fair and balanced view on the topic.

Would it be fair to suggest a topic should be researched from all points of view to help one form an opinion?
I post that link because it's one that is pretty percise, easy to understand, and it's one of the few I've found that is all encompassing rather than just addressing one line or one book.

It's a good place to START, and she does list her sources.

It's much better than just taking your translation at face value which is what it looks like to me...
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Old 07-22-2007, 09:27 PM   #43
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Re: Re: Re: Re: This guy gives me hope for the future of true Christianity

Quote:
Originally posted by the iron horse



Yes, thank you BonoVoxSupastar,

Doing our research from the Metropolitan Community Church site
should give us a fair and balanced view on the topic.

Would it be fair to suggest a topic should be researched from all points of view to help one form an opinion?
Yes, why bother actually reading what they said and checking their sources (which, incidentally, seem to be peer-reviewed ones) when you can just make a snap judgement based on who it's from instead? It's just not possible that they might have approached this neutrally and tried to avoid bias, is it?

Judge the article on its merits rather than discarding it due to your bias against the website it's on.
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Old 07-22-2007, 10:51 PM   #44
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Quote:
Originally posted by deep




A person can have a strong sense of right and wrong

have very good values

have decent morals

without the concept of sin.

Sin permits and encourages judgements on some actions or behaviors that many times are not the judgers business at all.
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Old 07-22-2007, 11:11 PM   #45
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Re: Re: Re: Re: This guy gives me hope for the future of true Christianity

Quote:
Originally posted by the iron horse
Yes, thank you BonoVoxSupastar,

Doing our research from the Metropolitan Community Church site
should give us a fair and balanced view on the topic.

Would it be fair to suggest a topic should be researched from all points of view to help one form an opinion?
Read a Melon/Ormus post and come up with a rebuttal to his research, evidence, and analysis that states that modern homosexuality is not addressed in the Bible.

In fact, I'll help you out and link it: http://forum.interference.com/showth...&pagenumber=15

I've linked this many times, because it's so good. Read his post, the last one on the linked page.
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