the start of World War III? - U2 Feedback

Go Back   U2 Feedback > Lypton Village > Free Your Mind > Free Your Mind Archive
Click Here to Login
 
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 07-09-2006, 05:20 PM   #1
Rock n' Roll Doggie
VIP PASS
 
Pearl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: NYC
Posts: 5,653
Local Time: 05:21 PM
the start of World War III?

http://www.nydailynews.com/front/sto...p-365242c.html


Quote:
It's WWIII, and U.S. is out of ideas


Last week's headlines prove the point: North Korea fires missiles, Iran talks of nukes again, Iraq carnage continues, Israel invades Gaza, England observes one-year anniversary of subway bombing. And, oh, yes, the feds stop a plot to blow up tunnels under the Hudson River.
World War III has begun.

It's not perfectly clear when it started. Perhaps it was after the Berlin Wall fell and the Cold War ended. Perhaps it was the first bombing of the World Trade Center, in 1993.

What is clear is that this war has a long fuse and, while we are not in the full-scale combat phase that marked World Wars I and II, we seem to be heading there. The expanding hostilities mean it's time to give this conflict a name, one that focuses the mind and clarifies the big picture.

The war on terror, or the war of terror, has tentacles that reach much of the globe. It is a world war.

While it is often a war of loose or no affiliation, and sometimes just amateur copycats, the similar goals of destruction add up to a threat against modern society. Even the hapless wanna-bes busted in Miami ordered guns and military equipment from a man they thought was from Al Qaeda. Islamic fascists are the driving force, but anti-American hatred is a global membership card for any and all who have a grievance and a gun.

The feeling that the wheels are coming off the world has only one recent comparison, the time when America's head-butt with communism sprouted hot spots from Cuba to Vietnam. Yet ultimately the policy of mutual assured destruction worked because American and Soviet leaders didn't want their countries hit by nuclear bombs.

Such rational thinking is quaint next to the ravings of North Korean nut Kim Jong Il and Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad. They both seem to be dying to die - and set the world on fire.

And don't forget Osama Bin Laden's declaration that it is the duty of every Muslim to acquire a "Muslim bomb." Is there any doubt he would use it if he had it?

I sound pessimistic because I am. Even worse than the problems is the fact that our political system is failing us. Democratic Party leaders want to pretend we can declare peace and everything will be fine, while President Bush is out of ideas. Witness Bush now counseling patience and diplomacy on North Korea. This from a man who scorned both for five years.

But what choice does he have now that the pillars of his post-9/11 foreign policy are crumbling? As Harvard Prof. Joseph Nye argues in Foreign Affairs magazine, Bush's strategy of "reducing Washington's reliance on permanent alliances and international institutions, expanding the traditional right of preemption into a new doctrine of preventive war and advocating coercive democratization as a solution to Middle Eastern terrorism" amounted to a bid for a "legacy of transformation."

The first two ideas have been repealed. The third brought Hamas into power and has so far failed to take root in Iraq or anywhere else.

I believed Iraq was the key, that if we prevailed there, momentum would shift in our favor. Now I'm not sure. We still must prevail there, but Iraq could mean nothing if Iran or Bin Laden get the bomb or North Korea uses one.

Meanwhile, I'm definitely not using any tunnels.
It does make you wonder what this is building up to. And the recent events make you stop and think.
__________________

__________________
Pearl is offline  
Old 07-09-2006, 05:48 PM   #2
Rock n' Roll Doggie
ALL ACCESS
 
vaz02's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: manchester
Posts: 7,447
Local Time: 09:21 PM
3rd world war will be thought between the huge companies such as nike and coca cola .....
__________________

__________________
vaz02 is offline  
Old 07-09-2006, 08:05 PM   #3
ONE
love, blood, life
 
melon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Toronto, Ontario
Posts: 11,781
Local Time: 04:21 PM
This is hardly WWIII. This is more on-par with the Barbary pirates of the 18th and 19th centuries. The first world wars were clashes between the global superpowers of their days. This time around, it's nuisances from third-world countries looking for attention, and rogue dissidents from these failed states.

This article lacks historical perspective, that's for sure.

Melon
__________________
melon is offline  
Old 07-09-2006, 08:33 PM   #4
Rock n' Roll Doggie
Band-aid
 
trevster2k's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Posts: 4,330
Local Time: 05:51 PM
There have been other people who suggest that we are in the beginnings of the Third World War too. They speculate that due to diminished resources and the rise of countries such as China and India, countries will have to position themselves to have the best access to water, oil, minerals, farmland, etc
__________________
trevster2k is offline  
Old 07-09-2006, 09:44 PM   #5
Blue Crack Addict
 
verte76's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: hoping for changes
Posts: 23,331
Local Time: 09:21 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by melon


This article lacks historical perspective, that's for sure.

Melon
Gosh, does it ever.
__________________
verte76 is offline  
Old 07-09-2006, 09:51 PM   #6
Rock n' Roll Doggie
FOB
 
Kieran McConville's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Auto Dafoe
Posts: 9,600
Local Time: 07:21 AM
If this is 'world war III' it's not because of Iran or North Korea. Just like Melon said, let's think about it for a moment. North Korea is a scary place, but it is not the expansionist Japanese Empire of 1935-45, not by a million miles. If they want to pick examples of bad leaders as evidence of a 'global war', why not throw every mad and bad African dictator in the mix as well. Robert Mugabe?

Aside from all that, I distrust writers who talk up war. There is a reason why people erred sometimes on the 'appeasement' side of the ledger in the 1930s. Britain, for one, was in very shaky shape after the devastating First World War (as were most of the big European powers, why else did they put their efforts into the League of Nations?). In the end it went to war again because its options ran out... and in due course it went bankrupt for real.
__________________
Kieran McConville is offline  
Old 07-09-2006, 11:28 PM   #7
Rock n' Roll Doggie
VIP PASS
 
Pearl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: NYC
Posts: 5,653
Local Time: 05:21 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by melon


This article lacks historical perspective, that's for sure.

Melon

Then again it is the Daily News, not exactly high level of journalism.
But it does point out a few things that make you wonder where are we headed, if we are at all
__________________
Pearl is offline  
Old 07-10-2006, 12:32 AM   #8
ONE
love, blood, life
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Tempe, Az USA
Posts: 12,856
Local Time: 02:21 PM
but in previous times, technology did not exist the way it does today so we don't have an accurate historical model to compare our day with.

i do think we are on the beaches of normandy of www3.

dbs
__________________
diamond is offline  
Old 07-10-2006, 01:24 AM   #9
BVS
Blue Crack Supplier
 
BVS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: between my head and heart
Posts: 40,684
Local Time: 03:21 PM
We love to live in fear, don't we?
__________________
BVS is online now  
Old 07-10-2006, 01:28 AM   #10
ONE
love, blood, life
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Tempe, Az USA
Posts: 12,856
Local Time: 02:21 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by BonoVoxSupastar
We love to live in fear, don't we?
No.
That I can make an observation doesn't mean I live fear based life.
I even have love for a fellow like you BVS.

dbs
__________________
diamond is offline  
Old 07-10-2006, 01:32 AM   #11
BVS
Blue Crack Supplier
 
BVS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: between my head and heart
Posts: 40,684
Local Time: 03:21 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by diamond


No.
That I can make an observation doesn't mean I live fear based life.
I even have love for a fellow like you BVS.

dbs
I wasn't commenting on your paticular comment.

I'm speaking in general. The history of our country shows we like our fear. McCarthyism, war on drugs, terror alerts, even the Cold War to an extent...just to name a few.
__________________
BVS is online now  
Old 07-10-2006, 01:52 AM   #12
Rock n' Roll Doggie
Band-aid
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: The American Resistance
Posts: 4,754
Local Time: 03:21 PM
Some subscribe to the idea that the Cold War was actually WW III and that 9/11 was the start of WW IV, a global war against radical Islam. If you are looking only at the number of countries fighting under declarations of war, then no, I don't accept that nomenclature. But that being said, who says a world war must be fought between massive armies of troops?
Didn't both the U.S. and the Soviet Union support skirmishes in Europe, SE Asia, the Middle East, Central America, and elsewhere? Didn't both have enough nuclear missiles targeted around the world so as to leave few countries on the planet unscathed by a full-out attack?
And our current war. If even 10% of Muslim are sympathetic to the cause of Jihad, then countries around the world may soon be faced with the consequences of "home-grown" terrorists. Not to mention Iran possessing nuclear weapons someday.
Again, not sure I concur, but you can make a case for it.
__________________
INDY500 is offline  
Old 07-10-2006, 01:59 AM   #13
BVS
Blue Crack Supplier
 
BVS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: between my head and heart
Posts: 40,684
Local Time: 03:21 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by INDY500

And our current war. If even 10% of Muslim are sympathetic to the cause of Jihad, then countries around the world may soon be faced with the consequences of "home-grown" terrorists. Not to mention Iran possessing nuclear weapons someday.
Again, not sure I concur, but you can make a case for it.
Aren't you blurring a lot different and very unique issues here?
__________________
BVS is online now  
Old 07-10-2006, 07:54 AM   #14
The Fly
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 220
Local Time: 09:21 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by INDY500
Some subscribe to the idea that the Cold War was actually WW III and that 9/11 was the start of WW IV, a global war against radical Islam.
Like Superbowl XXXIV or XXXV?!? Surely the specific number is one of the least pressing problems of the world.

Quote:

If you are looking only at the number of countries fighting under declarations of war, then no, I don't accept that nomenclature. But that being said, who says a world war must be fought between massive armies of troops?
Didn't both the U.S. and the Soviet Union support skirmishes in Europe, SE Asia, the Middle East, Central America, and elsewhere? Didn't both have enough nuclear missiles targeted around the world so as to leave few countries on the planet unscathed by a full-out attack?
This does not meet my definition of world war. Skirmishes around the globe and the threat of mutually assured destruction is not similar to many millions of dead within a short number of years due to full blown war and all its horrible consequences.

Quote:

And our current war. If even 10% of Muslim are sympathetic to the cause of Jihad, then countries around the world may soon be faced with the consequences of "home-grown" terrorists. Not to mention Iran possessing nuclear weapons someday.
10% of the Muslim population?! Where? I don’t know where you have obtained that number but if you use the word “sympathetic” to cover those few lunatics who would willingly murder in the name of their God, you’ve just managed to describe 10% of American, British, French etc. Muslims as extremist, murderous traitors. You want to call attention to the threat of “home-grown” terrorists? Fine, I agree that the threat is real, but I have a strong aversion to sweeping statements like this.

Quote:
Originally posted by BonoVoxSupastar


Aren't you blurring a lot different and very unique issues here?
__________________
silja is offline  
Old 07-10-2006, 08:07 AM   #15
ONE
love, blood, life
 
melon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Toronto, Ontario
Posts: 11,781
Local Time: 04:21 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by diamond
but in previous times, technology did not exist the way it does today so we don't have an accurate historical model to compare our day with.
Have you seen the kind of "technology" that Hamas uses to send rockets? They're pretty much high-powered fireworks without pretty colors. They are in really sad shape, which is why they're virtually powerless when Israel finally gets fed up with them.

North Korea is pretty much a regional threat, because their Taepodong-2 missile is a joke. Still, kind of like Hamas, you don't want your glorified fireworks to accidentally crash on Seoul or Tokyo, so it is worth pressuring them to stop.

Iran has taken notes from North Korea. If you do nuclear research, you get stuff and also get an insurance policy against invasion. But, like North Korea, they are not an immediate threat. They are yet another nuisance third-world dictatorship looking for attention and recognition.

Making this sound like WWIII is about as absurd as comparing Bush to Adolf Hitler.

Melon
__________________

__________________
melon is offline  
 

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:21 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Design, images and all things inclusive copyright © Interference.com