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Old 09-15-2006, 12:26 AM   #151
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Originally posted by financeguy


If we assume such a clash is possible the key aggressors must surely be the US, Britain and Israel. They have already managed to land Shia and Sunni Muslims on the same side of the fence, no mean feat!

Significant control of the Middle East was sacrificed and Iran's position was strengthened not inconsiderably by our having to place European troops in a region where they can turn up the heat whenever they want.

So America plays a pivotal role in strengthening an opponent, they then hand them a few additional aces for negotiating with European diplomats, and then they call for Europe to rally around their cause in countering that opponent.

Utter insanity, only the unholy gaggle of interventionist Trotskyites, 'reformed' Marxists and cowardly bed-wetting chickenhawk armchair warriors that call themselves 'neo-cons' could dream up this shit.

Cheers,

Financeguy

(A TRUE conservative)

As it happened.

No propaganda, no docudrama. We didn't dream up this shit.

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Old 09-15-2006, 01:55 AM   #152
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If people don't see the threat of radical Islam by now they are just simply lying to themselves. It is the only thing that makes sense to me.
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Old 09-15-2006, 02:04 AM   #153
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Kids, kids, middle ground. People see the threat, I don't think that is being debated. It's the solution that is being debated.
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Old 09-15-2006, 02:22 AM   #154
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Originally posted by Earnie Shavers
Kids, kids, middle ground. People see the threat, I don't think that is being debated. It's the solution that is being debated.
I am not reading many alternative solutions out there. Please offer one.
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Old 09-15-2006, 02:26 AM   #155
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I'm a 27 year old guy from Sydney who markets films for a living. I don't have a solution.
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Old 09-15-2006, 03:40 AM   #156
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I am not reading many alternative solutions out there. Please offer one.
It's hard to have a solution for an absolute quandary.

It seems the political debate in this country takes place primarily on reasons for the quandary rather than solutions to get out.
I don't think anyone in power has great ideas about what to do.

At the least we can hope not to make the same mistakes again (read: no more neocons) and also try and not make things worse (read: abide by Geneva accords and avoid another regime change and a drawn out occupation if at all possible). So we know what not to do, thanks to the cowboy manifesto.

The same shit policy that gave us the quandary is going to try and lead us out. I hope it works. At this point, there aren't any real great ideas. Seems to be bad ideas vs no ideas. I chose not to debate the reasons for where we are, it's painfully obvious to anyone clued into reality, I wish people could try and move past it, it's beyond policy rhettoric at this point. I am doing my best to do so, I just want to see some progress, that's all.
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Old 09-15-2006, 09:11 AM   #157
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Originally posted by financeguy
Utter insanity, only the unholy gaggle of interventionist Trotskyites, 'reformed' Marxists and cowardly bed-wetting chickenhawk armchair warriors that call themselves 'neo-cons' could dream up this shit.
I just want to clarify that this is intended to refer to the neo-con leadership and writers like Coulter and Mark Stein, etc, and not to ordinary people or ordinary members of the military, who mostly do their best in difficult circumstances.
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Old 09-15-2006, 10:04 AM   #158
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I am not reading many alternative solutions out there. Please offer one.
No, just none you like.
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Old 09-18-2006, 07:45 PM   #159
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Quote:
BY CYRUS NOWRASTEH
Monday, September 18, 2006 12:01 a.m. EDT - Wall Street Journal



The Path to Hysteria
My sin was to write a screenplay accurately depicting Bill Clinton's record on terrorism.

BY CYRUS NOWRASTEH
Monday, September 18, 2006 12:01 a.m. EDT

I am neither an activist, politician or partisan, nor an ideologue of any stripe. What I am is a writer who takes his job very seriously, as do most of my colleagues: Also, one who recently took on the most distressing and important story it will ever fall to me to tell. I considered it a privilege when asked to write the script for "The Path to 9/11." I felt duty-bound from the outset to focus on a single goal--to represent our recent pre-9/11 history as the evidence revealed it to be. The American people deserve to know that history: They have paid for it in blood. Like all Americans, I wish it were not so. I wish there were no terrorists. I wish there had been no 9/11. I wish we could squabble among ourselves in assured security. But wishes avail nothing.

My Iranian parents fled tyranny and oppression. I know and appreciate deeply the sanctuary America has offered. Only in this country could a person such as I have had the life, liberty and opportunity that I have had. No one needs to remind me of this--I know it every single day. I know, too, as does everyone involved in the production, that we kept uppermost in our minds the need for due diligence in the delivery of this history. Fact-checkers and lawyers scrutinized every detail, every line, every scene. There were hundreds of pages of annotations. We were informed by multiple advisers and interviews with people involved in the events--and books, including in a most important way the 9/11 Commission Report.

It would have been good to be able to report due diligence on the part of those who judged the film, the ones who held forth on it before watching a moment of it. Instead, in the rush to judgment, and the effort to portray the series as the work of a right-wing zealot, much was made of my "friendship" with Rush Limbaugh (a connection limited to two social encounters), but nothing of any acquaintance with well-known names on the other side of the political spectrum. No reference to Abby Mann, for instance, with whom I worked on "10,000 Black Men Named George" (whose hero is an African-American communist) or Oliver Stone, producer of "The Day Reagan Was Shot," a film I wrote and directed. Clearly, those enraged that a film would criticize the Clinton administration's antiterrorism policies--though critical of its successor as well--were willing to embrace only one scenario: The writer was a conservative hatchetman.

In July a reporter asked if I had ever been ethnically profiled. I happily replied, "No." I can no longer say that. The L.A. Times, for one, characterized me by race, religion, ethnicity, country-of-origin and political leanings--wrongly on four of five counts. To them I was an Iranian-American politically conservative Muslim. It is perhaps irrelevant in our brave new world of journalism that I was born in Boulder, Colo. I am not a Muslim or practitioner of any religion, nor am I a political conservative. What am I? I am, most devoutly, an American. I asked the reporter if this kind of labeling was a new policy for the paper. He had no response.
The hysteria engendered by the series found more than one target. In addition to the death threats and hate mail directed at me, and my grotesque portrayal as a maddened right-winger, there developed an impassioned search for incriminating evidence on everyone else connected to the film. And in director David Cunningham, the searchers found paydirt! His father had founded a Christian youth outreach mission. The whiff of the younger Mr. Cunningham's possible connection to this enterprise was enough to set the hounds of suspicion baying. A religious mission! A New York Times reporter wrote, without irony or explanation, that an issue that raised questions about the director was his involvement in his father's outreach work. In the era of McCarthyism, the merest hint of a connection to communism sufficed to inspire dark accusations, the certainty that the accused was part of a malign conspiracy. Today, apparently, you can get something of that effect by charging a connection with a Christian mission.

"The Path to 9/11" was intended to remind us of the common enemy we face. Like the 9/11 Report itself, it is meant to enable us to better defend ourselves from a future attack. Past is prologue, and 9/11 is merely another step in an escalating Islamic fundamentalist reign of terror. By dramatizing the step-by-step increase in attacks on America--all of which, in fact, occurred--we are better able to see the pattern and anticipate the future. That was the point of the series, its only intention. Call it the canary in the coal mine. Call it John O'Neill in the FBI.

Despite intense political pressure to pull the film right up until airtime, Disney/ABC stood tall and refused to give in. For this--for not buckling to threats from Democratic senators threatening to revoke ABC station licenses--Disney CEO Rober Iger and ABC executives deserve every commendation. Hence the 28 million viewers over two nights, and the ratings victory Monday night (little reported by the media), are gratifying indeed.

"The Path to 9/11" was set in the time before the event, and in a world in which no party had the political will to act. The principals did not know then what we know now. It is also indisputable that Bill Clinton entered office a month before the first attack on the World Trade Center. Eight years then went by, replete with terrorist assaults on Americans and American interests overseas. George W. Bush was in office eight months before 9/11. Those who actually watched the entire miniseries know that he was given no special treatment.

It's good to have come to something approaching the end of this saga, whose lessons are worth remembering. It gave us, for one thing, a heartening glimpse (these things don't come along every day) of corporate backbone in the face of phenomenal pressure--and an infinitely more chilling one testifying to the power and reach of politically driven hysteria. A ripe subject for a miniseries, if ever there was one.
Mr. Nowrasteh wrote the screenplay for "The Path to 9/11."
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