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Old 09-23-2007, 08:08 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally posted by Dreadsox


I find it interesting that it has now become "selfish" to make a choice to have a child and to use a "fertility treatment"

but

God forbid anyone call a woman having an abortion selfish(And I am talking aqbout those that use it as birth control.)

That's her right.

This world is fucked up.
Yes it is fucked up that abortion can be regulated. Do you see me calling for any regulation about 30000 dollar children? No, I'm expressing a private opinion that I would NEVER EVER make a law.
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Old 09-23-2007, 08:09 PM   #17
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Originally posted by Dreadsox


Because, it should not be their choice.

They should play the hand they were delt....

Which only applies in the case of people who want to have a baby.......????

See?
They can adopt. Hell , they can adopt all the babies you guys want to save.
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Old 09-23-2007, 08:10 PM   #18
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Originally posted by toscano


I guess having 3 kids (without treatments) I don't see how it's selfish to do what you can to have your own kids
You don't think spending shitloads of money to get pregnant isn't just the tiniest bit self-centered?
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Old 09-23-2007, 08:16 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally posted by martha


You don't think spending shitloads of money to get pregnant isn't just the tiniest bit self-centered?

No

Spending shitloads of money on botox, implants, nose jobs, now THAT'S self-centred

If someone wants their own child it's their prerogative, and who are you or I to say if it's self-centred and how they should spend their money ?
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Old 09-23-2007, 08:20 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally posted by toscano

Spending shitloads of money on botox, implants, nose jobs, now THAT'S self-centred
Agreed 100%



Quote:
Originally posted by toscano

If someone wants their own child it's their prerogative, and who are you or I to say if it's self-centred and how they should spend their money ?
I was saying it's self-centered in the context of giving someone shit about not having kids. I personally do think it's incredibly self-centered to spend a ton of money to simply have a baby that looks like you. I would never ever say that to anyone who has done it, and I would never in a bazillion years ever try to legislate it, but I do think it's the height of selfishness in a world with children waiting for good homes and children starving to death.
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Old 09-23-2007, 08:20 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally posted by martha


I wasn't criticizing anyone who has kids at all. I was comparing "selfishnesses." I think it's a criminal waste of money to get fertility treatments that cost $30,000 to counter what nature gave you. I think the insane entitlement attitude we have in this country that produces people who will go to those lengths simply to have their own child is crazy. If one can't have kids, that's sad if one wanted them, but to spend and spend and spend simply to give birth is the height of "selfishness."
Attacking the exact opposite of unplanned pregnancy as a criminal waste of resources may make perfect sense in your mind but those sorts of attitudes shouldn't hold any coersive sway over people making choices about raising children. There is nothing at all unreasonable about wanting to raise a child with your genes, if those people have the means to afford IVF and go through all that strife just to have a child then that only makes them selfish in as much as wanting the best for their offspring.
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Old 09-23-2007, 08:22 PM   #22
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Originally posted by A_Wanderer
Attacking the exact opposite of unplanned pregnancy as a criminal waste of resources may make perfect sense in your mind but those sorts of attitudes shouldn't hold any coersive sway over people making choices about raising children.
No, they shouldn't. You're right. As I've repeatedly stated, this is my private opinion, one I would not use to influence anyone.
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Old 09-23-2007, 08:22 PM   #23
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Originally posted by Hinder
I suspect a lot of it comes from not looking my age. People assume I am on average, about 23.
Wow! I just turned 34 and I get a lot of "Oh, I thought you were in your 20s!" but I don't think anyone thinks I'm that young. Maybe that liquor store clerk the other week who looked long and hard at my ID.

My mom is great - she told me back in my 20s that she knows better than to start asking about grandchildren.
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Old 09-23-2007, 08:25 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally posted by martha
Agreed 100%





I was saying it's self-centered in the context of giving someone shit about not having kids. I personally do think it's incredibly self-centered to spend a ton of money to simply have a baby that looks like you. I would never ever say that to anyone who has done it, and I would never in a bazillion years ever try to legislate it, but I do think it's the height of selfishness in a world with children waiting for good homes and children starving to death.
Not being in a position to understand the biological / physiological urge of a woman when sh ewants to have a child, i would never criticize anyone who feel sthat way.

I fought tooth and nail with my wife over having a 3rd, all the logic in the world about our home size, our finances, etc couldn't sway her one iota. I wouldn't change a thing now that we have him. But i guess my point is that i believe when the "urge" kicks in it can be pretty unstoppable, so i wouldn't be so presumptious as to talk anyone out of it as I'm not in their shoes.
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Old 09-23-2007, 08:29 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally posted by toscano
so i wouldn't be so presumptious as to talk anyone out of it as I'm not in their shoes.
Neither would I.

Yet I can still have the belief that it's inherently wrong to spend a small fortune just to get pregnant.
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Old 09-23-2007, 08:48 PM   #26
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Originally posted by martha


They can adopt. Hell , they can adopt all the babies you guys want to save.
Ooohhhh "you guys"....

Ya know, you do not know me or my beliefs....

I will defend their right to their beliefs just as I would defend your right to yours with them.



You guys...lol
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Old 09-23-2007, 08:50 PM   #27
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Do you (any of you) feel that the state should fund IVF? That's an interesting debate that's going on in several countries at the moment.
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Old 09-23-2007, 08:53 PM   #28
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No, I do not.

This is where I feel the argument, the cards you were delt, is applicable.

If people are using their own insurance to get pregnant, fine. Tax $$ should not be used for this.
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Old 09-23-2007, 09:00 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally posted by anitram
I respect people who don't think they would make great parents or who are just not interested in children and never have been, openly stating so rather than giving in to the pressure.

I never had much interest in having a biological child. I'm not closed off to the idea, but I'd rather adopt, and no, I don't need a shiny newborn either. My grandmother's brother was adopted decades ago when it was much more rare, and so nobody in our family has ever thought of it as "different" than having a biological child.
And that is the way it is in my family. I cannot say that anyone ever even brought it up more than once in my 39 years.

I love my family.
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Old 09-23-2007, 10:09 PM   #30
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Quote:
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Do you (any of you) feel that the state should fund IVF?
No, I don't.
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