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Old 02-05-2004, 06:01 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally posted by sarit

I really want to believe that the other side wants peace to. I think that a great part of the hatred Palestinians have for us comes from the daily life they go through Ė the presence of the I.D.F along side with the poverty and maybe somewhat of a dictator-like regime by their own leaders.
But every now and then I see, read and hear reports of children being taught that killing Jews is good, official books of Palestinian authorities encouraging the infamous holy war and that dying as a suicide bomber is a superior way to end your life.
To be honest, I really donít know what to believe anymore. I donít think that itís our business (meaning our army Ė the I.D.F) to be Gaza, but I wonder more and more if getting out of there (and the west bank) would solve anything at all, would stop all this blood shed.
Thanks for your post, sarit, I found it really interesting to hear something about the subject from the perspective of someone who lives in Israel. And for what it's worth, I thought your English was great.

I think you're right that part of the problem is that Palestinians are suffering because of the occupation and because of some of the actions of their own political leadership. Any situation in which people feel hopeless and oppressed makes it more likely that they will have sympathy with extremists who preach hatred and violence.

Of course there are problems such as some Palestinians choosing to teach their children that Jewish people are their enemy, or those groups which won't be happy as long as the state of Israel exists.

However, I think it's clear that tactics such as the occupation, imposing curfews, preventing people getting medical treatment and all the other abuses which happen under occupation aren't going to solve the problem. I think it gives ammunition to those who want to encourage Palestinians to support suicide bombings, by convincing them of lies such as the idea that all Israelis hate Palestinians or that the Israeli occupation is designed solely to make life impossible for the Palestinians.

Of course that brings up the obvious fact that the reason for the occupation is an attempt to prevent suicide bombings in Israel, and so there are many people in Israel who believe that without occupation you would have many more suicide bombings. However, doesn't that also raise the question, if the occupation is the only thing preventing suicide bombings (and not preventing them entirely at that) then how can the occupation ever end? And is it acceptable for a country to occupy territories indefinitely?

By the way, what is your opinion about the security fence/separation wall/whatever else it's called today? Do you think it's likely to help prevent suicide bombings, and do you think there's the right balance between trying to prevent suicide bombings and allowing people in Palestine to live their lives without the disruption the wall seems to be causing to them.

Again, thanks for your post and I hope you keep posting in FYM, it's always nice to see somebody new around here.
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Old 02-05-2004, 07:41 PM   #17
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There have been two posts in FYM that made my eyes tear up. Sarit welcome to FYM. As much reading and debating I like to do in here on any topic it pales in comparison to anyone, on anyside of an issue, who is living it.

May peace find its way into your life soon. That is my prayer for you.

I have posted threads about the Palestinian textbooks. It is incomprehensable how long it would take to overcome so many years of hate taught in the schools. As a teacher, I know how difficult it is to overcome my own past educational excperiences to teach what I have to teach. Not only do I have to get through my own past, but I have to convince parents of things as well. this may be in the way we teach math here in the USA. To get through all of that hatred will take generations.

Again...peace to you.
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Old 02-06-2004, 06:09 PM   #18
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Thank you all for your replies.

As I already said, I donít think that itís Israel business to be in Gaza strip nor in the west bank. And FizzingWhizzbees, youíre partly right - many Israelis are afraid that letting go of curfews and etc. will make it easier for more suicide bombing to take place (as happened before). But most Israelis do think these days that we should stop occupying those lands and that a real peace agreement should take place. I donít want to speak on behalf of every citizen of my country, so Iíll just say that I feel that the current Palestinian leadership is not trustworthy (referring specially to Mr. Arafat, who seems to run the show over there no matter what), and that our own needs a bit of a reality check to.
Very surprisingly, our prime minister declared this week of the intention to remove all settlements from the Gaza strip. This will go to a national pole (sourly thereís a proper term for this - anyone?) and all signs indicate that the majority will vote for this move.

The only thing that will stop suicide bombing, or any other kind of terror attacks completely, is a decision to do so by the Palestinians. The Israeli intelligence manages to prevent many of them. And as for the security fence being built these days Ė it may only reduce the number of attacks but it will never ever stop them entirely. The only thing that will is a peace agreement, not just one written on paper, but also a real and vivid one. That requires among other things to stop any form of education that is encouraging hate.
Another thing Ė itís hard to try and decide weather there is a balance between the need to prevent suicide bombing and the day-to-day hardship it causes some of the Palestinians. Iím sure that the Palestinian farmer being prevented the access to his land does not care for the reason the fence is there. On the other hand, the 30 something year old Israeli man living in a ďkibbutzĒ inside of Israel, only minuets walk from the west bank, whom his wife and two little kids were killed by a terrorist who entered their home and shot them from zero range (actually happened) Ė in his pain will find it very hard to relate to hardship of the farmer.

It seems hopeless sometimes.
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Old 02-07-2004, 01:43 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally posted by BonoVoxSupastar
Hate is hate it doesn't matter the package.
Hello, BonoVoxSuperstar! How are you this morning?

Are you claiming here that the words of Walid Shoebat today are "hateful"?

~U2Alabama
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Old 02-07-2004, 01:51 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally posted by sarit
It seems hopeless sometimes.
Hello, Sarit, and welcome to the web-based community known as www.interference.com .

Don't let the hatred and violence destroy your hope. Your hope and prayers are what can one day lead to an EFFECTIVE peace agreement.

Shalom, chaverim.

~U2Alabama
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Old 02-07-2004, 05:16 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally posted by U2Bama


Hello, BonoVoxSuperstar! How are you this morning?

Are you claiming here that the words of Walid Shoebat today are "hateful"?

~U2Alabama
I was curious about that myself.
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Old 02-09-2004, 07:37 PM   #22
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I just thought I'd stick this here....it's a heartwarming story about a tiny Iraqi ambassador to Israel. http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/3239492.stm

You can now return to your regularly scheduled controversy.
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Old 02-09-2004, 08:36 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally posted by verte76
I just thought I'd stick this here....it's a heartwarming story about a tiny Iraqi ambassador to Israel. http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/3239492.stm
Thank you for posting that. God bless the doctors for taking care of that precious child, and may she have a speedy and thorough recovery.

Quote:
He said he hoped that the operation on Bayan would serve as a bridge between the Iraqi and Israeli peoples.
Despite divisions of race, culture, religion, what have you, we're all just people.
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Old 02-09-2004, 09:14 PM   #24
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You're quite welcome. I love this story so much I'm freaking out posting the link to all of my U2 listservers, political lists, etc, etc.
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Old 02-09-2004, 10:12 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally posted by U2Bama


Hello, BonoVoxSuperstar! How are you this morning?

Are you claiming here that the words of Walid Shoebat today are "hateful"?

~U2Alabama
Sorry I'm late to respond I was out of town, but I had a lovely time thanks for asking.

No I wasn't saying his words today are hateful, but he grew up in much hate.
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