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Old 03-23-2003, 08:20 PM   #1
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The fake surrenders

I am aghast at what I heard on the news! Several of our guys were killed when a group of Iraqis pretended to surrender and then opened fire! Another group pretended to be civilians welcoming the Americans then shot them! This combined with the disgraceful treatment and murder of our POW's shows just how low the Iraqis can be. This dishonorable shit is against the Geneva convention and unbelieveable. Of course war is hell but you'd think at least some decency would be preserved among warriors. People who have more sympathy for the Iraqis than our military people sicken me. I don't think anything in Iraq is worth the precious, irreplaceable lives of our people in uniform. Sorry had to vent.
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Old 03-23-2003, 08:21 PM   #2
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i am not surprised that this happend.
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Old 03-23-2003, 08:24 PM   #3
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Re: The fake surrenders

Quote:
Originally posted by BrittanyNova
I am aghast at what I heard on the news! Several of our guys were killed when a group of Iraqis pretended to surrender and then opened fire! Another group pretended to be civilians welcoming the Americans then shot them! This combined with the disgraceful treatment and murder of our POW's shows just how low the Iraqis can be. This dishonorable shit is against the Genevea convention and unbelieveable. Of course war is hell but you'd think at least some decency would be preserved among warriors. People who have more sympathy for the Iraqis than our military people sicken me.
Quote:

I don't thinkanything in Iraq is worth the precious, irreplaceable lives of our people in uniform. Sorry had to vent.
There are those of us who think that incidents like the above that happen every day in Iraq are precisely the reason why we *do* have to undertake military action in Iraq, but you probably already knew that...
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Old 03-23-2003, 08:32 PM   #4
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It is war. Are we not bombing "shock & awe" on their cities? How many have we killed. I haven't heard one estimate.

Wake up America, what did you expect? Are you so naive the think they wouldn't resist.

Take your blinders off. Have you seen the anti-American protests around the world. especially in Moslem countries?
It is coming true what the anti-unilateralist said.
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Old 03-23-2003, 08:37 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally posted by Scarletwine
It is war. Are we not bombing "shock & awe" on their cities? How many have we killed. I haven't heard one estimate.
The Iraqi Propaganda Machine gives estimates of a few hundred. If this is the best the IPM can come up with, I'm not too worried.

Quote:

Wake up America, what did you expect? Are you so naive the think they wouldn't resist.

Take your blinders off. Have you seen the anti-American protests around the world. especially in Moslem countries?
It is coming true what the anti-unilateralist said.
Rather premature to declare the war a failure after less than a week, don't you think?
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Old 03-23-2003, 08:53 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally posted by speedracer





Rather premature to declare the war a failure after less than a week, don't you think?
But never premature to hope for a failure eh?

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Old 03-23-2003, 09:14 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally posted by Scarletwine

Wake up America, what did you expect? Are you so naive the think they wouldn't resist.

Actually, no I expect them to resist.....

However, I do as a former soldier expect that if people are saying they are going to surrender, that they do.

Instead, we get fake surrenders.....and more less than honorable behavior from our enemies.

So now, we can sit and wait for the inevitable because of these incidents, actual people surrendering getting killed because of the incidents today.

As to the numbers of casualties. We have as of today dropped more ordinance that in the entire Gulf War. Amazing that we have not heard more about civilian casulaties.
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Old 03-24-2003, 11:19 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally posted by Scarletwine
It is war. Are we not bombing "shock & awe" on their cities? How many have we killed. I haven't heard one estimate.

Wake up America, what did you expect? Are you so naive the think they wouldn't resist.

Take your blinders off. Have you seen the anti-American protests around the world. especially in Moslem countries?
It is coming true what the anti-unilateralist said.
If you are in any way validating "fake surrenders" by the Iraqis, I find that an insult to the men and woman of the US and UK military who are conducting this military operation in a professional manner in accordance with all international rules of warfare. Fake surrenders put any Iraqi soldier wanting to surrender at greater risk.

The US could certainly conduct a military operation that would be less expensive and safer for US military personnel - it would, however, be at the expense of the Iraqi people. This is not happening.

Further, given the colorful twisting of facts by the Iraqi Minister of Information, I would not be surprised if civilian injuries were inflicted by Iraqi's for the television cameras.

Sorry, but this is a general vent. It is not directed at you Scarletwine.
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Old 03-24-2003, 11:47 AM   #9
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No one is validating anything. It's just a lot of us weren't as naive to think the resistance wasn't going to be this strong. I believe there was a sence of arrogance throughout the "pro-war" people thinking this was going to be a quick and easy take over that resulted in very little casualties.

These guys are the underdogs, they have to fight by any means neccesary. "There are no rules in love and war." This statement may not exactly be true technically speaking, but these are extreme times for the Iraqi people, from their stand point, and call for extreme measures. These type of tactics have happened througout the history of war.

It saddens me that this is happening, but I'm not surprised.
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Old 03-24-2003, 12:14 PM   #10
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Iraqis dont have the luxury of air strikes for their cowardly acts
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Old 03-24-2003, 12:29 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally posted by BonoVoxSupastar
No one is validating anything. It's just a lot of us weren't as naive to think the resistance wasn't going to be this strong. I believe there was a sence of arrogance throughout the "pro-war" people thinking this was going to be a quick and easy take over that resulted in very little casualties.

These guys are the underdogs, they have to fight by any means neccesary. "There are no rules in love and war." This statement may not exactly be true technically speaking, but these are extreme times for the Iraqi people, from their stand point, and call for extreme measures. These type of tactics have happened througout the history of war.

It saddens me that this is happening, but I'm not surprised.

Neither am I. It's war.
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Old 03-24-2003, 12:31 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally posted by BonoVoxSupastar
These guys are the underdogs, they have to fight by any means neccesary.
As odd or repugnant as this may sound to you, there are clear, long-standing rules of war. Even though lives are lost, the world society upholds a standard by which this is done.

Your "any means necessary" standard is a validation of the fake surrenders.
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Old 03-24-2003, 12:45 PM   #13
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fake surrenders is nothing new in war. as despicable as it is, i know for a fact it happened a lot during world war 2.

but yes, it is shameful. and to be honest, its only going to hurt the iraqi's because the americans will be (obviously) less trusting of them.
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Old 03-24-2003, 01:21 PM   #14
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Quote:
As odd or repugnant as this may sound to you, there are clear, long-standing rules of war. Even though lives are lost, the world society upholds a standard by which this is done.
Yes this is why I said "This statement may not exactly be true technically speaking"

Quote:
Your "any means necessary" standard is a validation of the fake surrenders.
No I understand why they are doing it, I don't validate their actions, but I can see why. I'm saying in their minds, I would think "any means necessary" would probably be the only way they believe they have a chance. This was done in the American Revolution as well.
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Old 03-24-2003, 02:58 PM   #15
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If this continues it will be very bad for the iraqis..because the US military will perhaps deny iraqis' the privilege of surrender.
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