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Old 10-19-2005, 05:14 PM   #46
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I admit it, I didn't know Sachs was behind that controversial "shock treatment" in Eastern Europe. It's true that that stuff hurt alot of people and was a mixed bag at best. While I still trust Bono is acting on his best intentions, Sachs is clearly no messiah.
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Old 10-19-2005, 05:19 PM   #47
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Originally posted by FatBratchney


This about sums it up for me.

WHY would Bono BYPASS 3rd World Grass Roots leaders?
WHY would he not consult with peasants in the guettoes of Lagos or Jakarta?
WHY would he not consult with peasants who chased President Sanchez out of Bolivia when he awarded preferential water utility consessions to Bretchel causing the price of RAIN WATER to blast beyond any reasonable expectation of bill payment?

Its beyond arrogance.
No. Arrogance would be if Bono expected that his star-power would actually change things by itself. Instead, he has met with peasants and 3rd world leaders AS WELL AS powerful heads of state which he might not otherwise meet with because he knows that, in this case, the combo of money AND legitimate political power is all that can remedy this situation. I think it takes guts on Bono's part to humble down from his White House phone-call days and realize that, for this fight, he needs those people. And I'm not defending or promoting Sachs - I'm speaking in general terms. Sachs has certainly been a questionable figure, but there's no way to know what will happen in both positive and negative ways regarding his potential involvement with Africa. We'll have to wait and see.

Arrogance is also calling a message board full of 20s, 30s, and 40somethings 'teens.'
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Old 10-19-2005, 08:20 PM   #48
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Originally posted by FatBratchney


This about sums it up for me.

WHY would Bono BYPASS 3rd World Grass Roots leaders?
WHY would he not consult with peasants in the guettoes of Lagos or Jakarta?
WHY would he not consult with peasants who chased President Sanchez out of Bolivia when he awarded preferential water utility consessions to Bretchel causing the price of RAIN WATER to blast beyond any reasonable expectation of bill payment?

Its beyond arrogance.
To question this arrogance is ,apparently, enough to insult the sensibilties of these loyal U2 fans who are more indignant about my message board demeanor than they are of Bono's patronizing (by a Sachs endorsed proxy)dismissal of an "education" in social political realities at the grass roots.

I over estimated the maturity level of...chuckle...u2 fans.


My mistake.
I take it since you registered to become a member of this site that you are also a U2 fan, correct?
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Old 10-19-2005, 09:15 PM   #49
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No. Arrogance would be if Bono expected that his star-power would actually change things by itself. Instead, he has met with peasants and 3rd world leaders AS WELL AS powerful heads of state which he might not otherwise meet with because he knows that, in this case, the combo of money AND legitimate political power is all that can remedy this situation. I think it takes guts on Bono's part to humble down from his White House phone-call days and realize that, for this fight, he needs those people. And I'm not defending or promoting Sachs - I'm speaking in general terms. Sachs has certainly been a questionable figure, but there's no way to know what will happen in both positive and negative ways regarding his potential involvement with Africa. We'll have to wait and see.

Arrogance is also calling a message board full of 20s, 30s, and 40somethings 'teens.'
Very true. Hell, I've been a fan for 20+ years. Of course Bono is working with Sachs. He's working with Bush. He's got to work with the big shots. These are the people with their hands on the pursestrings and the minds of academia and politicians. We're not talking about saints or saviors here. If we were we could just throw in the towel, and that would be the ultimate crime against the people of Africa.
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Old 10-19-2005, 09:26 PM   #50
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Originally posted by BonoVoxSupastar


Please no facts, FatBrat is not interested in those.
AWESOME photo ops.

When is the Ribbon Cutting at the blessed FREE TRADE ZONE?

George Bush has also taken pictures with black people.....and?

I thought you were going to give me a "fact based critique".

I KNOW Sachs thinks Export Production Zones and eternal indentured servitude is THE ONLY Option for 3rd World countries.
Sachs doesn't approve of colored people thinking for themselves.
Heaven forbid underdeveloped nations simply dis-engaging from the western economic aid formulas and forming their own internal trade alliances...oooh-no.

Gotta keep the gravy train going for us white people.


dang--I never expected this board to be so status quo bourgeois.
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Old 10-19-2005, 10:19 PM   #51
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Quote:
Originally posted by FatBratchney


AWESOME photo ops.

When is the Ribbon Cutting at the blessed FREE TRADE ZONE?

George Bush has also taken pictures with black people.....and?

I thought you were going to give me a "fact based critique".

I KNOW Sachs thinks Export Production Zones and eternal indentured servitude is THE ONLY Option for 3rd World countries.
Sachs doesn't approve of colored people thinking for themselves.
Heaven forbid underdeveloped nations simply dis-engaging from the western economic aid formulas and forming their own internal trade alliances...oooh-no.

Gotta keep the gravy train going for us white people.


dang--I never expected this board to be so status quo bourgeois.
welcome man. i can appreciate your view point. i really can. in fact, i probably share feelings with a good bit of what you've said. one thing i'd like to say though is that it's nice to see an opinion here other than the democratic party line so try and keep it cool. would hate to see you go as fast as you showed up.
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Old 10-19-2005, 11:21 PM   #52
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Quote:
Originally posted by FatBratchney


When is the Ribbon Cutting at the blessed FREE TRADE ZONE?

George Bush has also taken pictures with black people.....and?

I thought you were going to give me a "fact based critique".

I KNOW Sachs thinks Export Production Zones and eternal indentured servitude is THE ONLY Option for 3rd World countries.
Sachs doesn't approve of colored people thinking for themselves.
Heaven forbid underdeveloped nations simply dis-engaging from the western economic aid formulas and forming their own internal trade alliances...oooh-no.

Gotta keep the gravy train going for us white people.


dang--I never expected this board to be so status quo bourgeois.
And....what exactly does any of this have to do with Bono?
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Old 10-19-2005, 11:33 PM   #53
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I'm absolutely certain I will be rebuked by some University Student with a "facts based critique" and some BonoPhoto ops for good measure.

Honestly-I did not expect such wasp mentalities in this day and age and on a THIS message board replete with the OLD -"critical thinking" schtick that is so common among smug caucasian university students/graduates.

I remember about 10 years ago-a friend of mine in some Liberal Arts course used to superciliously deride my rejection of EPZ economics (4example).
She used to smile at me and,with a condescending tone,explain to me as if it were a revelation,that if the peasants of the Philippines didn't have the "opportunity" of working in a medieval sweat shop or a rubber mine -making 3 cents a day--we'd be depriving them of a "livelyhood"....ppppff

I guess she thought that her PoliSci Professors ideological bias was UNimpeachable.
It sickened me to know that people were so utterly susceptable to naked indoctrination.

I can just see these arrogant fools--300 hundred years ago--justifying black slavery.
"heavens !-who will tend the fields and pick the cotton?"


uugh



I will be anticipating a "fact based" rationalization of neo-liberal (or some new variation of) SLAVERY.



Bravo Bono!!

Keep up the good work.
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Old 10-19-2005, 11:40 PM   #54
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i took liberal arts courses on marxism. i'm not sure where your friend went to college.
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Old 10-19-2005, 11:44 PM   #55
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Rubber mines?
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Old 10-20-2005, 12:01 AM   #56
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Originally posted by FatBratchney
I'm absolutely certain I will be rebuked by some University Student with a "facts based critique" and some BonoPhoto ops for good measure.

Honestly-I did not expect such wasp mentalities in this day and age and on a THIS message board replete with the OLD -"critical thinking" schtick that is so common among smug caucasian university students/graduates.

I remember about 10 years ago-a friend of mine in some Liberal Arts course used to superciliously deride my rejection of EPZ economics (4example).
She used to smile at me and,with a condescending tone,explain to me as if it were a revelation,that if the peasants of the Philippines didn't have the "opportunity" of working in a medieval sweat shop or a rubber mine -making 3 cents a day--we'd be depriving them of a "livelyhood"....ppppff

I guess she thought that her PoliSci Professors ideological bias was UNimpeachable.
It sickened me to know that people were so utterly susceptable to naked indoctrination.

I can just see these arrogant fools--300 hundred years ago--justifying black slavery.
"heavens !-who will tend the fields and pick the cotton?"


uugh



I will be anticipating a "fact based" rationalization of neo-liberal (or some new variation of) SLAVERY.



Bravo Bono!!

Keep up the good work.

oooooo, you use such big words!








Yeah....I'm sure Bono condones slavery....that's why he has the Bill of Rights scrolling across the screens every night.....

what exactly is your point again?.....
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Old 10-20-2005, 12:06 AM   #57
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Well since you throw accusations, you speak in assumptions, and haven't refuted one fucking thing, why don't you explain what should be done.

Enlighten us FatBratchney.

Please.
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Old 10-20-2005, 04:01 AM   #58
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Originally posted by A_Wanderer
Rubber mines?
You know, exploding condoms. There's no market for them though...that's why the pay is only 3c.

Ppppffffffff indeed!


Sorry BVS, I'm not helping you here at all, am I?
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Old 10-20-2005, 08:33 AM   #59
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I'd love to know which Senator it was who said that



Bono Discusses the World's Poor With Bush

By NEDRA PICKLER, Associated Press Writer

Before getting on stage before his fans in a Wednesday night concert, U2 frontman Bono bent President Bush's ear about the world's poor.

The rock star and the president had lunch in the private dining room off the Oval Office, ordering from the menu at the same mess hall where White House staffers get their lunch. Bush, dressed in the classic presidential uniform of suit and red tie, also showed Bono, dressed in his trademark black jeans and sunglasses, around the Oval Office.

Bono told Rolling Stone magazine in an interview before they dined that he had no fear of meeting Bush or any other world leader.

"They should be afraid, because they will be held accountable for what happened on their watch," Bono told the magazine for an article on newsstands Friday. "I'm representing the poorest and the most vulnerable people. On a spiritual level, I have that with me. I'm throwing a punch, and the fist belongs to people who can't be in the room, whose rage, whose anger, whose hurt I represent.

"The moral force is way beyond mine, it's an argument that has much more weight than I have. So I'm not feeling nervous."

Over an hour and 40 minute meeting, Bono and Bush discussed debt relief, AIDS, malaria and world trade, said presidential spokesman Scott McClellan. McClellan said they also talked about the concerts that U2 was preparing to put on at Washington's MCI Center Wednesday and Thursday night.

In the Rolling Stone interview, Bono heaped praise on Bush for providing $15 billion to help fight AIDS in Africa, money that is helping pay for anti-retroviral drugs. He said he was disappointed that Bush and Congress had cut the Millennium Challenge program that gives foreign aid to countries that pursue political, economic and human rights reforms, but he'll keep pushing them to fund the full amount that the president promised.

Bono said he is "capable of having a row" if he doesn't get what he wants. He said he once criticized Bush for not getting the Millennium Challenge money out quick enough and was rebuked for it.

"One senator threw a newspaper at me in a meeting. 'How dare you disrespect the president of the United States!'" Bono told the magazine.

Bono said he doesn't support any president from the left or the right, but he has a hard time criticizing Bush after he has sent the money to Africa. He said he's made it clear that he doesn't support the war in Iraq, but he doesn't campaign against it because his main priority is helping the poor and disadvantaged.

"I work for them," Bono said. "If me not shooting my mouth off about the war in Iraq is the price I pay, then I'm prepared to pay it."

But, he added, "I'm a big-mouthed Irish rock star. Of course it frustrates me."

photo op..

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