The dark side of the rainbow....

[redhotswami]

You didn't say "we all"?

Then what is this?

"And we all thought you were making one which you apparently did not intend to make."

I can't read.

My apologies, I thought you were referring to my first sentence.

 

[80sU2isBest]

I can't read.

My apologies, I thought you were referring to my first sentence.

No apology necessary. I'm just glad you wrote this post: now I don't have to go buy a new pair of glasses.

 

[redhotswami]

No apology necessary. I'm just glad you wrote this post: now I don't have to go buy a new pair of glasses.

The funny thing is...I did over the weekend. I should get a refund

 

[80sU2isBest]

The funny thing is...I did over the weekend. I should get a refund

That's okay. I've had to beat myself over the head with a rolling pin before - times when I swore I didn't say something and someone posts it for me. I figure this probably happens to everyone at some point or another.

 

[Varitek]

^ I always thought that was an angry waving a stick at someone icon, but your post is funny.

 

[80sU2isBest]

^ I always thought that was an angry waving a stick at someone icon, but your post is funny.

I actually think you're right about what kind of icon that is, but I've had to beat myself over the head with a rolling pin so many times that I identify with that.

 

[martha]

Though, isn't that the same God as Martha's?

Nope.

 

[Ormus]

What's with the dual-identity, Melon? (I can't wait for Melon and Ormus to get into it.)

No duplicitous reasons or anything. Melon's next post just happens to be #10,000, and I want to write something fairly....monumental for it. Since it took me over six years to reach 10,000 posts, logic dictates that I may never reach 20,000. But who knows. I never thought I'd reach 10,000 either.

Funny that you mention Melon and Ormus "getting into it." Many years ago, I threatened to argue with myself, where one side of me would be "liberal" and the other "conservative." Maybe I'll do that someday. It's quite a good mental exercise.

 

[Ormus]

This statement shames the millions of Muslims, Jews and Christians around the world (and in Jerusalem) who are gay or who are not offended by gay people.

I must say, I quite enjoyed reading your arguments.

Hope you stick around FYM more often!

 

[nathan1977]

No duplicitous reasons or anything. Melon's next post just happens to be #10,000, and I want to write something fairly....monumental for it. Since it took me over six years to reach 10,000 posts, logic dictates that I may never reach 20,000. But who knows. I never thought I'd reach 10,000 either.

Why does logic dictate you won't make it to 20K? Are you going to die or something?

Funny that you mention Melon and Ormus "getting into it." Many years ago, I threatened to argue with myself, where one side of me would be "liberal" and the other "conservative." Maybe I'll do that someday. It's quite a good mental exercise.

Like playing chess with yourself. I used to do that when I was a teenager, but I eventually gave up. It hurt too much.

Back to your regularly scheduled thread.

 

[Ormus]

Why does logic dictate you won't make it to 20K? Are you going to die or something?

As I get older, I expect I'll have increasingly less time to write here, in conjunction with increasing responsibility. If it took me six years to approach 10,000 posts, I imagine that it would take another 10 or more to do it again...heh.

 

[redhotswami]

As I get older, I expect I'll have increasingly less time to write here, in conjunction with increasing responsibility. If it took me six years to approach 10,000 posts, I imagine that it would take another 10 or more to do it again...heh.

um....does your avatar move? or am i going crazy???

 

[Ormus]

um....does your avatar move? or am i going crazy???

Well, just to make sure, I checked and it's a JPEG file, not a GIF file (meaning that it could have been a very subtle animated GIF that I hadn't noticed before). However, with it being a JPEG file, that means that it can't move.

 

[redhotswami]

Well, just to make sure, I checked and it's a JPEG file, not a GIF file (meaning that it could have been a very subtle animated GIF that I hadn't noticed before). However, with it being a JPEG file, that means that it can't move.

now i'm concerned...i also just typed "suitcase" when i meant to type "tshirt" in an instant message.

i'm not kidding, i'm pretty certain i saw the dude shake for just a second.

 

[A_Wanderer]

I think you are all overlooking that this opposition is a good thing, bridging the divide between Muslim and Jew

Jews and Muslims in Jerusalem have found common ground in their fierce opposition to a gay rights rally due to be held in the city this week.

Leaders from both faiths have united to denounce the parade, which has prompted nights of street protest by ultra-orthodox Jews, who regard homosexuality as an "abomination", and death threats against those taking part.

After Israeli police found and defused a bomb bearing the message "sodomites out", orders were given for 12,000 officers to deploy across Jerusalem during the march, which is planned for Friday. Last night, lawyers from both sides were wrangling at the High Court over whether the parade should be allowed to take place and, if so, where. With the court expected to convene another hearing today, it appeared that the parade would take place but at a new location near the parliament, a safe distance from orthodox neighbourhoods.

The city's Islamic leadership is opposed to the parade, with Tayseer Tamimi, the head of the Palestinian supreme council of Sharia litigation, leading Muslim opposition. "This march tries to destroy the moral and spiritual values for youths," he said. "All religions discredit gays because it is against the decent human nature created by God."

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2006/11/07/wisrael07.xml

I remain adament that when believers start getting along then something very wrong will be done to the unbelievers.

 

[redhotswami]

I think you are all overlooking that this opposition is a good thing, bridging the divide between Muslim and Jewhttp://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2006/11/07/wisrael07.xml

I remain adament that when believers start getting along then something very wrong will be done to the unbelievers.

So the Muslims & Jews shared a common interest on this matter, and joined so they can dominate over the homosexual community? So now does this mean that some groups may unite, but regardless there will always be class struggle?

Ugh...I'm not a big fan of Marxism, but it kinda sounds like his theory to me....but this time with division among cultures instead of economic classes, doesn't it?

 

[A_Wanderer]

I think it has more to do with commonality between religious bigots than class struggle; religions themselves prove the best case against them.

 

[redhotswami]

I think it has more to do with commonality between religious bigots than class struggle; religions themselves prove the best case against them.

Hehe, true true...but I just can't help but think that this means that whereever we are, no matter how far we have evolved as a society, there will always be a struggle. Groups can unite, but they will be uniting solely to prevent another group from overcoming discrimination and injustice.

That's why I don't like Marx...b/c it makes history, present, AND future seem so bleak and depressing. How can there be hope if a theory like that proves true throughout time? It's like 'oh, well we decided it is wrong to discriminate against group a....so now we're friends. But now it is time to discriminate against group b.'

 

[Ormus]

Personally, I have no problem with gay pride parades anywhere, however I think the decision to hold it in such a unique city as Jerusalem was in poor taste, to say the least. I think the organizers should have taken the feelings of the religious communities into account and move the parade elsewhere, in the interest of public safety.

The Jewish sect most responsible for the violence involving this parade has some other quite "interesting" stances:

http://www.365gay.com/Newscon06/12/121306iran.htm

Extremist Jewish Sect Opposed To Gays Embraces Iran Anti-Holocaust Conference
by 365Gay.com Newscenter Staff

Posted: December 14, 2006 12:01 am ET

(Jerusalem) Members of an ultra Orthodox Jewish sect that staged nightly riots last month in Jerusalem to pressure the government into canceling a gay pride march were front and center this week at an Iranian government forum sitting side by side with holocaust deniers.

The Haredi believe only in the strict interpretation of the Bible, dispute the authority of the Israeli government and disavow Zionism as anti-Jewish.

This week leaders and members of the sect flew to Tehran to take part in the holocaust conference set up by Iranian president Mahmoud Ahmadinejad who claims that the holocaust is a Zionist invention.

The Haredi delegation was given seats in the front row where the group with its traditional hats and long beards could not be missed by TV cameras. The group applauded when Ahmadinejad declared that Israel will one day be "wiped out" as the Soviet Union was.

The conference drew holocaust deniers from around the world, including former KKK leader David Duke.

A Haredi spokesperson in Jerusalem defended the group's participation in the conference.

"They wanted to make it clear in Tehran that Zionism uses the Holocaust as an excuse for the existence of the Zionist state in the Land of Israel," said Israel Hirsch.

When Jerusalem's LGBT community Center Open House announced plans for a gay pride parade last month conservative wings of the major world religions denounced the parade but the Haredi turned violent.

For a week members of the sect took to the streets nightly, overturning garbage cans and setting them on fire. More than a dozen people were injured and the sect warned that if the parade went forward there would be bloodshed.

In the end the march was scrapped because of unrest in Gaza. Instead of a parade gays rallied at Hebrew University's sports stadium. Still there was a high police presence and several members of the sect were arrested trying to enter the area.

Last year members of the Haredi sect lined streets and threw bottles, stones and bags containing feces at gay marchers. One young Haredi member, Shai Schlissel, rushed into the marchers on Ben Yehuda Street stabbing a man and a woman.

Others in the parade attempted to subdue him. The third victim was a marcher who went to the aid of the other two victims.

Schlissel is in prison for the attack.

Knowing this, should Israel's gay community have cowered to a fanatical group like this? The funny thing is that Haredi not only hates the thought of gay people in Jerusalem, but also seems to hate the thought of Israelis in Jerusalem.

 

[yolland]

Yes, specifically those were the Neturei Karta, who AchtungBono mentioned in her post about that conference. Haredim is an inappropriate term in this case; that is not a "sect," but rather a general synonym for what we might call ultra-Orthodox Jews, which encompasses everything from truly creepy fundies like the NK to the Hasidim to various apolitical sects who live in insular communities and practice a very traditional Orthodox lifestyle. Not all haredim are anti-Zionist by any means; it's probably safe to say that few if any are gay-friendly, though only certain sects get political about it. All the rabbis who attended Ahmadinejad's conference were NK; I'm not sure if they were the only sect involved in the parade protests or not, though from what I've read the protest tactics do sound like classic NK. (I checked their website, and they have stories up bragging about their participation in both.) My guess is there were probably some other extremist-leaning haredim involved in the rioting, but I don't really know.

Basically the NK are like a Jewish equivalent of Westboro Baptist Church, only unfortunately with a good few thousand members and much better political organization. For the most part they aren't Holocaust deniers per se, however, they do regard the Holocaust as deserved, divinely mandated punishment and consider its relationship to Zionism one more strike against the latter, which they already see as a profane, heretical secular ideology (because it does not involve waiting for the Messiah). There were some NK in the area of Brooklyn we used to live in, and I remember them holding "counterdemonstrations" (for lack of a better word) on Holocaust Remembrance Day to highlight the aforementioned schtick...that went over real well with the neighbors.

 

[verte76]

I don't see why they can't have the march in Jerusalem. The rioters are the people who should be called on the carpet, not the gay pride people. They only want to have a march.