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Old 02-11-2008, 11:40 PM   #76
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Great speech, but it does take the whole listen, because otherwise it will be ripped to shreads.

But his point about the sermon on the mount and the defense department was awesome...
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Old 02-12-2008, 08:46 AM   #77
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skepticism about Obama's ability to lead the country because he has overly fervent supporters and because he happens to have a talent for speechmaking is also, equally shallow.
no one is questioning his ability to lead based on his star crazed supporters. a few years ago Obama was a member of the IL state legislature. he has limited experience and his speeches continue to be composed of mostly grandiose platitudes with little explanation of how he'll implement policy. if it weren't for his rockstar persona, he'd have been out of the race a long time ago.
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Old 02-12-2008, 10:11 AM   #78
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I kind of wonder as well what exactly Obama is going to do if he gets in office. Will there really be change?

Do we honestly believe that any politic can make a difference? I guess I've given up hope over the past 10 years with Washington.

I will agree that he'll probably be better than Dubya. And that is a good enough change.

Anyone has to be better right???
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Old 02-12-2008, 11:29 AM   #79
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Quote:
Originally posted by MaxFisher


no one is questioning his ability to lead based on his star crazed supporters. a few years ago Obama was a member of the IL state legislature. he has limited experience and his speeches continue to be composed of mostly grandiose platitudes with little explanation of how he'll implement policy. if it weren't for his rockstar persona, he'd have been out of the race a long time ago.
Actually, I've found that he has been willing to explain how he'll implement policy in several of the debates. I think the danger is that people see him give speeches filled with inspiration and hope, and then gloss over his other speeches where he does go more in depth because they think inspiring rhetoric is the only thing he's bringing to the table. And they're wrong.
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Old 02-12-2008, 11:35 AM   #80
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http://www.news24.com/News24/World/N...269063,00.html

Women 'falling for Obama'

College Park, Maryland - You can see it in their flushed-face smiles and hear it in their screams. They say the phenomenon is difficult to describe, but once they experience it they tell their friends, sisters, mothers and daughters, and they come back for more if they can.

"He's very charismatic. It was a 'you-had-to-be-there' kind of experience," said Lolita Breckenridge, 37, after hearing Democratic White House hopeful Barack Obama address a packed rally at the University of Maryland on Monday.

A dedicated supporter, she brought two of her friends to hear the Illinois senator deliver one of his much-talked-about speeches.

"Not too much of the speech was new to me," she admitted. "But hearing him live..." she trailed off, shaking her head and grinning.

When Obama addressed the crowd of 16 000 on the eve of primaries which he is tipped to win in Maryland, Virginia and Washington, DC, he carried himself with his habitual worldly confidence, interspersed talk of foreign policy with recollections of his childhood and even poked political fun at his Republican adversaries.

He did not flinch when women screamed as he was in mid-sentence, and even broke off once to answer a female's cry of "I love you Obama!" with a reassuring: "I love you back."

The 46-year-old son of a white American mother and black Kenyan father repeated his platform of ending the war in Iraq, offering tuition credit for students and providing health care for all Americans, drawing repeated standing ovations during the hour-long rally.

In contrast to Obama's schedule which included a second arena-sized appearance in Baltimore on Monday, his rival Senator Hillary Clinton held a series of low key talks, including a guest lecture at the University of Virginia and a tour of a General Motors plant.

'Party Like a Barack Star'

The former first lady's discrete approach to voters in Washington and bordering states appeared to acknowledge her likely defeat there, amid questions over her campaign's stability after a sudden shake-up saw her top advisor stepped aside.

With Obama surging after a series of key wins last week, supporters eager for a chance to see him in the flesh braved freezing temperatures and filed politely into a near interminable line that stretched all the way across campus.

Ahead of Obama's speech, hip-hop music blared across the sports arena and fans held up signs that read "Barack My World" and "Party Like a Barack Star". Afterward, supporters were eager to talk about the experience.

For Karen Ruffin, 42, hearing him speak of his hope for the country was "inspiring, full of hope and phenomenal".

She said she felt some pangs of regret for not supporting Clinton, who early on was tipped to gain the women's vote.

"I was undecided in the beginning but after hearing a few speeches I gradually moved toward him," Ruffin said.

Her friend Tyra Simpkins, 37, said she has always rooted for Obama.

"I think he has a lot of momentum and I'm really excited about his health care plan, I know he's going to do a lot of great things for people with disabilities," said Simpkins, who suffers from multiple sclerosis.

'My grandparents like Hillary...'

His speech "made me glad to be an American again".

Obama, who has been endorsed by Massachusetts Senator Ted Kennedy, brother of the late John and Robert Kennedy, often quotes the famous family in his speeches and did so again on Monday.

"John F Kennedy said we can never negotiate out of fear, but we can never fear to negotiate," Obama said, vowing to shut down the US prison at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba, end the war in Iraq as well as "the mindset that got us into war".

For student Rachel Niederer, 21, it was Obama's way with words that swayed her to his side.

"I love listening to his speeches," she said.

Asked if she had any university friends who were backing Clinton, she answered: "My grandparents like Hillary. I don't know anyone (my age) who does."

Retired Washington native Marty Lallis, 61, said Obama reminded her of Robert Kennedy, who was assassinated in 1968, five years after his brother and the same year as Dr Martin Luther King, Jnr was gunned down.

"I was just as excited by Robert F Kennedy when I was a teenager. I feel the same excitement for Obama. Maybe a little bit more because I am more mature," she said.

"Every time I hear him speak I become more hopeful and more sure that he would be the best president we could have," she said. "He makes you feel like he's talking to you especially."
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Old 02-12-2008, 11:39 AM   #81
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I agree with Diemen. Also, it's virtually impossible for a candidate to spell out all their positions and policies in a 90 minute debate that we see. As for speeches, we usually see soundbites that the media thinks are guaranteed to garner the most attention, which will lead to bigger ratings. That's all they care about. The biggest problem is that we've become so lazy that we don't want to have to think or do anything for ourselves. It's up to us to find out what these politicians stand for, and the Internet has made that much easier than it was even a decade ago. All the candidates have websites, and they all have extensive policy ideas as far as I know. That's where I first learned about Obama and what helped me decide that he has the ideas and knowledge necessary to lead our country.
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Old 02-12-2008, 09:08 PM   #82
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Quote:
Originally posted by MaxFisher


no one is questioning his ability to lead based on his star crazed supporters. a few years ago Obama was a member of the IL state legislature. he has limited experience and his speeches continue to be composed of mostly grandiose platitudes with little explanation of how he'll implement policy. if it weren't for his rockstar persona, he'd have been out of the race a long time ago.
Did you notice how during the California debates he responded to all of the questions with more grandiose platitudes about "change" and "hope"?

Neither did I.

Obama has provided plenty of substance in his speeches, but they don't sound as good on TV.

Give me an example of a policy that Clinton has explained how she'll implement in a way that Obama has failed to do. Because, at least with the health care plans both are promoting NEITHER candidate has done a very good job of explaining how they'll plausibly pay for their programs. Politicians are always ambitions in their plans but reality will hamper what they can actually accomplish. And that's equally true for both Clinton and Obama.

We had a little thread going comparing his and Hillary's health care plans (now buried on page 2). Which plan is better, in your opinion?
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Old 02-12-2008, 09:14 PM   #83
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Originally posted by maycocksean

Because, at least with the health care plans both are promoting NEITHER candidate has done a very good job of explaining how they'll plausibly pay for their programs.
Actually I don't think that's true.

I've certainly heard them both explain it to a reasonably good degree. Her plan is something like $50ish billion more, which means she can't finance it with simply rolling back the Bush tax cuts. She's somewhat vague about how she's going to come up with the extra money. I do believe Obama can cover his program simply through the tax roll back.
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Old 02-12-2008, 11:24 PM   #84
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I've certainly heard them both explain it to a reasonably good degree. Her plan is something like $50ish billion more, which means she can't finance it with simply rolling back the Bush tax cuts. She's somewhat vague about how she's going to come up with the extra money. I do believe Obama can cover his program simply through the tax roll back.
Fair enough. I guess it's more accurate to say that I am skeptical about the plans they have for covering the costs of such a large extension government-funded health care.
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Old 02-13-2008, 11:15 AM   #85
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Newsbusters

During MSNBC's live coverage of Tuesday's presidential primary elections, after the speeches of Barack Obama and John McCain had aired, Chris Matthews expressed his latest over the top admiration for Obama's speaking skills as the MSNBC anchor admitted that Obama's speech created a "thrill" in his leg: "It's part of reporting this case, this election, the feeling most people get when they hear Barack Obama's speech. My, I felt this thrill going up my leg. I mean, I don't have that too often." Minutes later, Brian Williams poked fun at Matthews' confession: "Let's talk about that feeling Chris gets up his leg when Obama talks ... That seems to be the headline of this half hour."
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Old 02-13-2008, 11:39 AM   #86
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Newsbusters

During MSNBC's live coverage of Tuesday's presidential primary elections, after the speeches of Barack Obama and John McCain had aired, Chris Matthews expressed his latest over the top admiration for Obama's speaking skills as the MSNBC anchor admitted that Obama's speech created a "thrill" in his leg: "It's part of reporting this case, this election, the feeling most people get when they hear Barack Obama's speech. My, I felt this thrill going up my leg. I mean, I don't have that too often." Minutes later, Brian Williams poked fun at Matthews' confession: "Let's talk about that feeling Chris gets up his leg when Obama talks ... That seems to be the headline of this half hour."

I loved that! When Chris Matthews said that bit about the thrill up his leg my friend and I turned to each other like

And then when Brian Williams came on and said that I burst out laughing.
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Old 02-13-2008, 11:43 AM   #87
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I believe he hasn't had that too often

At least he didn't say the thrill was somewhere else though, although that would have been one of the greatest moments in tv history.
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Old 02-13-2008, 11:49 AM   #88
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My reaction was "Holy crap, Chris has a heart attack every time Obama speaks!"

But yes, if it had been somewhere else, that would have been different
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Old 02-13-2008, 11:52 AM   #89
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I was watching last night when that happened and immediately thought of Laura when Brian Williams came back with his little comment.
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Old 02-13-2008, 01:09 PM   #90
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Quote:
Originally posted by maycocksean
Give me an example of a policy that Clinton has explained how she'll implement in a way that Obama has failed to do. Because, at least with the health care plans both are promoting NEITHER candidate has done a very good job of explaining how they'll plausibly pay for their programs. Politicians are always ambitions in their plans but reality will hamper what they can actually accomplish. And that's equally true for both Clinton and Obama.

We had a little thread going comparing his and Hillary's health care plans (now buried on page 2). Which plan is better, in your opinion?
Max isn't a Hillary supporter...
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