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Old 03-06-2004, 09:46 AM   #106
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Quote:
Originally posted by Dreadsox
Does anyone here believe as I do that science and math demonstrate the existence of God?
Yes, here and a large and growing number of PhD's.
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Old 03-06-2004, 10:02 AM   #107
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Quote:
Originally posted by Dreadsox
Does anyone here believe as I do that science and math demonstrate the existence of God?
Yes.
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Old 03-06-2004, 01:25 PM   #108
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Quote:
Originally posted by Dreadsox
Does anyone here believe as I do that science and math demonstrate the existence of God?
I do.

But what about those few who are taking some of the Bible literally? I've heard some say that nothing is impossible through God, yet Noah's Ark and certain stories would be impossible through the laws of science. So does it have to be one or the other? Does God always work through the laws of science, and if not does it negate science?
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Old 03-06-2004, 01:48 PM   #109
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Quote:
But what about those few who are taking some of the Bible literally?

This is the fault of their Pastors.


Are there not two creation stories?



Eve created from a rib of Adams.

Eve and Adam created from the mud (earth)?


not to mention, the earth created with the stars and sun revolving around it?



Faith and Science can coexist.


The 66 books are best looked at for guidance. The stories as examples of being righteous, charitable, there and many stories about redemption.

Jesus taught in parables, yet when a written guide is produce it is supposed to be factual. I do not remember Jesus teaching with many, or any factual stories.


How could the Creator have given a factual accounting of the earth. sun and stars relationships. That the earth is a sphere and you will not fall off the bottom because of an invisible force called Gravity.


Earlier peoples would not be able to grasp the concepts.


The creation story is a way of teaching.


The concept of Santa Clause is effective for children. Behave, mind your parents instructions and you receive gifts.

As adults we understand that correct behavior is its own reward and makes for a cohesive functional society.

As children we need little stories to guide us to proper behavior.


I believe the stories in the Book are necessary and beneficial for humanity. The factualness of them is less important than the concepts.
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Old 03-06-2004, 02:10 PM   #110
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Quote:
Originally posted by deep



This is the fault of their Pastors.


Are there not two creation stories?



Eve created from a rib of Adams.

Eve and Adam created from the mud (earth)?


not to mention, the earth created with the stars and sun revolving around it?



Faith and Science can coexist.


The 66 books are best looked at for guidance. The stories as examples of being righteous, charitable, there and many stories about redemption.

Jesus taught in parables, yet when a written guide is produce it is supposed to be factual. I do not remember Jesus teaching with many, or any factual stories.


How could the Creator have given a factual accounting of the earth. sun and stars relationships. That the earth is a sphere and you will not fall off the bottom because of an invisible force called Gravity.


Earlier peoples would not be able to grasp the concepts.


The creation story is a way of teaching.


The concept of Santa Clause is effective for children. Behave, mind your parents instructions and you receive gifts.

As adults we understand that correct behavior is its own reward and makes for a cohesive functional society.

As children we need little stories to guide us to proper behavior.


I believe the stories in the Book are necessary and beneficial for humanity. The factualness of them is less important than the concepts.
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Old 03-06-2004, 05:11 PM   #111
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Quote:
Originally posted by deep
This is the fault of their Pastors.


Are there not two creation stories?



Eve created from a rib of Adams.

Eve and Adam created from the mud (earth)?


not to mention, the earth created with the stars and sun revolving around it?
Where do you get such ideas? They are not based on the Bible.

Turning the Bible into a conceptual book is attractive because then there is no accountability and concepts can be redefined at personal whim.
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Old 03-06-2004, 05:25 PM   #112
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Quote:
Originally posted by nbcrusader
Turning the Bible into a conceptual book is attractive because then there is no accountability and concepts can be redefined at personal whim.
There it is again. The idea that anyone rejects the idea of the Bible being interpeted literally must be doing so out of unwillingness to follow its "commands."

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Old 03-06-2004, 05:31 PM   #113
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But there ARE two Creation stories in the Bible, and they ARE very different. In one, male and female are created at the same time, out of earth (adam in Hebrew, hence "Adam"); in the other, woman is made from the rib of the man, AFTER the creation of man and other animals.

Both cannot be true. So which is it? Or is it more likely that the two are both stories drawn from myths that were popular at the time to communicate the idea that God is responsible for creation, no matter how it might have happened?
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Old 03-06-2004, 05:44 PM   #114
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Genesis 2 tells of the creation of Adam and Eve.

Genesis 1:27 has the general statement: "So God created man in his own image, in the image of God he created him; male and female he created them."

So, where is the second creation story for male and female???
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Old 03-06-2004, 05:47 PM   #115
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Quote:
Originally posted by FizzingWhizzbees


There it is again. The idea that anyone rejects the idea of the Bible being interpeted literally must be doing so out of unwillingness to follow its "commands."

Thanks for putting words into my mouth. If you want clarification to my statement, please ask. You can always reject my statements if you reword them into your own.
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Old 03-06-2004, 05:49 PM   #116
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Okay then, could you clarify what you meant when you talked about "no accountability." I had interpreted that to mean you believed people avoided being accountable by the "commands" of the Bible. If I was wrong, what did you intend it to mean?
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Old 03-06-2004, 05:53 PM   #117
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Take a look at any law. If we take it as a law, and violate the law, we can be held accountable.

If we take it as a concept, can anyone ever say we violated the concept? This negates accountability.
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Old 03-06-2004, 06:07 PM   #118
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I don't understand the grounds on which you object to my argument then.

You said that to describe the bible as conceptual (ie not literal) means that people are not "accountable" to its commands. Correct?

To which I replied that I believe it's incorrect to suggest that this is the reason for people rejecting a literal interpretation of the Bible. It reminds me of a post earlier in this thread where it was suggested that people claim the Bible isn't to be interpreted literally so that they can ignore its "commands" with regard to stealing or lying.
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Old 03-06-2004, 06:35 PM   #119
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Should the Ten Commandments be taken literally or not?

My belief is that there are LITERAL truths to be found inside of the book. However, there are also parts that are impossible to be taken literally.
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Old 03-06-2004, 06:42 PM   #120
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Quote:
Originally posted by Dreadsox


My belief is that there are LITERAL truths to be found inside of the book. However, there are also parts that are impossible to be taken literally.
That about sums it up for me.
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