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Old 08-20-2005, 12:48 PM   #16
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Will somebody please show me just one drug free school? I went to an excellent public high school, one of the best in the nation...but drugs were everywhere. I saw people dealing in my latin class!
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Old 08-20-2005, 01:32 PM   #17
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Originally posted by FizzingWhizzbees


That seems a bit too much like a soundbite to me, and it's not necessarily true -- I'm sure there are plenty of young people whose parents have never touched drugs who choose to experiment with them while there are plenty of people whose parents use or have used drugs and yet will never engage in drug use.
I agree 100%
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Old 08-20-2005, 09:45 PM   #18
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Somehow I only see the drug condition getting worse in schools.
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Old 08-20-2005, 09:49 PM   #19
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Will somebody please show me just one drug free school? I went to an excellent public high school, one of the best in the nation...but drugs were everywhere. I saw people dealing in my latin class!
Sounds like some school. I suppose that when in Rome, do as the Romans do applied in the class?
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Old 08-20-2005, 11:13 PM   #20
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A drug free school is an oxymoron..like rock against drugs...A high school without "high" students doesnt exist. But then again, when you consider that most people are savages, maybe being high until you die isnt so bad.
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Old 08-21-2005, 07:57 AM   #21
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We're never going to have drug free parents or drug free schools. The only way that'd ever happen would be if drugs just disappeared from the planet.
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Old 08-22-2005, 09:22 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally posted by FizzingWhizzbees


That seems a bit too much like a soundbite to me, and it's not necessarily true -- I'm sure there are plenty of young people whose parents have never touched drugs who choose to experiment with them while there are plenty of people whose parents use or have used drugs and yet will never engage in drug use.
Kids learn to experiment from other kids who use drugs. And they learn to experient from their parents.

It is the sins of the parents the plague our children.
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Old 08-22-2005, 09:33 AM   #23
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Originally posted by nbcrusader


Kids learn to experiment from other kids who use drugs. And they learn to experient from their parents.

It is the sins of the parents the plague our children.


not totally sure about this ... i know plenty of kids who use drugs who have parents who never used drugs, who had been vocal and adamant about not using drugs, and still, the kids used drugs. and most of them are fine, but not all.

i think you might be more accurate if we broaden our understanding of "drugs" to include everything from Tylenol to Ritalin to Viagra. i think it's perfectly understandable for a kid growing up today, who's bombarded with drug company ads about heartburn and boner pills, to view drugs in all forms as really not all that big a deal. huge percentages of the population are on some sort of perscription drug of some sort, and many of these drugs have far worse side effects than many of your milder soft drugs like pot, mushrooms, or hash.

we're living in a quick-fix world, and that's not all bad. have a headache? tylenol. heartburn? zantac. can't sleep? ambien. depression? prozac. anxious? paxil.

why, then, should any kid listen to a parent who says, "don't smoke pot, but mommy needs her valium before bedtime."

again, i think we need to rethink what we understand when we say "drugs."
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Old 08-22-2005, 10:34 AM   #24
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Good point, Irvine .

Angela
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Old 08-22-2005, 11:30 AM   #25
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Quote:
Originally posted by nbcrusader
Kids learn to experiment from other kids who use drugs. And they learn to experient from their parents.

It is the sins of the parents the plague our children.
I just don't buy this. My parents have never used drugs, have never advocated drug use and yet, while not wanting to be too explicit about it, I'm sure my opinions on drugs have been made pretty clear from some of my posts in this forum.

I hate the idea that if a child has a problem, be it drug abuse, depression, doing badly in school or anything else it is automatically the parents fault - it's automatically due to the "sins of the parents." I'm sure there are plenty of cases, perhaps even the majority of cases, where a child's problems can be directly attributed to their parents' actions, but that isn't always the case. To imply that any problems a young person experiences are due to the "sins of the parents" is just wrong and is incredibly insulting to those parents who have done a fantastic job of raising their children but who were powerless to prevent their children experiencing problems out of their control.
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Old 08-22-2005, 11:31 AM   #26
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Quote:
Originally posted by Irvine511
why, then, should any kid listen to a parent who says, "don't smoke pot, but mommy needs her valium before bedtime."

again, i think we need to rethink what we understand when we say "drugs."
I'm having a Trainspotting moment...."one bottle of valium procured from my mother who is, in a socially acceptable way, also a drug addict." (Probably not an entirely accurate quote, but you know what I mean.)
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Old 08-22-2005, 12:04 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally posted by FizzingWhizzbees
I hate the idea that if a child has a problem, be it drug abuse, depression, doing badly in school or anything else it is automatically the parents fault - it's automatically due to the "sins of the parents." I'm sure there are plenty of cases, perhaps even the majority of cases, where a child's problems can be directly attributed to their parents' actions, but that isn't always the case. To imply that any problems a young person experiences are due to the "sins of the parents" is just wrong and is incredibly insulting to those parents who have done a fantastic job of raising their children but who were powerless to prevent their children experiencing problems out of their control.
Where do I say "it is automatically the parents fault"??

Also, if you would read my post closely, you would see that I am not blaming the parents who do a "fantastic job of raising their children". My focus was on the drug using parent who's influence expands beyond their own children to the children of the "fantastic" parents.

So please, before you berate someone as "incredibly insulting", read the posts to make sure what you imply is what is actually said.
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Old 08-22-2005, 12:08 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally posted by FizzingWhizzbees


I'm having a Trainspotting moment...."one bottle of valium procured from my mother who is, in a socially acceptable way, also a drug addict." (Probably not an entirely accurate quote, but you know what I mean.)


i wrote my senior thesis on _trainspotting_.

best book to ever not win the Booker.

the book and the movie are, in some ways, quite revolutionary in how they understand drugs. i like it when Renton says, paraphrased, "it's not all about death and crime and misery, which is not to be ignored; but what they forget is the pleasure of it, after all we're not stupid. at least we're not that fucking stupid."

what it does is it takes a vastly more mature look at why people do drugs, instead of relying on bullshit Nancy Reagan "just say no!" mindless garbage from the 1980s.

one main reason why i think people do drugs is because it does give you a release, an escape, a feeling of being connected to a slightly altered reality -- and it lets you know that how you understand and perceive the world is as much a chemical reaction as anything else, and if the composition of your brain were just a wee bit different, then we'd live in a much different world. i do think there's distinctions to be made as well -- there's experimentation, there's use, and there's abuse. and to sweep all this under the carpet for the sake of a 1980s "if you do drugs you'll get addicted and you'll steal from your mother and you'll eventually die in a gutter" scare tactics is, i think, actually making the problem worse.

you can't give people a compelling reason to say no, unless you're willing to address the allure, the mystery, the sexiness, and, let's face it, the pleasure in the first place. drugs feel good. for a while.

if anything i find the most compelling reason to say no (and please, don't take this as some kind of self-justification post ... i don't do drugs ... heck, i don't even take Sudafed) is becoming a participant in the utter failure we've called The War on Drugs.
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Old 08-22-2005, 12:09 PM   #29
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Originally posted by nbcrusader


Where do I say "it is automatically the parents fault"??

Also, if you would read my post closely, you would see that I am not blaming the parents who do a "fantastic job of raising their children". My focus was on the drug using parent who's influence expands beyond their own children to the children of the "fantastic" parents.

So please, before you berate someone as "incredibly insulting", read the posts to make sure what you imply is what is actually said.


how many parents do you know who do drugs?

i didn't know of a single parent of any of my close friends who used drugs. but some of their kids did.
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Old 08-22-2005, 12:10 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally posted by FizzingWhizzbees


I just don't buy this. My parents have never used drugs, have never advocated drug use and yet, while not wanting to be too explicit about it, I'm sure my opinions on drugs have been made pretty clear from some of my posts in this forum.

I hate the idea that if a child has a problem, be it drug abuse, depression, doing badly in school or anything else it is automatically the parents fault - it's automatically due to the "sins of the parents." I'm sure there are plenty of cases, perhaps even the majority of cases, where a child's problems can be directly attributed to their parents' actions, but that isn't always the case. To imply that any problems a young person experiences are due to the "sins of the parents" is just wrong and is incredibly insulting to those parents who have done a fantastic job of raising their children but who were powerless to prevent their children experiencing problems out of their control.
I agree. I also find the converse annoying: that when a child turns out great it's all the parents' doing.

To me in both cases the child is the one most responsible for his or her behaviour. The parent or parents can help (or hurt), but ultimately it is the child's, and only the child's, decisions that decide what type of person he or she is.
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