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Old 09-18-2006, 01:37 PM   #31
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Originally posted by BonoVoxSupastar


That's why I'm very careful of the things I advocate in life. Violence isn't one of them.
Be even more careful. You could be advocating for violence by doing nothing about it.
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Old 09-18-2006, 02:17 PM   #32
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You could be advocating for violence by doing nothing about it.
Don't mistake not advocating violence with advocating apathy or inaction.

Did Jesus advocate violence?
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Old 10-06-2006, 02:44 PM   #33
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Sailor Pleads Guilty in War Abuse Case

By THOMAS WATKINS
Associated Press, Oct 6 2006


A Navy corpsman testified at his court-martial Friday that he watched as Marines shot an Iraqi civilian in the head after taking him from his home in the town of Hamdania.

Petty Officer 3rd Class Melson J. Bacos, 21, said he saw two Marines fire at least 10 rounds into 52-year-old Hashim Ibrahim Awad.

Seven Marines and Bacos, a medic who had been on patrol with them that day, were charged in Awad's death. Bacos was the first to go to a court-martial. Friday morning, he pleaded guilty to kidnapping and conspiracy under a deal in which other charges were dropped and Bacos agreed to testify about what he saw.

Bacos testified that he asked the Marines to let Awad go, but he said Marine Cpl. Marshall L. Magincalda told him he was being weak and should stop protesting. "I witnessed Sgt. (Lawrence) Hutchins dead check the man and fire three rounds into the man's head," Bacos testified. "Then Cpl. (Trent) Thomas fired seven to 10 rounds in to the man's head."

In return for his testimony, other counts of murder, kidnapping and conspiracy against Bacos were to be dropped, his civilian lawyer said before Friday's proceedings. Bacos said "yes sir" when asked by Col. Steven Folsom, who presided over the hearing, if he agreed with the pleas.

According to charging documents, the troops had entered Hamdania on April 26th searching for an insurgent and, failing to find him, grabbed Awad from his home and shot him. An AK-47 and a shovel were left by Awad's body, apparently to make it look like the man had been digging a hole for a roadside bomb. Bacos was accused of firing the AK-47 into the air as part of the cover-up. Military prosecutors had charged him under the theory that he did nothing to stop the alleged crime.

All eight were charged with crimes including murder and kidnapping and were being held at Camp Pendleton. Bacos was recently transferred to Marine Corps Air Station Miramar for his own safety.

David Brahms, a defense attorney for one of the accused Marines, said Bacos will be subjected to intense cross-examination. "This is just one guy who is going to tell the story as he sees it," Brahms said.

Former Army prosecutor Tom Umberg suggested that others might follow Bacos' lead and strike similar plea deals. "You don't want to be the last guy standing. The first guy gets the best deal," he said.
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Old 10-06-2006, 02:56 PM   #34
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Originally posted by BonoVoxSupastar


Don't mistake not advocating violence with advocating apathy or inaction.

Did Jesus advocate violence?
Didn't Jesus use violence against the shop owners who were selling goods at the Temple?
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Old 10-06-2006, 03:10 PM   #35
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Didn't Jesus use violence against the shop owners who were selling goods at the Temple?
Anger and violence are two separate things. Don't confuse the two.
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Old 10-06-2006, 03:11 PM   #36
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But Anger can lead to Violence correct?
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Old 10-06-2006, 03:20 PM   #37
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But Anger can lead to Violence correct?
Yes, but you are missing the point. It didn't in the case you were talking about.
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Old 10-06-2006, 03:31 PM   #38
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I know but you brang up Jesus never causing violence.
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Old 10-06-2006, 03:36 PM   #39
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I know but you brang up Jesus never causing violence.
And he didn't what's your point?

You're confusing me.
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Old 10-06-2006, 03:43 PM   #40
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Jesus on that day when he say merchants selling items in the temple grounds got angry and flipped over tables and broke items? Unless thats completly false coming from the Bible and all.

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Jesus at the Temple
12Jesus entered the temple area and drove out all who were buying and selling there. He overturned the tables of the money changers and the benches of those selling doves. 13"It is written," he said to them, " 'My house will be called a house of prayer,'[e] but you are making it a 'den of robbers.'[f]"
http://bibleresources.bible.com/pass...+21&version=31
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Old 10-06-2006, 03:50 PM   #41
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Jesus on that day when he say merchants selling items in the temple grounds got angry and flipped over tables and broke items? Unless thats completly false coming from the Bible and all.



http://bibleresources.bible.com/pass...+21&version=31
Yes, I know the story. But unless you are saying Jesus advocates violence against tables, I still don't see your point.

There was anger, but where was he violent to anyone except a table?

Poor tables.
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Old 10-06-2006, 03:54 PM   #42
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Originally posted by BonoVoxSupastar


Yes, I know the story. But unless you are saying Jesus advocates violence against tables, I still don't see your point.

There was anger, but where was he violent to anyone except a table?

Poor tables.

HAHAHAHAHA I am refering to what you wrote.
Quote:
Did Jesus advocate violence?
In the case where I cut and pasted yes he did. He should have kept his cool. I guess Hippies have to loose that cool sometimes.
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Old 10-06-2006, 03:59 PM   #43
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HAHAHAHAHA I am refering to what you wrote.

In the case where I cut and pasted yes he did. He should have kept his cool. I guess Hippies have to loose that cool sometimes.
I think it was understood that when referring to violence, we were referring to violence against living things.

If he threw the table at someone, it would have been a different story.

I still believe there is a big difference between anger and violence.
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Old 10-06-2006, 04:04 PM   #44
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I agree they are two totally different things but they can merge to become one.
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