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Old 07-26-2004, 01:49 PM   #16
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Thanks, SherryDarling, for the link.

Congress' stance IS a first step to attending to this humanitarian crisis.

All we can do is to see if Congress will WALK THEIR TALK and find some way to sanction the government of Sudan.

Given the U.S.'s past performance on dealing with corrupt governments, I wish I could say that I'm optimistic that anything more than a declaration will come out of Congress.

But I'm always willing to be proven wrong on this one.
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Old 07-26-2004, 06:30 PM   #17
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Originally posted by Anthony
Well, we didn't do anything back then when it concerned Rwanda, and we sure aren't going to do much now when we're all too busy blowing up children in places where WMDs are supposedly hidden. But enough on that, God knows we've not only beaten that particular donkey to death, he's been cremated and his ashes have been sprinkled over the oil wells.

Rwanda was a tragedy then, when we were all more concerned with places like Kosovo, and it is now, when we're all writing reports on whether or not Iraq had WMDs - my point is we didn't know how to spend money wisely then, and we still don't know hot to spend money wisely now.

At the end of the day we've lost our presidents and prime-ministers to apathy, and thats only because we've let them.


Ant.

The coalition in Iraq is NOT busy blowing up childern. The Coalition in Iraq has been extremely busy over the past 16 months improving the lives of Iraqi citizens, something that would not be happening if the anti-war crowd had had their way back in March 2003.
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Old 07-27-2004, 06:12 AM   #18
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Yes, STING2, perhaps. My point however was that perhaps issues such as Africa were and still are more important for a number of issues, issues that we've all heard of before. Issues, that, especially after two reports (one English and one American) pretty much reach the conclusion that Iraq was not a palpable threat and that they did not, in fact, have WMDs, do seem more important for global security.

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Old 07-27-2004, 07:22 PM   #19
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Originally posted by Anthony
Yes, STING2, perhaps. My point however was that perhaps issues such as Africa were and still are more important for a number of issues, issues that we've all heard of before. Issues, that, especially after two reports (one English and one American) pretty much reach the conclusion that Iraq was not a palpable threat and that they did not, in fact, have WMDs, do seem more important for global security.

Ant.
To this day, it is a fact that Saddam failed to account for 1,000 Liters of Anthrax, 500 pounds of Mustard Gas, and over 20,000 Bio/Chem capable shells. It is also a fact that Dr. Kay and his team found over 300 items in Iraq that were related or could be involved in the production of WMD and were in total violation of resolution 1441. Above all, the United Nations required Saddam to VERIFIABLY DISARM of all WMD. No one in the United Nations has ever claimed that Saddam accomplished this and his failure to have done so is a violation of the 1991 Gulf War Ceacefire agreement which authorized renewed military action if Saddam was found to be in material breech of his obligations.

Issues in Africa are important, but not more important than issues that impact the entire planet such as ENERGY and the available supply of it which impacts everyone and the global economy. If the United States and Europe are unable to protect global security in this regard, there will be no money available to help out with vital issues in Africa.
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Old 07-27-2004, 08:52 PM   #20
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Originally posted by Sherry Darling
Good news, all, check it out! The US Congress has DONE THE RIGHT THING and called it genocide!

Cheryl

This is fantastic! I'm not feeling well so it's particularly pleasing to hear this!
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Old 07-29-2004, 07:39 AM   #21
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Originally posted by maude
Absolutely! That's why we need to all pipe up and make a big fuss about this. This is a vitally important issue and we need to make our leaders aware that we want something done about it.

Axver, your post on Livejournal is great. Thanks for the link. I hope everyone will read it.
Ever since I made that entry, Sudan really has become my passion and I'm devoting a good deal of my spare time to it. I don't really have time right now to get involved with this thread, but the latest statistics truly are tragic - over 50,000 dead, 1.2 million homeless, and there will be no crops until October 2005. There IS going to be a major famine and diseases are running rampant. This is a catastrophe, it could be Rwanda and Ethiopia all in one ... I truly cannot believe what I am seeing every day. We must make some noise and make our elected representatives know their jobs are on the line if they sit around and don't send help as soon as possible.
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Old 07-29-2004, 07:50 AM   #22
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Viva La France, proudly upholding whats right by warning against any action against the regime in Khartom in the name of Euro-Arab Unity and Big Oil Contracts. Im sure that when all the Africans are "pacified" there will be a lot of money in it for those who gave the moral support while the dirty work was going on. Watch in amazement as the UN Security Council sets up the perfect alibi by blaming the US for not crafting a piss weak but mutually agreeable resolution.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/3875277.stm
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Old 07-29-2004, 08:22 AM   #23
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A_Wanderer, that article from the BBC was already outdated the last time you posted it three weeks ago. Here's a recent article from the BBC.

Quote:
The BBC's Susannah Price at the UN says the US wants the Security Council to pass their resolution on Darfur unanimously to send the strongest possible signal to Khartoum that the violence must stop.

As the draft text currently stands, the resolution threatens unspecified sanctions against Sudan's government if it fails to carry out its promise to disarm the Janjaweed militia.

But seven council members - Pakistan, China, Russia, Algeria, Angola, the Philippines and Brazil - want the reference to sanctions to be removed because they believe Khartoum needs more time to act.

Diplomats said they believe the US may be prepared to do so. The US ambassador would not confirm or deny this but stated that it would have to be clear to the government of Sudan that non-compliance meant sanctions.
Nevertheless, the silence from European governments is deafening and shocking. Nobody seems to be prepared to send troops, even though the good news is that more money has been made available.
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Old 07-29-2004, 09:27 AM   #24
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Thank you, DrTeeth!

While most issues in this world are interconnected (economically/politically/socially), I really think that it is disrespectful and unfair to the EXTREME SERIOUSNESS of the humanitarian disaster in Darfur to bring in other people's agendas.

A_Wanderer, nothing personal, but your obsession with your one issue ("the Arabs") DO NOT BELONG IN THIS THREAD!

PLEASE RESPECT OUR SINCERE CONCERN FOR THE PEOPLE OF DARFUR AND KEEP OTHER ISSUES OUT OF THIS THREAD.

I'm sure the others posting here feel the same.
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Old 07-29-2004, 10:54 AM   #25
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pass their resolution on Darfur unanimously to send the strongest possible signal to Khartoum that the violence must stop
Did they use bold 14 pt. font?
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Old 07-29-2004, 06:26 PM   #26
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it is most certainly not my one issue, the influence of Arab governments in the Middle East and the relationships that Europe and the US try to maintain to them by buying their loyalty and reciprocating that with UN voting (France in Particular) is crutial to the way that this plays out.

Ask yourself this.

Which government supports the Janjaweed?

Which governments support the government that supports the Janjaweed?

It all leads back up to the same place and I guarantee you that petrodollars will clog up any attempt for serious UN actions and a lot of people will die, do not skirt the issues here in the name of political correctness because the fact is that Arabs are slaughtering Blacks with direct millitary support from the Sudanese government and they in turn recieve support from regimes in the region as well as countries such as France, China and Pakistan who have will make a good deal of money from Sudanese oil. Until these problems are resolved it wont matter how much aid we send because people will keep dying in great numbers.
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Old 07-31-2004, 06:02 PM   #27
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With the U.N. resolution which passed yesterday (and was weakened by pressure from the U.S.) for possible sanctions against the Sudanese government if they do not stop the inhumane and murderous actions of the Janjaweed militias within the next 30 days, I wanted to revive this thread.

I don't want us to forget about the People of Darfur....
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Old 07-31-2004, 10:31 PM   #28
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Jamila you have it all backwards, the US was the one that wanted to put the word sanctions in there but it had to weaken it on the demands by other nations, There is no direct threat of sanctions within that resolution because the US had to weaken it just to get it through the security council and unfortunately nations that have an interest in keeping the oil money and also have a veto will do their best to obfuscate any move towards a peacekeeping operation. Countries that opposed that were China and Pakistan (both of which have significant oil interests when the Africans are -in the words of the French FM- pacified internally.

I repeat the oil interests of these nations coupled with the Arab regimes in the region buying off votes in the name of pan-Arabism is the reason that this resolution wont stick and when push comes to shove there may not be a UN force in the country. This isn't about religion or Islamophobia, it is black Muslims being slaughtered by Arab militias with the support of an Arab government which recieves international support from Arab regimes, the Pakistanis, the Chinese and French.

Have I mentioned how much I dont like the way the UN handles genocides yet?
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Old 08-01-2004, 11:29 AM   #29
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A-wanderer, that's NOT what CNN and NPR (National Public Radio)reported. So I guess our media had it backwards.

But it's nice to know that there are people sitting half a world away who know more about the USA than we do here.

A_Wanderer, I repeat - YOU WILL TWIST ANY PIECE OF INFO AROUND TO CONSTANTLY BLAME EVRY PROBLEM IN THE WORLD ON THE GROUPS AND THE PEOPLE YOU DON'T LIKE.

GET OFF IT - the vast majority of people posting here are only concerned right now on the humanitarian aspect of this crisis, not on fronting their political point of view!

Keep the political posts for another thread ( you do enough of them!)
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Old 08-01-2004, 11:45 AM   #30
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I was greatly disappointed that the US pressured the resolution to not include sanctions.

I'd hope more would be done by now.
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