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Old 11-05-2008, 03:38 PM   #691
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I know, but those numbers did at least show that attitudes are changing. The constitution can and will be amended again.

I'm a little confused by those figures, as they contradict their own exit poll results:

white voters (63% of total) -- 49% yes, 51% no
black voters (10% of total) -- 70% yes, 30% no
Latino voters (18% of total) -- 53% yes, 47% no

White men actually voted 51% yes; it was white women's 53% no vote that tipped white voters against Prop 8. Black women, on the other hand, were actually more conservative than black men here, 75% yes to black men's roughly 60% yes. The Latino gender split more resembled the white one (men 54% yes, women 52% yes).

To some extent this reflects the already-known-to-pollsters tendency for gender issues to be more fraught in minority communities; what is rather surprising is the extent to which black women proved more conservative here than black men, as well as the fact that nonwhites earning over $50,000 were actually 5% more likely to vote yes than nonwhites earning under $50,000. Unfortunately, there were no breakdowns of racial minorities by religion, nor any breakdowns of African-American voters by age (Latinos under 30 did vote 59% no--again, there's something at least to take hope from).

So, yes, high minority turnout for Obama (African-Americans were 4% more of CA's electorate than in '04) may have been a decisive factor, despite Obama's own stated opposition to Prop 8.


It all depends on how you classify people.
I think it has less to do with the skin color,
and more to do with their mindset.

Fundamental religions believers are what pushed this over to passing.
and to the extent that they exist in Black and Latino communities, that is the reason we have those numbers.
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Old 11-05-2008, 03:39 PM   #692
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It really is amazing and disgusting how eager people are to take away the rights of others, in situations where their own well-being is completely unaffected.
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Old 11-05-2008, 03:41 PM   #693
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i'm actually not surprised that african-american women were more conservative than black men.

and it is, as you point out, all to do with far more fraught gender issues within minority communities.
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Old 11-05-2008, 03:42 PM   #694
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It really is amazing and disgusting how eager people are to take away the rights of others, in situations where their own well-being is completely unaffected.


what disgusts me is how the "Yes" crowd used children.

nothing hurts me more than the insinuation that i am, somehow, a threat to children.

nothing.
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Old 11-05-2008, 03:50 PM   #695
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So, let me get this straight.

Black women are the homophobes and bigots in this scenario?

In the universe of the far left, white men are bigots (and regularly described as such on this forum) and black women are the salt of the earth.

I am not happy at the vote, but permit me a wry chuckle at this finding.
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Old 11-05-2008, 03:51 PM   #696
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ok.
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Old 11-05-2008, 03:53 PM   #697
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So, let me get this straight.

Black women are the homophobes and bigots in this scenario?

In the universe of the far left, white men are bigots (and regularly described as such on this forum) and black women are the salt of the earth.

I am not happy at the vote, but permit me a wry chuckle at this finding.
You try to make things so concrete in the view of the "far left."
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Old 11-05-2008, 03:54 PM   #698
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i'm actually not surprised that african-american women were more conservative than black men.

and it is, as you point out, all to do with far more fraught gender issues within minority communities.
Are you thinking of high single motherhood rates basically?
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what disgusts me is how the "Yes" crowd used children.
The most disturbing prospect all this calls to mind for me is the gay or lesbian married couple with young children who may now have to explain to them, "Well, honey, me and your other mom/dad were married, but the people in our state held a vote about families like ours, and they decided we're not worthy of that like your friends' parents are."

Hideous.
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Old 11-05-2008, 03:54 PM   #699
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So, let me get this straight.

Black women are the homophobes and bigots in this scenario?
read my last post


is it the skin color? gender?

or the fundamental religious mindset?
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Old 11-05-2008, 03:59 PM   #700
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All the progressive-thinking black men were out voting for Obama.

Shouldn't have been done on the same day....in a few years a separate vote will likely not pass.
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Old 11-05-2008, 03:59 PM   #701
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So, let me get this straight.

Black women are the homophobes and bigots in this scenario?

In the universe of the far left, white men are bigots (and regularly described as such on this forum) and black women are the salt of the earth.

I am not happy at the vote, but permit me a wry chuckle at this finding.



care to toss out any more stereotypes of "the far left" you have in your mind?

i've called the black community and especially black churches out on their homophobia, and i've said that this is the primary reason why HIV is epidemic amongst gay black men.
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Old 11-05-2008, 04:01 PM   #702
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Are you thinking of high single motherhood rates basically?

no. first, it's church. second, it's the stereotype that all the "good" black men are either gay, or married to white women. i'm reminded of a mildly racist and homophobic joke that i don't feel comfortable typing here, but if you PM me, i'll tell it to you.

homosexuality is a convenient scapegoat for a host of social issues and problems.


Quote:
The most disturbing prospect all this calls to mind for me is the gay or lesbian married couple with young children who may now have to explain to them, "Well, honey, me and your other mom/dad were married, but the people in our state held a vote about families like ours, and they decided we're not worthy of that like your friends' parents are."

Hideous.

hideous?

i thought it was just complicated.
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Old 11-05-2008, 04:54 PM   #703
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In the universe of the far left, white men are bigots (and regularly described as such on this forum) and black women are the salt of the earth.
Just once I would love to see you try and back this up... You say this shit all the time, but I would just love to see you try and once put your "money" where your mouth is...

Maybe if you say it enough, it becomes true.
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Old 11-05-2008, 04:58 PM   #704
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Just once I would love to see you try and back this up... You say this shit all the time, but I would just love to see you try and once put your "money" where your mouth is...

Maybe if you say it enough, it becomes true.
Are you seriously suggesting you have never seen a post saying or implying white men are probably bigots on this forum?
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Old 11-05-2008, 05:00 PM   #705
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The most disturbing prospect all this calls to mind for me is the gay or lesbian married couple with young children who may now have to explain to them, "Well, honey, me and your other mom/dad were married, but the people in our state held a vote about families like ours, and they decided we're not worthy of that like your friends' parents are."

Hideous.
It's horrible. But the optimist in me see these kids as the ones who stand up and say "No more of this crap!" and then start really changing stuff.
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