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Old 10-29-2008, 06:47 PM   #466
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You do mean a Nov 4 ballot measure that would re-affirm the will of the citizens of California, right?

no, she means a proposition that would rip away rights from loving couples who happen to be a little bit different from you, nathan.

what other rights will you decree i should be entitled to? because what we always vote on are civil rights and we determine whether or not some people are worthy of full citizenship, and whether or not others aren't.
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Old 10-29-2008, 06:49 PM   #467
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I personally think that only Natives should have full citizenship. Everyone else should have to adhere to what we decide.
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Old 10-29-2008, 06:53 PM   #468
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I personally think that only Natives should have full citizenship. Everyone else should have to adhere to what we decide.


what's interesting is that most of the funding is coming from the Mormon Church (the same folks who killed the ERA in the 1970s in exactly the same manner).

but take heart (and ignore the irony of a group that hasn't historically been too fond of "traditional" marriage).

supposedly, God suddenly revealed that, guess what, polygamy is bad. so they changed their ways. and then, boom! in the 1970s, God suddenly revealed that black people aren't bad, and can now be priests.

i eagerly await the Godly revelation in 20 years that says, boom! gays are people too.

i anticipate that many who oppose equal rights will be embarrassed by their stances 20 years from now. heck, perhaps in 10 years.
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Old 10-29-2008, 06:57 PM   #469
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You know what, Irvine, I am not reading anything else you say until you acknowledge how damn funny my Yankees line is.
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Old 10-29-2008, 07:46 PM   #470
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You do mean a Nov 4 ballot measure that would re-affirm the will of the citizens of California, right?

If you mean institutionalize discrimination in the Constitution and dammit why didn't Mississippians think of that 40 years ago, then yes.
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Old 10-30-2008, 12:14 AM   #471
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You know what, Irvine, I am not reading anything else you say until you acknowledge how damn funny my Yankees line is.


as a Red Sox fan, and a current Phillies sympathizer, i did appreciate it.

thank you.
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Old 10-30-2008, 01:50 AM   #472
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i anticipate that many who oppose equal rights will be embarrassed by their stances 20 years from now. heck, perhaps in 10 years.
No, I don't think so. What I think will happen is many will tell everyone and even convince themselves that they have always believed in and even voted for equal rights.
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Old 10-30-2008, 06:10 AM   #473
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I'm going to raise my daughter to think of the gays the same way she thinks of the yankees; being one doesn't make you evil, it just means that you should switch teams as quick as possible.
missed you Dalton
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Old 10-30-2008, 06:13 AM   #474
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i eagerly await the Godly revelation in 20 years that says, boom! gays are people too.

i anticipate that many who oppose equal rights will be embarrassed by their stances 20 years from now. heck, perhaps in 10 years.

This reminds me of the daily show segment from a few months ago where Jon Stewart played clips of various congresspeople debating over don't ask don't tell, and several said we would look back X years in the future and be embarrassed by this.

Then Jon goes "Congress, always procrastinating. WHY WAIT? WHY NOT BE EMBARRASSED NOW????"
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Old 10-30-2008, 09:34 AM   #475
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I keep peeking into this thread, and reading what's been said since the last time I poked in.

But I never feel like I have anything to add because I simply cannot wrap my head around the idea that one group of people would give a hair on a rat's ass what a totally separate (and unrelated to them in any way) group of people do with their personal life.

And don't give me any of this religious "sanctity of marriage" bullshit. The church was totally against marriage until they suddenly decided they were for it. And besides, religion has nothing (or should have nothing) to do with government.

I just don't get it at all. It's like me trying to get people to stop picking their nose in their own home. Why would I give a shit what people do in their own homes?!

A person on another forum I read is worried about his kids being exposed to "the gay agenda" and turning gay because of it. Sorry, but if your kids are gay, no law is going to change that.

The last time I read the Declaration of Independence, it said we're all supposed to be equal, and I don't recall any disclaimers for sexual orientation.
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Old 10-30-2008, 11:40 AM   #476
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I keep peeking into this thread, and reading what's been said since the last time I poked in.

But I never feel like I have anything to add because I simply cannot wrap my head around the idea that one group of people would give a hair on a rat's ass what a totally separate (and unrelated to them in any way) group of people do with their personal life.

And don't give me any of this religious "sanctity of marriage" bullshit. The church was totally against marriage until they suddenly decided they were for it. And besides, religion has nothing (or should have nothing) to do with government.

I just don't get it at all. It's like me trying to get people to stop picking their nose in their own home. Why would I give a shit what people do in their own homes?!

A person on another forum I read is worried about his kids being exposed to "the gay agenda" and turning gay because of it. Sorry, but if your kids are gay, no law is going to change that.

The last time I read the Declaration of Independence, it said we're all supposed to be equal, and I don't recall any disclaimers for sexual orientation.



clearly, you're not thinking of the children.
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Old 10-30-2008, 12:38 PM   #477
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You do mean a Nov 4 ballot measure that would re-affirm the will of the citizens of California, right?
I didn't write that..but if it is "reaffirming" then I assume some previous vote was made by all citizens of CA regarding gay marriage and they voted against it?
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Old 10-30-2008, 12:53 PM   #478
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I didn't write that..but if it is "reaffirming" then I assume some previous vote was made by all citizens of CA regarding gay marriage and they voted against it?


there was a vote in 2000. it has since been ruled unconstitutional.
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Old 10-30-2008, 12:59 PM   #479
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there was a vote in 2000. it has since been ruled unconstitutional.
Thanks, I didn't know that.

So the will of the entire voting population of CA never changed in eight years then, I assume. And it doesn't matter that is was ruled unconstitutional.
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Old 10-30-2008, 01:12 PM   #480
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Thanks, I didn't know that.

So the will of the entire voting population of CA never changed in eight years then, I assume. And it doesn't matter that is was ruled unconstitutional.
Now the yes-on-8 bigots are comparing gays to hitler: (from yes-on-8 rally yesterday)

"There was another time in history when people, when the bell tolled. And the question was whether or not they were going to hear it. The time was during Nazi Germany with Adolf Hitler. You see he brought crowds of clergy together to assure them that he was going to look after the church.

And one of the members, bold and courageous, Reverend Niemand (sp?) made his way to the front and (inaudible) said "Hitler, we are not concerned about the church. Jesus Christ will take care of the church.

We are concerned about the soul of Germany." Embarrassed and chagrined, his peers quickly shuffled him to the back.

And as they did Adolf Hitler said, "The soul of Germany, you can leave that to me." And they did, and because they did bombs did not only fall upon the nation of Germany, but also upon the church and their testimony to this very day.

Let us not make that mistake folks. Let us hear the bell! Vote on Proposition 8!"
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