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Old 10-02-2004, 07:35 AM   #31
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Advertise as much as you like I could never get a hard on over another man - sexuality is pretty much hard wired.

One must remember that 50 years ago there may still have been the same frequency of gay individuals but they hid their sexuality and never "came out of the closet". The myth that somehow homosexuality is a new thing is just not true, it was there in Ancient Greece, it was there in the Victorian era and it is with us today - the percentage of individuals who have some degree of sexual attraction to the same sex is the same today as it ever was, only now it is practiced openly.

You are peddling the same crap that about gays as the church does. How many gay people do you know? Have they ever done anything to convert your to their sexual preference?

You treat homosexuality as if it were by definition a bad thing. What on earth is wrong with being gay?
Can you aknowledge that impressionable people will see homosexuality as 'cool' and acceptable and will therefore have a relationship with another man even though it is against his\her own nature?
I believe in some people, it is in their nature to be gay. I believe in some people, it is their nature to steal, or kill. There are flaws in our nature, even though we are born with them, it doesn't make it okay. No we are NOT all born equal, that's the biggest load of shit I've heard. Now, I think that the idea of a man having a sexual relationship with another man is sickening. It is a flaw in their human nature. This goes against the moral fibres in my body and no matter what, it can't be changed. (this is directed to the genuine homosexuals, not to the converted one's. If you don't think a person who is not actually gay can't be converted to homosexuality in this day and age, ignore what I am saying.)
It's midnight, I'm going to bed....
Cheers
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Old 10-02-2004, 07:35 AM   #32
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More gay men = less competition when getting a girl.
Maybe the fear is: More gay women = less girls to get?
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Old 10-02-2004, 07:37 AM   #33
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But we all know that gay women are ugly so it is just making the choice better
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Old 10-02-2004, 07:43 AM   #34
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I have to say that I'm with A_Wanderer on this one. You either are or you aren't or you're doing it because it's the hip thing to do. You don't "turn" anything.



Did you even read my comment?



Hardly, as it was you yourself who brought up that the human purpose, apparently, is to procreate.

I am intending on not procreating. I am also not a straight woman in the sense that I find men and only men attractive. Therefore I may quite easily choose to spend the rest of my life with a woman I love. So I see the relevance of this.



Personally, I'd rather read a logically constructed argument based on someones belief system than them trying to promote the agenda of an ideology they don't personally believe in.

[You're an atheist therefore you do not believe. That simple.]


I said that Christianity and I share a similar moral and ethical grounding on the issue. And any other references to God (eg. Adam and Eve) are done to help me understand as to why you disagree with the teachings of Christianity, which I imagine many of you are Christians.

And no, the off topic bit was regarding the containment of babies, (ie. MARS lol), not procreation itself!
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Old 10-02-2004, 07:47 AM   #35
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But we all know that gay women are ugly so it is just making the choice better
Actually I have seen many gay women, both in real life and in the form of video (oh comeon, stop lying to yourself!). A fairly mixed bag I'd say. You get the obese short blonde hair dykes who ride harley's, and then you get the slim very attractive gay porn stars, whom I have no problem with
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Old 10-02-2004, 07:52 AM   #36
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Gay porn stars indiciative of the wider gay community?

Lets get back to reality here, people are people. Why should somebody be treated worse because of sexual preference. It is illogical, especially if one comes from the perspective that God does not exist and therefore does not command one how to live.

You may be sickened to your stomach at the thought of there being gay relationships, but that is your own issue to deal with, and I suggest that you do. I mean seriously, people living their lives the way that they want to in a way that doesnt harm anybody. What the hell is wrong with that?
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Old 10-02-2004, 08:06 AM   #37
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It all comes down to where you stand morally\ethically. If you think it is totally acceptable and nothing will change your mind, don't worry about it. I was just outlining why I disagree with it, and I said why I am morally\ethically opposed.
Seeing as that many of you are Christian, I was using examples of your God's teachings and how you can discard them, that's why I involved Christianity.
And yes, there are so many inequalities in this world, and most of the time, it's no use thinking you can iron the whole thing out. In the case of homosexuality, it is better to let them go without the right of marriage, rather than let them immorally marry eachother IMO. I just drew up a cost-benefit analysis, and it makes sense to me.
Anyway, it looks like it's impossible to convince any of you folk so goodnight.
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Old 10-02-2004, 08:09 AM   #38
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I am not going to change your mind, and saying anything extreme wouldn't either. Given enough time you will come to reconcile your views properly - although I dearly hope that you come to understand the reasonable path on such matters.

Now if you were opposed to gay marriage on the basis that they would be getting government benefits ususally associated with child rearing, well then I may be inclined to agree - but this, it is illogical hatred.
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Old 10-02-2004, 08:16 AM   #39
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Okay just quickly, can anyone see a problem in the future with gay couples having an equal spread in the community like straight couples? Say there's a 50\50 spread, can anyone see that there is something very wrong here.....? I personally don't want to live in that society, but it seems that will happen with the way things are going now. But by the sounds of it, you people are okay with this Please share.
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Old 10-02-2004, 08:26 AM   #40
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Sexuality is not so much a choice. It is a mess of behaviour and neurochemicals interplaying with eachother. Or as I said before you cannot change peoples sexuality, you yourself show an attitude of "it sickens me" towards such behaviour. No doubt that is the natural response and why no guy in their right mind would flip to be gay.

There can be no 50/50 spread because those so inclined are 10% of the population at large, tops. The concept that people will en masse "convert" to being gay because its so damn cool is flawed because the vast majority of people are attracted to the opposite sex and only some people are attracted to the same sex.

As I said the number of gay people, or more accurately the proportion, has not increased. All that has changed is the number who are open about their sexuality.

I am not some wishy-washy bleeding heart, I am just a man who believes society must move beyond such petty hatreds to make things better. There is a threat out there that is full of malice and desires to murder us all - they also reserve special punishments for homosexuals, it involves a red hot poker. If we truly want to craft a peace with justice then lets start showing some at home. Gays are people too, there is no logical reason to hate gays or presume that society will go to hell because a small proportion of society has gone from being a subculture to being more mainstream.

I am not going to change your mind. But I think that your belief is founded on irrational hatred and not reason. You will not have your mind changed by a message board, only by living your life the way that you want to may you understand why that is such an important thing - something that nobody should be denied in a free society. This is all about freedom, in this case sexual freedom. Can you as an individual dictate your will to society in regards to something that does not hurt anybody, is that right? Is that just?
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Old 10-02-2004, 08:31 AM   #41
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Old 10-02-2004, 08:33 AM   #42
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I

Now if you were opposed to gay marriage on the basis that they would be getting government benefits ususally associated with child rearing, well then I may be inclined to agree - but this, it is illogical hatred.
Illogical hatred? Who's hating anybody?! I never even made any indication that I HATE homosexuals. People always do this to me, they assume because I disagree with something, that I HATE whatever\whomever is concerned. Now THAT is illogical!
As for my discontent with homosexuals, it is hardly illogical. I am firmly morally opposed to the issue. And the issue of converted gay people as a result of the media\gay rights, is a seperate issue, which I believe is downright wrong as I have tried to explain before.
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Old 10-02-2004, 08:37 AM   #43
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Saying that what they are doing is inherently morally wrong is a little over the top isn't it?

I mean what morality code are they violating.

Generally by marching full steam ahead on a platform of "converting" innocent people to being gay and there being a massive gay mafia controlling the media as well as homosexuality being immoral you are being, and I really hate to use the word, homophobic.
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Old 10-02-2004, 08:42 AM   #44
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Originally posted by AussieU2fanman

'Introducing a virus?' I couldn't agree more with that comment.

Let's try and have a civilized debate if you like.
Thankyou.
Can you even begin to grasp how offensive that is?

Civilised indeed.
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Old 10-02-2004, 08:50 AM   #45
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Sexuality is not so much a choice. It is a mess of behaviour and neurochemicals interplaying with eachother. Or as I said before you cannot change peoples sexuality, you yourself show an attitude of "it sickens me" towards such behaviour. No doubt that is the natural response and why no guy in their right mind would flip to be gay.

There can be no 50/50 spread because those so inclined are 10% of the population at large, tops. The concept that people will en masse "convert" to being gay because its so damn cool is flawed because the vast majority of people are attracted to the opposite sex and only some people are attracted to the same sex.

As I said the number of gay people, or more accurately the proportion, has not increased. All that has changed is the number who are open about their sexuality.

I am not some wishy-washy bleeding heart, I am just a man who believes society must move beyond such petty hatreds to make things better. There is a threat out there that is full of malice and desires to murder us all - they also reserve special punishments for homosexuals, it involves a red hot poker. If we truly want to craft a peace with justice then lets start showing some at home. Gays are people too, there is no logical reason to hate gays or presume that society will go to hell because a small proportion of society has gone from being a subculture to being more mainstream.

I am not going to change your mind. But I think that your belief is founded on irrational hatred and not reason. You will not have your mind changed by a message board, only by living your life the way that you want to may you understand why that is such an important thing - something that nobody should be denied in a free society. This is all about freedom, in this case sexual freedom. Can you as an individual dictate your will to society in regards to something that does not hurt anybody, is that right? Is that just?
But if you say homosexuality is okay, what does it matter if 50% of couples are gay? By your logic, 99% of couples can be gay and it wouldn't offend you at all because being gay is 'okay.' Trust me, if trends continue, you will see an astronomical number, maybe not as large as 50%, but very large.

I definately believe that straight people, without flaws in their nature to become gay, CAN become gay due to conditioning. Sexuality can be as malleable as a piece of rubber. Just like our sexual preferences for different partners can change for whatever reason, our sexual preferences in regards to the opposite sex can change, as is evident with my cousin, it can be done via the media\social acceptance which is a gigantic influence. My cousin addmitted he was 'converted' to homosexuality for such reasons. He wouldn't lie about that I can assure you.
Also, straight people can see being gay as 'cool' and just become a homosexual even though they are not actually gay. I won't need to give examples of that, surely people agree?
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