So, has there ever been a successful US supported/installed government?

[V Nura]

successful governments are historically rare...you just can't go around sayig that US installed ones never worked



How many coups did we have it eh 90's alone?

now..I'm not advocating some of the moves the CIA has done in the past..


But I do believe getting hussien out will be teh best thing for the iraqi ppl. .....if we can get a resolution to do it.

 

[martha]

Ok, fine. Who ya got to replace him? Anyone committed to democracy?

And ALL the examples our fine Interferencers came up with that are democracies have been from WW2. Nothing modern yet that wasn't just more torture and crap.


None of you have named one YET!

I just can't believe that Bush has some magic wand that any other president from the last four decades hasn't been able to use. If you want Saddam out, fine, but please let's not say that it's for the good of the citizens of Iraq.

 

[Zooropa]

OK, someone here has got to know (Melon?)... What is the deal w/ Grenada? I know they are a Democracy, and the US aided in throughing out a Communist government that had seized power in 82/83. Are they ligit?

 

[martha]

I think melon and the others have abandoned this thread. But we'll wait for some info on Grenada.

*taps foot*

*hums Jeopardy theme song*

 

[diamond]

For Martha-


Wednesday February 19, 2003
The Guardian

Extracts of a letter sent to Tony Blair from Iraqi exiles in the UK:
On behalf of the 350,000 Iraqi exiles in the UK, we thank you for your honesty and determination at this critical time and urge you to continue to listen to ordinary Iraqi men and women. We pray you will stick to your resolve to liberate our country from a tyranny which over the past 30 years has killed nearly 2 million people.

We have suffered enough. If we had the means to overthrow this tyrant we would not hesitate. However, whenever we have tried, we have suffered a terrible revenge. We cannot take any more mass killings. Nor the execution of thousands of politicians, scientists and army officers. The groundless jailing and torture, which includes cutting out tongues and decapitation of women, is an affront to civilisation.

The anti-war coalition offers no alternative, and can only be construed as supporting Saddam Hussein. The last thing any civilised person would want to see is war. However, we do want Saddam Hussein and his vile regime removed. The people of Iraq should be given a chance to form their own democratic government after the liberation of Iraq.

these citizens want him out....

 

[Zooropa]

OK, this is what I found so far Martha, although the arguement opined here certainly goes with your line of thinking, with witch I respectfully disagree. That being said....

"Among the major powers, the US has engaged in the largest number of regime changes. Since the past century, it has deployed its military to impose democratic rule in foreign lands on 18 occasions. Yet this impressive record of international activism has left an uninspiring legacy. Of all the regimes the US has replaced with force, democratic rule has been sustained in only five places - Germany, Japan, Italy, Panama, and Grenada. This suggests a success rate of less than 30 percent. Outside the developed world and Latin America, there hasn't been a single success."


The rest of the article can be found here:

http://www.ceip.org/files/Publications/2003-01-15minxin.asp?from=pubdate

 

[V Nura]

Alo if you look at the legacy of the british empire..they may have left lasting governments...but at what cost


they had laready decimated the cultures they had occupied and raped the countries of their resources.



If I had to pick...I'd rather have a democratic regime installed fail than be responsible for essentially crippling a good portion of the world.


I dont' see what is wrong with doing this if there is a un resolution to back it up.

 

[martha]

If I had to pick...I'd rather have a democratic regime installed fail than be responsible for essentially crippling a good portion of the world.

Ask the folks who lived with Pinochet about this.

 

[martha]

The people of Iraq should be given a chance to form their own democratic government after the liberation of Iraq.

I'd love it if this had a remote chance of happening, but look back. As I said, the track record of this for the US is abysmal. The US usually supports the people who will do the bidding of the US and its corporations. Frequently, these people don't favor free speech and democratic practices.

 

[Scarletwine]

I agree. The gov't we've put in Afganistan is also failing miserably. Even the nation news is now reporting that we may never be able to leave. In Iraq, who gets to be in charge, the Kurds or the Shiites?