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Old 08-11-2007, 05:16 AM   #46
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Originally posted by 2861U2
But we live in a capitalist society. Taking away money from rich people and legitimate companies is not the way to solve the problems.
I'm going to play "devil's advocate" for a second. Didn't Jesus say, "sale all your jewelery and give it to the poor"? Why is it that you push for certain Biblical teachings in government but not others?
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Old 08-11-2007, 06:21 AM   #47
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She wants to steal money from companies. She must think the government is entitled to take whatever it wants. She wants to repeal our tax cuts. She wants to take away from the rich and give to the "common good." That is socialism, and I dont like it. Maybe you guys all do.
Honestly this is just some messed up paranoia

I don't understand it at all....companies should have some social responsibility...socialism does not mean communism...do you consider all of Europe's democracies to be commies?

No one wants to live in a completely socialist country...there is a happy medium you know...socialism does not mean the end of private property, the loss of free markets...everyone becoming poor because of the state...it is idiocy to think so.

People here still work hard to better themselves, even with higher taxes than in the states...it is one of the greatest falsehoods of the right, where would the incentive to work be, if taxes were higher? Unless Americans are inherently lazier than Europeans which I sincerely doubt, I don't think anyones attitude to work would change.
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Old 08-11-2007, 08:49 AM   #48
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Originally posted by 2861U2


Well, she seems to be running with a "I'm my own woman" demeanor. Why do you think all her bumper stickers say "Hillary" while everyone else's say the last name? I think she is trying to, to a degree, distance herself from Bill, or at least his presidency of the 90s. So I call her Mrs. Clinton just to acknowledge her Clinton-ness.

Rush does the same

She IS her "own woman", with her own identity that is not just the wife of Bill Clinton. She was Mrs. Clinton when she was first lady, now she's a Senator and running for President. So as far as trying to distance herself, I think she is merely asserting her own identity which is every woman's right- single or married.

It's easy to figure out why Rush does that.
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Old 08-11-2007, 10:49 AM   #49
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Originally posted by 2861U2


I shall answer. Sorry I didnt answer immediately, melon. Some people have better things to do on Friday nights than hang out on Interference.

Quote from Mrs Clinton: "The other day, the oil companies reported the highest profits in the history of the world. I want to take those profits, and I want to put them into a strategic energy fund."

She wants to steal money from companies. She must think the government is entitled to take whatever it wants. She wants to repeal our tax cuts. She wants to take away from the rich and give to the "common good." That is socialism, and I dont like it. Maybe you guys all do.
Learn your politics!

That "stealing" is called taxation, and giving to the common good is called solidarity.
This is done in about 90 per cent of the "Western world".

Socialism is when your own car is common good.
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Old 08-11-2007, 10:53 AM   #50
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Originally posted by BonoVoxSupastar


I'm going to play "devil's advocate" for a second. Didn't Jesus say, "sale all your jewelery and give it to the poor"?
Yes, and I'm more than happy to donate to some charities, but I dont want the government forcing people or companies to give to the "common good". Charity, as nice and generous as it is, is a voluntary act. It shouldnt be forced to happen. I dont want people taking my money (or anyone else's) and spending it elsewhere for me, as much as I can help it (i.e. dont raise taxes like she would)
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Old 08-11-2007, 11:19 AM   #51
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Originally posted by 2861U2
I shall answer. Sorry I didnt answer immediately, melon. Some people have better things to do on Friday nights than hang out on Interference.
Except that martha's question wasn't written on "Friday night"; it was written during the day while you were here writing about vast left-wing conspiracies, and you ever so conveniently left after that was asked.

You also have a history of not answering many questions. So cut out the dramatics.

Quote:
She wants to steal money from companies. She must think the government is entitled to take whatever it wants. She wants to repeal our tax cuts. She wants to take away from the rich and give to the "common good." That is socialism, and I dont like it. Maybe you guys all do.
Then I hope you write your congressmen, pushing for the repeal of government-funding of "faith-based charities," because money is "stolen" to fund those.

And, as far as I'm concerned, you know nothing about "socialism," except in how to use it as a derogatory word for policies that you perceive as "leftist." Because what you describe is not "socialism," but, instead, the nature of government.

Additionally, unless you like America's national security being determined by unsavory foreign nations, we need to have a sustainable tax base. As it stands, we are borrowing heavily from foreign governments. Why can't we tackle nations like China for things like human rights violations and currency manipulation? Because they happen to hold very large USD currency reserves, and they've flat out threatened to trigger such a large sell-off as to heavily devalue our currency. Why can't we tackle Saudi Arabia for being a nation of fanaticism? Similar reasons; they have over $1 trillion invested here.

As far as I see it, all you "tax cut" fanatics are living in la la land. You want a strong government, but you don't want to pay for it--and national polls consistently indicate this. Compared to other Western nations, we pay very little in taxes--yet if you listen to all the wingnuts out there, you'd think that we're still being robbed. All the while, we have a crumbling national infrastructure, from aging bridges, sewers and dams, an expensive but never-ending war with amorphous "goals" that are questionable as to whether they can be met, a large national population with questionable education and skills, meaning that they're especially vulnerable to corporate outsourcing and downsizing, etc. And all you are worried about are your goddamn "tax cuts." I've never known one single rich person ever go poor from paying taxes, and I doubt that will change. So quit bitching.
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Old 08-11-2007, 11:24 AM   #52
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Quote:
Originally posted by BonoVoxSupastar
I'm going to play "devil's advocate" for a second. Didn't Jesus say, "sale all your jewelery and give it to the poor"? Why is it that you push for certain Biblical teachings in government but not others?
Because, for the dominant hegemony (rich white heterosexual Protestants, in the case of the U.S.), religion is a tool for subordination of "minorities," in addition to being the tool to prop up their own power and supremacy.

In other words, when it deals with the lifestyles and behaviors of themselves, "those Bible passages aren't important." When it deals with condemning outsiders, "they will go to Hell for ignoring the Bible."

This is consistent with most "Christian organizations" in America, as they are merely mouthpieces for politically conservative ideology. When it comes to leftist ideology, such as the condemnation of the death penalty, all of a sudden, "this isn't important." Yet, when it comes to conservative ideology, such as abortion, they're ready to excommunicate any liberal Christian that disagrees with them.

That is the reason why certain Biblical precepts are pushed in the government sphere, but not others: because it's self-serving.
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Old 08-11-2007, 11:43 AM   #53
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Originally posted by 2861U2


Yes, and I'm more than happy to donate to some charities, but I dont want the government forcing people or companies to give to the "common good". Charity, as nice and generous as it is, is a voluntary act. It shouldnt be forced to happen. I dont want people taking my money (or anyone else's) and spending it elsewhere for me, as much as I can help it (i.e. dont raise taxes like she would)
oh, stop bringing logic and reading comprehension into this.......
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Old 08-11-2007, 11:52 AM   #54
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Originally posted by hawkman
oh, stop bringing logic and reading comprehension into this.......
By all means, bring it in. I'm still waiting for it.

All I've seen in this thread about "Mrs. Clinton," so far, are fearmongering stereotypes of "liberals." When conservatives are ready to argue their side coherently, backed up with evidence that can be quantified (Biblical "mythic speech" doesn't count, because, by definition, it cannot be argued), and free of histrionics, I'm always interested in a thread like that.

But that's the problem. Most conservatives "arguments" aren't up for reasonable debate, because they're usually based on what I'd call "passionate stereotypes." I mean, after all, who needs the facts when you have conviction? If you or anyone doesn't like a "liberal argument," then for fuck's sake, come up with an argument of your own, rather than doing the usual job of cutting and pasting articles from unreliable sources (i.e., conservative pundits) or spouting off unsubstantiated nonsense. Because this thread? It's nothing but unsubstantiated nonsense.
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Old 08-11-2007, 12:07 PM   #55
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You must be one rich sonofabitch, man

Quote:
Originally posted by 2861U2


She wants to take things away from me on behalf of the common good.


Quote:
Originally posted by 2861U2


She wants to steal money from companies. .... She wants to repeal our tax cuts.
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Old 08-11-2007, 12:08 PM   #56
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They're all hypocrites no one better than the other.
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Old 08-11-2007, 12:17 PM   #57
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Originally posted by melon


Because this thread? It's nothing but unsubstantiated nonsense.
You know, you dont have to respond to it if you think it is a waste of time.

Oh, and your religion post a few posts ago- I feel sorry for you if that is how you think. It was way off, but I'm sure you know that.
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Old 08-11-2007, 12:39 PM   #58
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Originally posted by 2861U2
You know, you dont have to respond to it if you think it is a waste of time.
Let me make this clear:

I don't give a rat's ass whether you and I agree or not. But I will not, under any circumstances, "respect" conservative opinions for the sake of being "different." As I see it, you have to "earn" my respect, which involves writing coherent, substantiated posts. I can "respect" an opinion, if I consider it to be well-written and well-thought out, even if I vehemently disagree with it!

Quote:
Oh, and your religion post a few posts ago- I feel sorry for you if that is how you think. It was way off, but I'm sure you know that.
Let this here be a prime example of what I'm talking about.

1) Why do "feel sorry" for me?
2) What, in particular, did I write to made you "feel sorry" for me?
3) Why is it "way off"?
4) Why are you "sure I know that"?

For fuck's sake, say something substantive! Anything!!
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Old 08-11-2007, 12:58 PM   #59
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Originally posted by melon



1) Why do "feel sorry" for me?
2) What, in particular, did I write to made you "feel sorry" for me?
3) Why is it "way off"?
4) Why are you "sure I know that"?

For fuck's sake, say something substantive! Anything!!
1) I feel sorry for you if that is your take on religion and most, if not all Christians. It must suck going through life so angry and so ill-informed.

2) Your entire religion post about 6 posts up. All of it.

3) It is way off. Religion is a tool? Why do you say that. You say that due to your hatred of right-wing Christians like myself.

Your second paragraph- I never said any Bible passages werent important. Perhaps you should calm down and actually read my posts. What I said was I dont want Hillary or government taking my money forcefully. Charity to whatever organization should be a choice.

Your third paragraph- also off. You have nothing to back up your hate. As far as myself is concerned, I do not wish to excommunicate any liberal Christian who is pro-choice. Your first statement- do you really think every Christian organization in the United States is supported only for political reasons? Your obviously know nothing about religion, melon. Does my church hold services every Sunday to ultimately get a Republican elected in 2008? That is absurd, and that is what you make it sound like.

4) I find it hard to believe anyone actually thinks the way you do, regarding your religion post. Maybe I'm wrong.

Religion drives people's live, and every aspect of it. Everything I do, I try to do for and through God. I dont use it as a "tool" or to advance whatever power or position I would ever get in my life.

Generalizations
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Old 08-11-2007, 12:59 PM   #60
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Originally posted by 2861U2


Generalizations


I can't wait till you turn in your first paper in college.
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